Return the pup. The older ones have priority and introducing a male is causing issues with the bitches.
Hard, I know but that's what I would do.

 

I don't think the breeder will take the pup back.

But I have plenty of room to separate the females and hoped to have a litter puppies with male before I have him fixed.

Do you think if the male was removed the females would stop fighting.

 

A breeder who is breeding quality dogs will usually take them back from you if it's not working out.

Where did you get the male? For what purpose are you planning to breed him?

 

Thanks for getting back to me.

I just thought it would be fun to have one litter.

Do you know if separating the females and keeping the male with one female would work. My plan was to have one litter and then have the females and male spayed and neutered.

I have a few friends that would like a gsd so I thought I would give a litter a try.

I didn't know I was opening a can of worms.

I have plenty of room for three dogs and now have the two females separated I am just worried about them accidentally making contact again and getting into a fight.

I was going to build a kennel as soon as the weather improves. Guess I should have got the kennel built first..

 

I just thought it would be fun to have one litter.

Fun? For the female your planning on breeding, does she have any health testings; like for DM, ED, and HD? IMO I would see no reason to breed the dogs if they don't have any testings, or if they didn't pass them.

 

Responsible breeders are those that breed health and temperament tested dogs, to better the breed. Otherwise, breeding serves no purpose other than to create more dogs the world doesn't have enough people to care for.

Plenty of purebred dogs out there dying daily in shelters from people out there breeding for the wrong reasons... shoving their pets together, looking to make some money gouging for "AKC registered" dogs.

 

Thank you.

 

Well...there are major health risks to your female when giving birth. Has she had any health testing at all? Any training? Is she titled?
If the birth goes wrong and you end up with a girl that dies, or is a bad momma, or can't feed her babies, are you prepared to bottle feed round the clock and care for 6-12 puppies for the next 8 weeks? If you have three friends that SAY they want a puppy, what do you plan to do with the remaining puppies? Try and sell them in the newspaper? With no health testing and no titles you aren't likely to get much...if you can't sell them, are you going to keep them forever? Or are you going to drop them off at a shelter?

Do you have the facilities to care for a litter of puppies properly? They are a peeing, pooping, chewing, crying monsters. You are talking about taking on up to twelve additional dogs for a minimum of 8 weeks. That's a lot of poop.
And a lot of puppy kibble. And a fortune in puppy toys. What about worming and vet exams for the babies?

Are you aware of the cost to do a cesarean? Do you have a friend who can help get a stuck puppy out?

I would give the boy back and spay your girls...if your friends really want a GSD they can go to a responsible breeder who guarantees the health of the puppies and breeds for a good reason, to make great dogs that will be awesome pets and working animals. puppies are cute, and I get wanting to breed your princess and continue her genetics...but either get really educated and breed a health certified, titled dog with something to offer the GSD community...or don't do it.

 

Not trying to be rude honestly.. but, what are YOUR intentions of breeding your two females? To better the breed? Because of your friends? Or to just make the extra money?

 

I didn't know I mentioned the females were not titled and not tested...... The are !!!

As is the male..

All of a sudden I am an evil person for wanting to have a litter of pups..

Sorry I even brought this up... I was just looking for some advice on keeping the females from fighting..

Thanks Anyway...

 

What titles do they hold? Are they working? What have you health tested for?

You may think this is not important, you may think we are being "mean" for not supporting you to breed your PETS, but as owners and lovers of this breed, we honestly can't encourage creation of poor-quality animals.

Please tell me, what valuable purpose would it serve?

 

How can your 12 week old male puppy be titled and health tested?

 

10 week

 

Okay

OK..I tried to be nice but I guess that doesn't work...

I'll breed one of my GS's and if you don't like it...TOO BAD..

What a bunch of arrogant, selfserving people.

I just asked for some help and all I got was rude, condescending commets.

What, you don't like someone having a litter of pups because your not making 2 or 3 thousand dollars a dog.

 

OK..I tried to be nice but I guess that doesn't work...

I'll breed one of my GS's and if you don't like it...TOO BAD..

What a bunch of arrogant, selfserving people.

I just asked for some help and all I got was rude, condescending commets.

What, you don't like someone having a litter of pups because your not making 2 or 3 thousand dollars a dog.

Are you kidding me? Who's the self serving one? The one breeding unproven animals for their own GREED, or the people who care about the health and temperaments of dogs and the future of the GSD? No intelligent person is going to pay "3 thousand" for a backyard bred dog. Good luck lol.

Not like you care obviously, hope it's worth it. Join the list of irresponsible greeders out there... shame on you. People like you are the reason so many of us have rescues with lifelong issues we are going to have to manage. Greed and selfishness.

 

Good luck having two females and a sexually mature male. That'll be fun. You'll be choosing which one to breed simply by which one doesn't kill the other.

And I'm not kidding- you're creating a disaster and you don't have the knowledge or experience to properly deal with it. If you're insistent on breeding your pets, and it sounds like you are no matter how many experienced people tell you it's a bad idea, then find a stud. You're not likely to be able to find one (at least a quality dog) without OFA ratings and some sort of title on your female, but you can try. But the situation you're creating now isn't going to lead to much more than a crappy life for all three dogs at best, or a serious situation at worst... you're not equipped to deal with this. Return the puppy, get your females health tested (and that does not mean checked by a vet, it means hips and elbows rated, eyes, DM, etc etc etc), and get some sort of third party evaluation of temperament. There really is a reason those things are important.

 

Aside from the breeding issue........

As the owner of two females myself... why can a male not be added to two existing females? Is this based on the personality of the females? Why would this cause them to fight if there were no issues before?

 

The puppy just disturbed the status quo. It's the owners responsibility to control the situation and teach the dogs.

We have 3 females. Two fight. They hadn't in months until we added my boy. So bring them all back to sanity and manage the situation.

And we don't have enough information to really determine what may have started the fight. Maybe one is resource guarding the puppy. Who knows what caused the fight.

 

Every single pup that my female will have has been spoken for...

I never said I was getting $3000.00 a pup. You need to read what I posted.

As far as health is concerned..I have seen breeders selling dogs they know have problems for $2000.00 plus dollars. Inbreeding their own animals until they are so bad the poor dogs can't walk and die within 12 months. ALL FOR MONEY....TALK ABOUT GREED..

Why don't you go after those breeders...Breeding litter after litter after litter and selling the dogs to people who just want a GS..

It's alot easier to go after someone like me instead of a so called professional breeder.. RIGHT !!!!!!!!!!!!

 

"What, you don't like someone having a litter of pups because your not making 2 or 3 thousand dollars a dog."

Oh, I'm sorry, you're right. You said you're MAKING 2-3k a dog. So what do you plan on selling these "quality" animals for, if that's your margin?

Sorry, I don't need to use my animal's reproductive organs for profit. Not once, not ever. Greed is greed. The only breeders I consider of any value are those that put the time, effort, and money into proving that their dogs are worth breeding. Plenty of great ones out there, doing it for the right reasons.

PS... you bashed people breeding because "people want a GS"... wasn't that your reason too? Congrats, you really convinced me. Haha.

 

Thank You for the advice...It is appreciated..

 

No problem, Kimberly. Fighting females are not fun. I'll never have more than one in the house ever again.

 

No problem, Kimberly. Fighting females are not fun. I'll never have more than one in the house ever again.

So far I have not had any issues with my girls and they are together pretty much 24/7. I am pretty strict with them though in that what's mine is mine and what's theirs is mine if I chose it to be. LOL I have yet to see any guarding behavior with anything of value even when other animals (strays included) have been introduced. I hope and pray it continues this way and I do not have to deal with fighting females... LOL I imagine they get just as vicious in the animal world as they do in the human one...

 

So you want to breed your dogs?

Here is some food for thought.

Flowhart for deciding whether it should be done. If you can't pass this test you have no business breeding.
http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...rum/thinking-about-becoming-breeder/149386-should-i-breed-my-dog-flowchart.html

If I were you I would read every thread on this entire forum.

Pregnancy, Whelping & Raising a Litter - German Shepherd Dog Forums

I'm not a breeder but my understanding is that the path is difficult, risky for your bitch, and EXPENSIVE. You don't seem to be deterred by the risk this process presents to your bitch so maybe the financial angle is enough to deter you.

I also don't see you answering the question of whether you are willing to commit to taking care of a whole bunch of dogs for 10+ years. You may not be able to find homes for all of them. What if someone wants to return a dog? Or you find our a dog you bred is being abused? Will you be responsible for those dogs? Think about that. It's a huge commitment if you have any ethics and actually care about dogs. If you don't really care then you are a just another evil backyard breeder and part of the problem.

The reason you are getting such a negative reaction is that most people just do not understand what they are getting into when they breed. A BIG part of the genetic problems that GSDs suffer is from amateurs that don't know what they are doing and breed because they think its "fun". Get real pal. This isn't a "fun" game. Its' serious business with lives at stake. Please treat it that way and you might find some respect on this board.

 

"This isn't a "fun" game. Its' serious business with lives at stake".

I never said it was a game and if this is so serious why don't you go after the breeders that breed these dogs with known serious health problems instead of attacking me.

Maybe if there were breeders out there having healthly dogs the people I know would not ask me for a pup. PAL....

By the way, I bred Brittanys 35 years ago..

 

You have said this twice now. How, exactly, would one "go after" irresponsible breeders? As long as they are not committing animal abuse/cruelty then I don't see any legal way to do so. Maybe Luca Brasi could help. Or people like me could deter people that are planning on becoming an irresponsible breeder.

As to your second point, your friends need to do a bit more research. There are plenty of responsible breeders out there producing healthy dogs. Post your location and the board can offer some recommendations.

 

Sorry Russ, you started a firestorm. There are many folks on here who are against what they call a backyard breeder. There are very strong opinions about it.

About your two females. I have two females. One is mine and one is my mother's. We did not plan to live together when we got the dogs from the same litter. But circumstances changed and the dogs started to live together. They were fine for about a month and then it was dog fight ****. Once they start fighting it is almost impossible to train out the "I hate your guts and want to kill you". We have to keep the dogs separated. My dog on my side of the house and her dog on her side of the house. Females are known to fight to the death. We are getting my mom's dog fixed today in a hope that it will change things. But the trainer has said once females decide to hate, it is forever. But it might work out for you, because part of the problem is one dog is mine and one is my mother's and we don't see eye to eye on how to deal with the dogs.

 

Russ G....as you can see, we are very very passionate about this breed. When you post that you want to breed because it will be 'fun' that will raise hackles. Breeding for fun isn't the right reason to breed. You have done hip/elbow/DM heart and eye tests? What titles do your bitches have? Do their pedigree's compliment this male puppy's? How do you know his strengths and weaknesses just yet to make that decision?
Breeding for the pet market and supplying pups to those that don't want to pay for a pup from a breeder that invests in their program is up to you. But please do more than supply puppies for people who ask you for a pup. Do it right and prove yourself as a breeder....because just having one litter makes you a breeder.

 

Oh, I forgot to ask what health testings you had done on your 12 week old male?

 

russ, until you get things under control, i think you are going to have to use crates and rotate time out of the crate to prevent fights and injury. there is a breeding section on the forum, maybe you can pick up some tips. also, if there are dog breeders near you, maybe one would take you on and be a mentor so informed decisions can be made in your breeding.

 

If there is blood between bitches, then it is probably never safe for them to run free together, whether you rehome the boy or not.

Increasing the time you spend with each training, etc. might help, but you have two bitches who are close in age. The chances are just not good that one will accept the other as the queen of sheba, like boys generally will.

I don't know what your best bet is. If you have one of your friends who loves your dogs and wants a puppy, well, maybe one of them would be just as happy with one of your females. I know that the resident dog comes first, but I doubt removing the puppy will help, and really, it will be better all around to have a female and a male, and no fights, if you have a friend that loves your dogs, that you feel happy with them taking one of them.

Breed your bitch and dog if you want to, it won't change the world. There is a lot to doing it right, more than health screenings. For instance, the chances that the tyke will grow into the dog that will be the best complement for the bitch you have are practically nil, because you have no idea what the tyke's strengths and weaknesses lie. No dog is perfect, and when we make breeding decisions, we should be looking at the dogs in front of us as well as what is behind them. But having a litter out of your bitch is not going to change the GSD world. If you are set on doing this, do it.

I think most of the people here realize that if everyone who toys with the idea of breeding their pup does it, we will have an enormous problem. And they are trying to dissuade you from doing it. They are right, too. But the choice is really yours. And hopefully in the years it takes the little guy to grow up, you will use it as an opportunity to learn everything there is to know about the breed, health problems common in the breed, genetics, training, nutrition. Because when the tykes you produce go to their new homes, those people will come to you with issues and for help.

Welcome to the board.

 

It is rare to have females who accept each other. I have had several - and I have had females who cannot be loose with another female...even if it is her mother.

You must separate them.

I assume your females are mature - you say they are titled ? If so, then why buy a puppy and have to wait 2 years or more to breed him? There are many many titled males out there standing at stud whose owners will breed a titled female....

Having puppies from one of the females will probably upset the balance of peace even more solidly. Some people have raised females together only to have them decide one day to fight - and eventurally both are hurt so badly, breaking down doors to get at one another and it does not end well. I remember one lady on the old green GSD World Forum, where the aggressor almost killed her "sister", then when the injured one was locked in a bedroom, got into the room and savaged her again, to the point she had to be put down. The initiator was hurt as well, so the woman lost both dogs due to female aggression. Females fighting is NOT pretty and this is really NOT uncommon.

Lee

 

I was so disapointed yesterday with all the rude/negative commets I was never going to come back on this website, but I thought I would check back one more time.

I would like to thank the folks that posted suggestions and ideas that help instead of attacking me. Now I have some ideas how to solve these problems.

Thank You Again

 

I'm sorry you felt this way. You found us rude and negative and felt attacked. In your initial post, you said, "I screwed up!" Followed by: "I have read numerous articles about getting a male pup with two females, but I did so after getting the pup. I didn't think there would be any problem since the two females got along."

You didn't like the responses you received, yet they were given with the best of intentions. People with vast amounts of experience were offering the best advice they could. We have all made mistakes. We don't want to see others make the same mistakes we have, or the mistakes we have seen others make.

I hope you will go back and reread the posts. There is a ton of good advice there. You didn't figure out about the puppy, until it was too late. Don't allow yourself to get stuck in another bad situation. That is what we are trying to help you prevent - for your sake and the sake of your dogs.

 

let us know how you resolve this.