Is it Schutzhund tracking? The thing I noticed was nose work is timed and speed is important. In nose work, the dogs air scent to pick up odor. The handler moves quickly to assist the dog in a timed event.

Schutzhund tracking is an obedience exercise. The dog has to keep his head down and has to sniff every footprint. (No air scenting) The handler assists the dog to go slow and to keep its head down. Treats are put in the front part of the footprint as the track is laid.

My dog was not confused because they are so different.

Search and rescue tracking is different than Schutzhund--maybe you are doing that?

 

I actually started Paisley doing both at about the same time (just how it worked out). She had no problems doing them both. TJ did both for awhile too (but he didn't do NW classes - I just did it with him based on what I learned with Paisley). I got too busy with other sports to worry about NW, but I do hope to do it again at some point.

 

Okay thanks I had been concerned of any possible confusion or me confusing him between the two. Any books or videos recommend to get a better grasp on things as we learn.

 

Nose work update(smiley face) Max loves nose works and very focused on his searches. He is dog reactive and pays no attention to the dogs outside the gate. We are searching food paired with the scent of birch. It's interesting how the AC/heating vents/ temp in the room can affect the airflow and how the scent travels. How scent can collect in one spot throwing the dogs off. Last week we did our first vehicle search outside on a very windy day all the dogs did great- so exciting!!!
My daughter took some photos. Last photo was where the hide was -on the blk wire rack.

 

That looks like so much fun. I do a lot of "find it" games on our own so if those pics are what nose work is, I need to find a class near me.lol.

Are treats hidden or is it an article that your dog was allowed to sniff and then was hidden? Reason I ask is because Sonny now plays the find-it game just for the joy of playing it. No treats needed anymore.

Looks like Max has no problem keeping on task.

 

Heartandsoul- that's is how we started with the find it games and our kids hiding in the yard and woods they would be the prize! At Nose works you teach the dogs to detect - birch,clover and anise oils. First it's a treat they search for we used hotdogs.Then the treat is paired with a scented oil. Next just the oil. It is soooo much fun!!every week the instructor sets up different scenarios boxes, suitcases, pocketbooks, Pvc pipes, anything weird they may have to explore. At home I will leave a plate of food on floor as a distraction or his favorite ball/toy and he will pass them right up when on a scent.

There are also trials when ready to enter. Nose works at different levels 1 being the easiest nw1, nw 2 and nw 3. There are videos of nosework 1, nw 2 and nw3 trials on the link. You go in not knowing where the hide is and it is timed- 30 seconds. Any distractions - leg lifting marking spots your out. All the dogs are into it and it is cool to see how some of the different breeds work.! You should check it out.
https://www.nacsw.net/

 

Jenny, thanks for the link. Now I'm all excited! There are two different events less than an hrs drive from me. Sonny is doing really well in his classes for dog reactivity and I need a new something fun to do with him as his agilities trainer moved. Agilities really wasn't his "thing" anyways so your link is probably our next step in our growth together.

The events have a trainer I can contact for info about lessons. So excited! Thanks tons!

 

Typically, when a handler gets involved in detection work they become better tracking handlers. You learn to read the dog better, pay more attention to subtle cues and learn when the dog is "in odor." Tracking and nose work should not conflict at all, actually the nose work usually benefits the tracking work.

 

Here is the answer to my question on the other thread!!!

 

Did you start off doing NW at home or did you just start with a class?

 

Heart and soul- you will have so much fun it is a great bonding experience and a confidence builder. I knew max enjoyed his find it games, something I knew I always would enjoy and good confidence builder and good thing for dogs who are dog reactive to do. Can't wait to hear how you and Sonny like it!

Slamdunc- Aah yes now this makes so much sense. This makes me feel much better as I was told nose works is a good way to start before tracking but did not really know why thanks for the explanation. Now I will have a jump start in tracking which seems pretty detailed but don't no much about it. Good Stuff!!!

Mburitica181- . I knew Max would like it since we would always play find it games "find me" games with the kids. The kids would hide in the yard or trail in the woods and max would find them in seconds. He enjoyed these games so I knew he would enjoy doing something involving his nose. I knew I wanted to tracking even before we got Max when figuring how to keep our pup busy. A nose work class opened up first so we chose to do that first. I wasn't sure what it entailed and did not do anything special to prepare accept cook lots of hot dogs for his class. Max always liked to shove his big nose where it didn't belong it was- so nose work turned out to be perfect. It is interesting to see some dogs were so disciplined that if the hide was on a countertop or sometimes some kind of desk/table set up and the dogs were on a scent- they would not continue as they were trained to leave the counter top and table alone- no worries here of being over discliplined here-(smiley face)

 

Jenny, I'm so glad you started this thread! How long have you guys been doing this? My girl and I are in our second session of Nosework classes. She absolutely loves it, and so do I. It's been so beneficial in learning about my dog, learning about dogs in general and how to read them, and building the bond with my dog.

mburitica - I started with scent games at home: I started by hiding stinky treats while she was in a down-stay out of sight. Then I'd release her and she'd have to find them all. Later, I started putting a stinky treat in a teaball and hiding that. (It wasn't terribly challenging for her, but she enjoyed it.) I delayed putting her in a Nosework class because I just didn't have the time, but once we started, it became her favorite thing ever. We just moved to essential oils (still pairing with treats), and she's done well so far. I would love to trial her one day if we get to that level, but right now I am just happy to see her having fun. Added bonus is that you can really bond with the other people and dogs in your class. Our classes are very small and you get to know people well. It's been a fantastic experience all around.

 

Glad you enjoy it!!!! It is a great thing to do with your dog. Classes are slow moving but progress has not been hindered, we started in February/ March. We are working on just the oils birch now and pretty cool how the dogs no what to find. Max kept on looking at the blue box with all the scented oils on the counter but the hide was stuck on the wall under the ledge of the counter- he figured it out. Our last search was in the bathroom there another fun search. It's fun to move around. I registered max on thehttp://www.nacsw.net and received my little blue book. I also got my scent oil kit- so exciting!!!! Our class is fairly large but much fun. The trials are far away someone who has been doing this a awhile in class recently went said it was 8 hour day for four minutes not including sleep over and traveling time. Our instructor is trying to get a trial where we are and this will be awesome if that can happen I think she said sometime next year. I definately want to do the trial if close to home and already got my red lead and red scarf for dog reactive dogs. The trials are very controlled from what I hear. But we do it mostly for fun also. There are seminars they offer also at different locations which sounds very interesting to go to one.

 

Wow. There are multiple trials per year in the greater metro area where I live. I knew that it could be tough to get a spot at a trial, but I didn't really realize people had to travel so far just to trial. I want to volunteer at a trial and see what it's all about.

My class has 3 dogs. We started the foundation series with six but lost three. I hope we'll keep all three for the third set in the series, the other two dog/handler teams in our class are awesome. It sounds like your class is like ours: Progress slowly, challenge but don't push too hard, and build a solid foundation.

I need to do the registration with NACSW.

 

Wow. There are multiple trials per year in the greater metro area where I live. I knew that it could be tough to get a spot at a trial, but I didn't really realize people had to travel so far just to trial. I want to volunteer at a trial and see what it's all about.

My class has 3 dogs. We started the foundation series with six but lost three. I hope we'll keep all three for the third set in the series, the other two dog/handler teams in our class are awesome. It sounds like your class is like ours: Progress slowly, challenge but don't push too hard, and build a solid foundation.

I need to do the registration with NACSW.

My phone must refreshed 3-4 times I have to remember to select and copy. Yikes.

Seems to be very thourough process. 3 people you guys must get lots of searches. We have about 12+ people in our class and get two searches sometimes 3. Class is 3 hours long. Yesterday less people so we did a few searches. Yes volunteering at the trials - I hear is a great way to see what to expect. There are also nose works workshops coming up in a few weeks this ones happens to be where we train so close by I'm going to go without max to get more out of it. It sounds like fun and hoping to learn much. I since max is dog reactive I focus on him much and listen with one ear. We did vehicle searches outside- for the second time and other searches outside. There was a hide on the bumper of the van the wind was blowing from the west and max was climbing underneath the van under the bumper where the hide was directly above him. He was catching scent from the hide near a wheel well in back of the van. He figured it out but that was a tough one. The way he was carrying on I would of called it. I was getting worried he was going to get stuck under the van. I
The instructor said we are going on a field trip to do a search in another other place- so cool!!! It takes a few weeks to get your blue book and if you order a scent kit also takes a few weeks just to plan ahead. Check out if any nose work - workshops in your area I'm sure you will get tons of info from it.

 

Our second vehicle search outside and other outside searches. Max was extremely distracted and constant work to get him to focus on me while waiting our turn. When it was our turn he was in the good zone. He did contaminate an area outside he peed on a concrete wall. We were having a tough day. One thing is good if I say no pee he will listen but was a bit late on that one.

 

Scent kits are provided to us in class with a cost, so I already have one! I just need to get registered and get my girl registered so we can do an ORT when we are ready.

I know when a couple of trials are - I am going to try to make volunteering at one of them work because it sounds like I have opportunities that a lot of people will not get just by virtue of geography, and it would be silly to let that pass me by.

Our class is about 90 minutes and we get 3-4 searches. Each search is something a little different, so we get a brief overview and instructions prior to each round. I love having a small class - the closeness and camaraderie and more search time are all great - but one thing I would really enjoy about a bigger class is getting to see different types of dogs and their search behavior. Our original six were two GSDs, a bulldog mix, a lab, a pointer, and I'm forgetting what the sixth even was. We're down to one GSD, the lab, and the pointer. My instructor says our dogs are their breed first, when they get into the search area, and it's been interesting watching both the breed-specific behavior and the individual nuances each dog brings. (My shepherd does perimeter checks and moves her circles inward; she is also very thorough and leaves no area unchecked. The pointer does a very orderly back to front sweep. The lab is very much a "shortest distance between two points is a straight line" kind of dog who goes from Point A to B to C quickly.) But I'd love to get to observe smaller dogs, different mixes, different types.

 

Volunteering sounds like a great way to go I think is a great idea and was highly recommended. I'm glad you are enjoying it's nice to find people with same interests. Will be excited to see how you guys are doing!!!! The nose works clinics will also have a wide range of different breeds. Excited to go and sounds like fun. I would also like to volunteer as I get nervous. I think it would help me with that.

 

I wanted to come by and update. I was able to volunteer at a Nosework 1 trial, and it was SO MUCH FUN. It was neat to see the dogs that were a bit ahead of us. Next time I want to volunteer at a Nosework 2 or 3 and see dogs that are more experienced.

This trial had 40-some dogs of all different kinds. Two GSDs, the usual cadre of retrievers, some hounds, quite a few little dogs, and a surprising number of poodles (until I remembered that they were originally bred as hunting dogs). It was a really great opportunity to watch how different types of dogs approached hunting, and it was fun to watch as they tried to communicate with their handlers. I quickly identified two things that could be problematic as I thought about my own dog's body language relative to the dogs in the trial: 1) She's pretty subtle a lot of the time, so I'm going to have to really know how to read her, and 2) handler nerves are a huge factor. I saw so many dogs blatantly alerting and the handlers didn't see it, and I have to assume that was all nerves. At that level, a lot of them must be relatively new to the sport, and it might be their very first trial. I felt really lucky to get to volunteer/observe first, so at least now I have an idea of how the trials are structured.

 

We had a nose work II seminar held in our nose works class. Some people
brought their dogs to participate. I just sat in so I can actually give my full attention and get the most out of it. There were of course a few German shepherds, spaniels, boxer, Akita, lab , golden retriever,Doberman, bloodhound a small little dog who was the star. It was the first time I saw a blood hound on a scent and he covered the entire room including the walls it was if his whole body transformed into a big nose. As Slamdunc had mentioned the focus was on reading your dogs body language. The position you place your self is as important so as you can read your dogs body language and not be in the way. Also how your body language is picked also up by the dog.

There were a few dogs but one in particular who barely alerted when found a hide. It made it difficult for the owner to recognize their dog's alert as was very subtle. The instructor talked about "Timmy in the well" which how to reward the dog to get a stronger alert. When the dog alerts at the hide -it's important to continually reward the dog in the same spot where the hide was - using your hand as almost like a pez dispenser and most importantly reward only when the dog is looking down at where the hide is. If your dog looks up at you it is very important to wait to reward until he is looking back to where the hide is and then reward with "good"and then continual treats as the dog head is still in the original alert position. It teaches to the dogs to stay in their alert position longer until rewarded- making the dogs alert easier to read. It was pretty cool to see after the owner did "Timmy in the well" a few times the dog who barely alerted gave a very strong clear alert in such a short amount of time. Was very impressive.

 

Jenny720,
There are some excellent points in your post above. Rewarding at source when the dog recognizes odor is important. Rewarding only when the dog is "locked" on the odor and not looking back at the handler is also very important. Most problems in detection work can be directly linked back to handler error. "Helping" the dog too much leads to handler dependence. AS you mentioned, handler body language and "blocking" the dog also create issues and handler dependence.

As soon as the dog learns the odor you need to start running "blind" finds. Or finds that unknown to the handler. This forces the handlers to rely on their dog and learn to read their dogs. After all, the dog has the nose and the super senses.

 

Slamdunc- thanks. The clinic had tons of great info. If anybody may be thinking about going to a nose work clinic in the future- it will be worth your time. Yes very true - blind hides are where i will truly learning much about reading the subtle body language of Max and will give me no other choice but just to keep full focus on him. It will take a different kind of pressure off not knowing where the hide is as sometimes I will be worrying -yikes it's right there will he find it. We have not done blind hides,other then finding kids in woods or stores which is always a very fast and direct intense path to them, yet but it will be where the true fun will start!

 

Practicing outside during the winter at the sump in the woods across the street. Wanting to do some Home Depot trips to practice at different places.

 

Super senses yes. Around Memorial Day I was driving home with Max i saw a dead groundhog in the street. I pushed it over to the side of the road- Max watching this in the car. As soon as we got home he wanted to go in the backyard to check on his ground hog that lived under the shed- it was not him that got run over by a car. Tonight for a walk which is not the way we usually go but is a shorter walk down our block near the service road. Max started going crazy sniffing this one spot in the middle of the street as if he was smelling animal I realized it was the same spot the ground hog was laying a few weeks ago. There was a crack in the road and I remember it was the start of the woods that I slid it over with a piece of wood. Could of all the rain wash off the scent away non the less thought to be pretty neat.

 

Oh what fun to see others talk about NoseWork, my girl is officially in classes now but I started playing "find it" with her since back when I was only fostering her. Both my boss and coworker have their dogs in the game and we all go together to events. Since Val is only 5 months, she can't begin on actually odor yet, but once she is a year the real game will begin. <3

 

Just curious... Why can't your girl start odor before she is a year old? My boy started classes when he was five months old and was on odor by the time he was seven months old. Is that just the way your instructor does things?

 

Mike Suttle at Loganhaus Kennels has posted a bunch of detection training on their YouTube channel. If you want to get into NoseWork, or want to improve what you're already doing, it's a good place to look for examples of what right looks like.

Another tip is to have someone video your searches. It is great to go back and see what you missed. It will help you read your dog better. Have the person that placed your blind hides review the video with you so they can point out when you may have missed a change of behavior.

 

You can start puppies on odor at 6 weeks old

Detection is all about fun and rewards. No serious stuff as far as the dog is concerned.

Same dog at 12 weeks

 

I started my dog Francesca, on narcotics detection at 8 weeks. She was working all the odors and doing high finds by 5 months. I laid off for almost a year and then certified her in 2 months of training. She is currently a certified Police narcotics K-9. The early foundation was huge. The easiest dog that I have ever trained for detection work.

 

There is the reason Mike starts his dogs so early.

 

Hey guys... trying to consider this in the SAR field. So many people, in my area, begin imprinting a puppy a little later on cadaver tissue if you are an area, air scent dog. By that I mean that we start with runaways and teaching the puppy the game of fine the person, come back alert, and take the handler into the person, the "z pattern". Cadaver tissue is often put off. But it sounds like you are saying maybe that should be done earlier too. That there are ADDED benefits from doing so rather than waiting. SLAMdunc, David... in your collective experiences does the dog lose out by starting later say at 8 months or a year old?