Poor guy! From the hoarder to the shelter, he hasn't experienced any good life so far.

I don't think you are a failure AT ALL. The decision is yours to make. To me, it seems like the shelter downplayed his issues so you wound up having a more stressed dog than you expected?
But one good sign is that the shelter did not put him to sleep...they must have seen something in him worth saving.

I'm not sure I could decide within 48 hours! At 48 hours, my rescue was still lying down in dark corners far away from us, and would pull like crazy on the leash as if he had never been on a walk. We had a two week "trial period" given to us by the rescue, and by that time we knew he'd be fine with us. Do you want to give him a little more time to show you his nature?

I really can't say what I think you should do - commit, foster or return...it's so personal!

There is certainly no judgement if, as a 29 year old single person, you want to live as a normal person with a normal dog.
Another thought for you is that the upcoming decade is often the life decade when people date, marry, have kids...that means, new significant others and maybe new babies in the house with this dog (assuming he has a typical GSD lifespan)...just a thought...

 

This dog has been failed by everyone. You aren't failing him -- you're giving him his best hope. You might have taken on more than you thought, but instead of feeling defeated, just decide that it's going to force you to expand your skill set!

First, shelter research has shown that it takes at least 3 days for the cortisol to come down after the shift to a new environment -- so he's chemically been in fight or flight mode the whole time you've had him. You can't train through that. You can't even do a fair temperament assessment in that period.

It's not too late to start him in a 2-week shutdown either -- I would!

Dogs like this just take time. Years of living in the horror of a hoarding situation means that you've got a lot of learned fear -- he expects bad stuff to happen, constantly. Counter conditioning is a hugely important technique to learn about -- Patricia McConnell's stuff on her website and in her books is all very approachable (her 30-page booklet called "The Cautious Canine" should be mandatory reading for dogs like this).
https://www.amazon.com/Cautious-Canine-How-Conquer-Their-Fears/dp/1891767003/

Her blog posts about fear are collected here:
http://www.patriciamcconnell.com/fearhttp://www.patriciamcconnell.com/fear

I would also recommend reviewing the resources at Fear Free Pets -- an organization that trains vets, techs, groomers, and other professionals techniques to minimize stress in frightened pets. They have a site just for pet owners too:
https://fearfreehappyhomes.com/

I'm also a big proponent of clickers for dogs like this -- they haven't ever experienced them, so there's no negative association, so it's a blank slate for training. Reaching for a dog that's been abused, even with a treat, can be overwhelming, so learning to mark positively without reaching for the dog is sometimes helpful, especially in the beginning. It's a way of communicating within the dog's narrow limits right now. A clicker-based trainer could be very helpful in getting you started.

We have 2 in the rescue now that flailed like fishes out of water the first time we leashed them, they busted out of crates, destroyed the foster's home, and got into everything because they had never been inside a house. They were sweet but WILD. One of them has come so far in 3 months that he's a candidate for a PTSD service dog program right now! They were out at a pet adoption festival last weekend and were well behaved, awesome dogs -- one was used to demonstrate an obedience drill at the festival. Their foster dad works full time, is single, and is fairly young -- he just figured it out, using the resources available to him.

The rescue has another dog right now that was terrified of all humans (severely abused). I wasn't even sure we'd be able to get him to an adoptable point when I pulled him, but there was a foster home with experience with these dogs that promised they'd be in it for as long as it takes because they like helping this kind of dog. So I pulled him out of the shelter and hoped for the best. After 4 months, he's become a dog that just graduated from a group obedience class where he successfully now works around other dogs and strange people! For him, just being in a group class was impossible at first -- he had to attend class a parking lot away because the people scared him and he'd lie flat on the ground and shut down. He's made phenomenal progress under this trainer, and he's now participating in class. Again, it took about about 4 months to get him here. He's still a shy dog, but he's not debilitated by fear. He's looking to his person for a cue on what's safe and okay, and he is transforming into a lovely companion.

One thing we added for him that seems to help is a prescription for a new anti-anxiety probiotic called Calming Care. It is a proprietary strain that you can't purchase in regular supplements. It has to be purchased through a vet. It's not going to hurt, and the research on it is very interesting.
https://www.proplanveterinarydiets.com/products/calming-care-dog-probiotic-supplement/

If you have access to a board-certified veterinary behaviorist, I would encourage you to consider a consultation. There may be some meds to take the edge off his fear to help get access to his focus for more successful training work, but I wouldn't trust a regular vet for that. (The board-certified vet behaviorists have a DVM plus years of additional training, research, and residency, and earned diplomat status in the ACVB -- but there aren't very many of them.)

https://www.dacvb.org/search/newsearch.asp

You're not going to solve this in a week, or a month. You'll make some progress in 3 months, some more in 6 months, and in a year, if you are lucky, he may finally feel like a dog you're really proud of. Someday you won't even recognize it's the same dog. The timetable though has to be set by the dog, not by your expectations.

Working with dogs like this is a challenge and also a huge opportunity to grow in your ability to communicate with dogs. If you let him, he will teach you a lot about yourself too. It's humbling, involves lots of days that feel like set backs, and lots of self-doubt sometimes -- but when you get there eventually, the feeling of pride is incomparable because you earned it together. I think dogs like this make us better people by forcing us to set our own egos aside and listen to the dog.

One of the secrets of rescue is that it's hard, full of disappointments, and often soul-crushing. I feel like you aren't really a "rescuer" until you've had a dog like this make you sob like a baby at how much you don't know -- and then we put on our "big kid pants" and find ourselves trainers and mentors to teach us what we need to learn to help the dog. Being a rescuer isn't posting "save this dog" on Facebook when there's a sad thread about a hording case...lots of useless people do that...the real work is what you are doing, and it's HARD. Most people who've been active in rescue have been EXACTLY where you are, either with a foster dog or a personal dog. All those experienced rescuers who seem to know so much only know so much because they went through this same thing years ago and let it be a chance to learn and grow, rather than an insurmountable obstacle.

This dog has no one else -- he's with you because he was in a shelter languishing. There's no magical pool of people out there waiting to help or adopt dogs like this: if you give up on him, who better than you is he really going to find? People take dogs like this and put them on chains to guard property, but not many people want to bring them in their homes like this. (If you must rehome him, please at least try rehabilitate him for 3-6 months to get him to a more adoptable state so that he can attract more potential interest so he'll have better odds of getting a worthy home.)

You haven't failed until you give up -- and you haven't given up. Vent. Cry. Laugh. Pray. Whatever gets you through. You will be tested, you will struggle, you will learn, but it *will* get better over time if you have patience, set your ego aside, find local resources to support you, and ask him only to do only as much as he can do right now. Tomorrow it might be a little more than he can do today. With enough tomorrows, you'll get there together.

 

Moonshayde:


Welcome to the forum!
What a good deed you have done to step up and try to help this abused dog. I can understand that it must seem overwhelming. Don't beat yourself up! It's too early to feel like a failure.

I'm not experienced enough to give you the advice you need, but I'll share a few thoughts:

1. Get a trainer who can come to your home to assist.

2. You are very early in the process. I struggle with a very hyper and stubborn landshark puppy, who is now 7 months old. You have more of a challenge on your hands. It will take time.

3. I'm thinking the dog can sense your fear. Take it slow and easy and try to relax. You likely have a series of problems to solve. Your fear can make situations worse.

4. You are a slender woman, so your choice of collar (s) and leashes can make a difference. If he almost came out of his collar, you need to adjust the collar or get a different type of collar. May need a different leash. You need tools to gain better control over the dog.

There are a lot of opinions regarding collars. Prong collars can be controversial, but I started to use one. I rarely use it for a correction, but I have that tool if I need to use it. If used properly, it can be a helpful tool to use.

AN OPINION ON USING A PRONG COLLAR ON A FEARFUL DOG:
https://thegooddog.net/training-tips/shocking-and-pronging-fearful-dogs/

SOME OLDER THREADS AND AN ARTICLE TO READ AT LINKS BELOW:

https://www.germanshepherds.com/for...information-general/651521-first-time-gsd-owners-getting-dog-bad-situation.html

https://www.germanshepherds.com/for...eneral-behavior/718290-wits-end-shelter-dog-who-anxious-fearful-everything.html

https://www.germanshepherds.com/for...16866-too-many-training-methods-what-worked-you-reactive-1-year-old-female.html

https://www.germanshepherds.com/for...m/aggression-good-bad-ugly/661433-4-month-old-terrified-fearful-aggressive.html

https://www.germanshepherds.com/for...m/aggression-good-bad-ugly/661433-4-month-old-terrified-fearful-aggressive.html

EIGHT TIPS TO HELP FEARFUL DOGS
https://www.companionanimalpsychology.com/2018/08/eight-tips-to-help-fearful-dogs-feel.html

 

Some of this might pertain to your situation.....even though you cited " Now I understand the 2 week shutdown"


Leerburg | The Groundwork to Establishing Pack Structure with Adult Dogs


The topics that might be of value would be:


What Breeds Need Ground Work?

Many Rescue Dogs Genetically Have Faulty Temperaments

The First Weeks

Always On a Leash





SuperG

 

I would start at the vet's and put him on an anti anxiety medicine as Maggie suggested. Continue with the 2 week shut down as much as you can. Get a good trainer. This poor dog has probably never been exposed to anything.

 

During the shut down, the only thing he has to deal with is his new home to get a sense of where he belongs and with whom. He is past the imprinting stage so a few weeks of doing nothing but adjust and calmness will only help him. If you feel overwhelmed, give yourself and him two months and re-evaluate and make a decision then. This may take the pressure off you. For now, sit with him and crate him (if he is OK in a crate), sit with him, crate him for a day. Then leash him and take him around the house wherever you go and crate him again to let him digest the experience. He needs to learn that he is safe with you.Let him sleep next to your bed for bonding. I admire you for doing this and please, please don't feel bad. You saved this dog; a true rescue.
I had a similar case with a Black Lab, completely traumatized, scared out of her mind and deathly ill. The shelter asked me if she could die with me instead of in a kennel. Long story short, it took a few months and she found a home and was able to deal with a quiet life in the country. It was my master piece in fostering.

 

1. Leave The Dog Alone --- quit trying to force a connection. (2 week shut down.) Let him get used to you.


2. for outside, consider a temporary installation of a kennel immediately out your back door. Set it up so that your door opens directly into the kennel and that, for the near future, the kennel door opens out on the yard. Keep the kennel door closed for now so that when he is let out, he will be in a confined space directly out side your door. You will not need to leash him for the two week shut down, you will not need to fuss about the collar. You WILL be able to let the dog adjust and get used to you.


No vet, no trainer, no company for right now. Two Week Shut Down. Let the dog come to you on his terms/time for now.


Because it sounds to me like you are OMG rushing the crap out of this.



Take a chill pill. Leave the dog alone to adjust to you -- quit pressuring him for now. Things will get better.

 

Hi everyone,

Thank you so much for your words of advice. Unfortunately since the snow sliding scare yesterday (and it is STILL doing it!!! I have such a steep roof it is pissing me off) Haku (my rescue) now refuses to come out of his crate and I can no longer get near him at all. It was a hard hit to the both of us. Due to this he has almost gone 48 hours again without relieving himself. I don't want to scare him by taking him outside as he now refuses to come anywhere near me, I can't touch him, can't get his leash on without invading his space a bit and can't get him outside without some drama.

I have just let him be all day and he has just stayed in his crate. He is eating but not drinking, I think I will need to move his water bowl to outside his crate now.

I feel I should elaborate a bit on the "Shelter". I was very tired when I wrote my previous post. They are a no-kill rescue, and very, very lovely. The reason I felt Haku was struggling is because unfortunately they are not able to foster dogs and are kept in typical fenced runs but with people coming in 4 days a week to view the dogs and dogs barking madly, it is a lot to deal with. Haku is SO sound sensitive. In fact there was a guy there (Ted) who works with the Shepherds that come in, Haku was starting to trust him and get friendly. Ted cried when he loaded him into my car which broke my heart. They actually had 3 Shepherds from the same hoarding. We have been texting and he is trying to help me out. Today he suggested I call the other lady who took the other Shepherd from the hoarding. He said she was amazing. It stung, but I pushed my ego aside and called. What a wonderful woman. It hurt a bit but the other Shepherd is doing fantastic. No bathroom issues, tried to run but she had a small enclosed place so could let him off leash, has another confident shepherd there which is doing wonders, is already warming up to her and she only picked him up yesterday. I felt crushed.

We talked for over an hour and she says I am doing everything right, and that the ice scare was unfortunate. Anyway. What really eats me up is like Magwort says, learning about yourself. In 4 days I have learned that I am not as patient as I thought, have anxiety issues, am incredibly insecure and am selfish. My family is lovely and are trying to help but have seen what is happening to me and are concerned. I feel bad dragging them into my decision as well. I just hate myself because I don't feel that I can deal with this long term. Being alone is really hard. And now I have just cut off my family due to this situation (he is too scared, I can't have anyone over and can't leave). No one can help me with the pressure. I was already an introvert, now I just basically don't exist. I wanted a dog because I was lonely. The two must haves on my list were "affectionate and playful," what a joke I am. I feel like I will never be able to visit my family, can't go on vacation or paddle boarding (I was planning to take my future dog). Just lovely dark, soul-searching thoughts.

I have decided to take it one day at a time, one step at a time. First survive the week, then survive the first work week etc. At least right now Haku is warm, comfy and resting in my creepy quiet house (and seems to like peanut butter). On that note, I was so excited to clicker train, in fact the reason I was seeking out a shepherd/ shepherd mix is because I LOVE training tricks and doing obedience, I was looking for a possible agility dog (just for fun, really low key). But Haku refuses all treats, even if I casually throw them in his crate every now and then. We are just not at that phase yet at all. The peanut butter was a first interest so thats good, but I don't think I can clicker train without anything he wants.

I will brace myself for the bathroom epidemic in my room tomorrow, take a deep breathe and just see where the day takes us. Deep down I think my selfish expectations of a dog is what is the problem here and the guilt from that realization is devastating. Hopefully I can sleep better tonight and tomorrow will be brighter. Thanks for all the helpful links, I will go through them.

Oh and NaughtyNibbler, I actually have a martingale collar I was thinking of using, I will need to get it on him though and will start looking around for a trainer that may be able to help me out and also give me some honest feedback about what the future would look like etc.

Thanks guys.

 

It's day two? I would not use medication at this point. I would put a martingale on him rather than a flat collar so he cannot slip the collar.

He's 18 months old, so it is going to take him a little longer than a young puppy to acclimate, but he should be able to do so.

Let him come to you.

You just put his food down and walk away. I know you have to take him out on lead, but do everything low key and with as little interaction as possible. When he figures it out that you are trustworthy, he should come around.

Dogs are social creatures. So it is a drive within them that is as basic as any other. Be stable/consistent, and gentle, he ought to figure it out.

 

This is something you may like to try, reading aloud while he's in his crate.


https://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/12/nyregion/how-to-heal-a-traumatized-dog-read-it-a-story.html

 

I had read that stress stacks. When dogs are scared it can take at least 30 minutes and up to 2 days for the stress hormones to drop back down to a normal level. On top of all the good advice shared with you I'd say start with a strict schedule so the dog learns what to expect, at least for now. Add to that lots and lots of rest and sleep. If your new guys stress levels are very high it will be very difficult for him to deal with things that really shouldn't be a big deal. You see this in humans when someone yells at you for doing "nothing". Their stress levels are so high that even looking at them in a way they think is odd can set them off.

Our schutzhund trainer told us that back in the days of heavy compulsion training, they wouldn't do any work with their dogs for 2 to 3 days after training hard.

 

I agree with trying meds and agree get him a properly fitted martingale collar if you really think he is going to get away from you.

The only catch there is that most martingale designs have to be put on over the head. There are some made with easy snaps. And none should be on the dog unattended or even off a leash because the martingale loop is more likely to catch on stuff and hang the dog up. So collar on and off and over the head might be too much for this dog right now.

My girl caught a martingale on the knob to a low cabinet on our living room entertainment center. She ripped the door off before I could even respond to what was happening and I was in the room. She started to run with the cabinet door hanging from her collar and I was able to grab her and get it off but imagine if she had been alone!? She is a confident dog and this didn't have any lasting effect on her. A fearful dog it certainly would have.

 

Welcome to our helpful group, and thank you for your patience and empathy to helping this poor dog through a very

traumatic time in his life. I'm amazed at all the genuinely helpful people that have come out here to help you.

Don't beat yourself up. Right now your dog needs you badly. If you've been a problem horse trainer in your past, that tells me a lot about your capabilities. As a fellow former horse re-trainer and rescuer I know you probably have it

in you to help this dog. Have faith in yourself. You can do it, I'm sure. just take it an hour at a time, then a day at

a time. And a few months from now you will look back and think, I do think doggy is a little better than he was when he

came here. Slow and patient wins the day. Baby steps. tiny baby steps.

My new GSD/Husky (?) 2 yr. old has been w/ me for 5 months. She was so wild I swore she had lived her life in a

closet or shed. Her first dozen rides in the truck cab I thought her head and neck would get wrenched and she looked

like a bobble head, she got so worked up and anxious just being out in the world, she watched every single car we

passed, every single house we passed, every single tree on the side of the road. An anxious mess. But she learned

fast that she love to ride in the truck and would sit beside it begging to go ride.

We had to work through: Cat aggression- we did it. Horse aggression- we're getting much better- not totally there yet.

Dog aggression, still a work in progress, but she's ok w/ visiting dogs to my farm but not ok w/ other dogs out in

the big wide world.

My point is, you can do this too. Sit back, take a deep breath and calmly work through each issue, slowly and patiently.

The shelter told me my rescue had "no issues" too. HAH!! If only they knew what we've been through and had to overcome. There were a few times that I wondered if I should take her back. But I knew her life had already been

tough and I would be setting her up for more rejection and re-homing.

I think back to where you are today and understand completely. It is scary but remember in horses, it's the toughest

ones that teach us the most. We become much better trainers and animal people when we've plowed through the problems and figure out how to overcome them.

Don't give up. You can help your dog, I'm sure of it. Keep us posted. And thank you again for being the person you

are.

 

To the OP --- my dogs like to remind me that they are here to keep humans humble. Seems like this guy is really doing a number on you that way. It's hard to adjust your expectations so dramatically but I think if you can, you will feel better. Remember that you are not the other adopter, your dog is not the dog she took. So much depends on the combination. She may have done no better with this dog than you are doing with this dog. Most of us think that we can "fix" whatever it is someone else is dealing with, that we can handle the situation better. That's our "go to" before we are in the situation.



One thought - could you reach out to the guy at the shelter who so liked your dog? If he could give you some time at your house, it might turn Mr. Sulk around a bit quicker. (as in the world hasn't completely collapsed.)

 

There is no shame in changing your mind on the adoption. Maybe even negotiating with one of the other rescuers to trade dogs. You have to be realistic about what is best for you and the dog in the long run. One of the other rescuers might have accommodations at their home that might be better suited for this particular dog.

So much depends on the combination. She may have done no better with this dog than you are doing with this dog. Most of us think that we can "fix" whatever it is someone else is dealing with, that we can handle the situation better. That's our "go to" before we are in the situation.

Well said! I totally agree.

One thought - could you reach out to the guy at the shelter who so liked your dog? If he could give you some time at your house, it might turn Mr. Sulk around a bit quicker. (as in the world hasn't completely collapsed.)

That's a good idea. Also, don't hesitate to reach out to the rescue group in general for assistance. Asking for help doesn't make you inferior. I'm thinking that everyone connected with the rescue group wants all the rescues to be successfully rehabilitated. Some rescues may need to be a group effort.

I had read that stress stacks. When dogs are scared it can take at least 30 minutes and up to 2 days for the stress hormones to drop back down to a normal level. . . If your new guys stress levels are very high it will be very difficult for him to deal with things that really shouldn't be a big deal. You see this in humans when someone yells at you for doing "nothing". Their stress levels are so high that even looking at them in a way they think is odd can set them off.

I've read that with humans that it can even take up to 3 days to recover from a stressful event. I tend to suffer from Winter depression (SAD). I know that during the dark days of Winter and with weather challenges, anxiety and depression can even be an issue with people who aren't generally stressed or anxious.

This year, I inquired with my primary care doctor about using CBD oil for insomnia. My doctor thought it was a good idea and that his brother, as well as other patients are using it and getting a good result. I did some research on various products and started using it. It has helped with both insomnia and anxiety this Winter. I'd much rather use CBD oil than something like a prescription tranquilizer for me. If I ever have a need, I wouldn't hesitate to try a suitable version for my dog.

Due to this he has almost gone 48 hours again without relieving himself. I don't want to scare him by taking him outside as he now refuses to come anywhere near me, I can't touch him, can't get his leash on without invading his space a bit and can't get him outside without some drama.

I have just let him be all day and he has just stayed in his crate. He is eating but not drinking, I think I will need to move his water bowl to outside his crate now.

I have multiple types of leashes to use with my rowdy puppy. Sometimes, at home, when she tries to evade me putting a leash on her, I use a slip leash. It is kinda like using a lasso. Once the slip leash is on, it's easier to change out to a different leash.

You may need to lay down some potty pads for awhile. I know it may seem like a step backwards, but it could eliminate the need to go outside in the snow.

 

Your heart is in the right place here, OP. But I want to give you some different advice than what others have.

This is not a healthy situation, and it may even be a dangerous one. You are dealing with what is essentially a feral dog. This dog has missed every critical socialization period of its life. Anyone who is responsible here will tell you that the German Shepherd’s breed standard calls for a degree of human aggression as it matures. If a GSD is not properly socialized, it can be a dangerous liability. You say you are a woman, and you are afraid this dog could bite you. Are you realistically going to be able to defend yourself if the dog attacks you? You said you live in a highly populated area. What about if this dog gets away from you and harms someone else... especially, a child?

What happened to this dog is not your fault. You did not make this dog like he is. The hoarder did. Having worked in rescue myself, I have seen how behavioral issues are underplayed. I have seen many people in your same position who have taken on a dog that cannot be fixed and the subsequent emotional distress and guilt complex that develops. I have seen a lot of codependency issues in the rescue community.

I want to be the person who gives you emotional permission to return this dog to the rescue, or to surrender him to a shelter. That does not make you a failure. It does not make you a bad person. You tried, but the damage was already done—and you were not the person who inflicted it.

When a dog misses critical socialization, the best that can ever be done with it is “management.” That is not healthy for you, or for your family, or for your future romantic prospects.

You deserve to have a dog that will be that fun partner you can take paddle boarding. You deserve a dog who is "affectionate and playful." My advice to you is to take a deep breath, get some in-person support for doing what I advised (it will be hard), and then let yourself heal from this experience before you look for another dog. Consider waiting to buy a dog from a reputable breeder if you want a shepherd. Temperament is crucial in this breed and the truth is that a lot of dogs are in shelters because of unresolvable temperament issues. Put yourself and your mental, social and physical health first. There is nothing wrong with doing so.

My best wishes to you, and I am so sorry you are going through something so upsetting. Please stop beating yourself up. You are in my thoughts.

 

No one else has to live with this. You do. So our thoughts and opinions need not guilt you into keeping a dog you will end up resenting.
If you are the ONLY adopter for this dog, and I doubt that, then so be it. My personal thoughts? I like the tough ones, but my personality dictates that I need to be needed. And at that, as I get older, I want an easy dog.
A companion animals primary function in this world is to enrich our lives, if they can't then that's that. Don't let us, the rescue, the shelter or anyone else guilt you into something you do not want to do. Us making comments to the effect that you are his last hope is not fair.

All that said, I have had dogs like you are describing and I personally like to leave them be as much as possible, while staying on their radar. I read out loud, tell stories, yammer away about life. I close doors to keep them in the room I am in, I drop little, tasty treats about as I go. Basically I ignore them while at the same time making me their focus.
As for your taking him outside, I would simply put the collar and leash on as quickly and quietly as possible and go. Keep it business like and brief.
Having people over? Put him in your room and close the door.
You said you were a horsewoman? You know all of this! Stop ***** footing around and get it done. The more you make it a big deal the more you build a battle. Take a deep breath, straighten up and get in the saddle.
When you have a spooky horse in the barn does everyone stop working? Do the other horses stop moving? Does no one clean stalls? Change water? Feed?

 

If you're feeling bored and isolated, I think it'd be perfectly fine to leave the house for a while to visit family, go shopping, to a movie, out to dinner, or whatever else makes you feel normal. You can time your trip after your dog goes potty (hopefully he'll go out soon), or you can leave him in his crate, or a small, safe room where it won't be a disaster if he makes a mistake.

 

I missed it the first time but I think that attaching a kennel to the door to potty the dog more safely and maybe with no leash is a great idea. You could even put a tarp over the top so he could not climb out if he were inclined to try that in a panic.

For what it's worth I recently took on a foster shepherd that was abandoned at my vet and I too went through a phase of oh no, what have I done. We got through it and I did what I set out to do with that dog. Hang in there.

 

Whether or not you choose to keep at this, while he is with you, he does need a potty schedule no matter how much of a melt down he has. This one necessity will probably be your first break through in teaching him that you are reliable and consistent even if he is scared out of his mind. Also since he was able to hold it for 48 hrs, he had to have been potty trained. I would think that there would be health issues sooner or later if he is allowed to self force hold due to his fears to ask to go.

I hope you were able to get him out before he soiled. I also hope that since the rescue is a no kill, they will take the dog back if this doesn't work out for you. Imho, they should and that the fact that they are no kill and that there is a person there who has felt close to him, should make it a bit more comforting for you if that is what you decide.

Since he isn't a fear biter, I think this boy is going to make it be it with you or someone else. I do know from personal experience that working though ones own issues/problems while trying to help a dog through theirs is not easy nor fun at times and sometimes no matter what we wish for and how hard we try to figure out a way, the fit just isn't there through no fault of anyone. I do think that the rescue should have been a bit more detailed about this dog though.

 

It’s only been a few days, you had to know from his history that you wouldn’t get your perfect dog by now. He has known nothing but neglect his entire young life that has been turned upside down every which way, with no way to explain to him that he’s okay. Let him adjust on his own terms, to an extent. Be in the same vicinity but don’t pay direct attention to him, toss little treats here and there.. let him come to terms with his new and frightening surroundings and approach you when he wants to. You said you have a fence, are you worried about him climbing over it? Put a hot wire around the top like we do for horses and eliminate this extra stressor of having to leash up to take him outside. Otherwise make a slip lead out of a 30 ft line like they use for tracking. Also don’t feel like you need to make your house quiet as a mouse, or that you can’t go about your life. You know how if you fall asleep with tv blaring, lights on you’re fine but if you fall asleep in dark silence then someone turns on loud music you’re startled, awakened and upset? He must learn to adjust and that sounds/sights are part of his life and nothing to be scared of. He has to learn to cope and it will just take time. If he can be crated lock him up with a frozen peanut butter Kong and go take a breather, you can still live your life and you should. Maintain a schedule you plan on keeping his entire life, instead of devoting every second to him now then expecting him to be ok with less later. He has had zero consistency in his life and he needs it. If you have started colts you know the importance of this.

 

I wanted to thank everyone for their comments, help, concerns, advice and thoughts.

Haku is doing better today. Yesterday I asked the Shepherd handler that was working with him over at the rescue to stop by as he was still really scared to come out of his crate. Him and the dog have started a relationship so I was hoping he would get some comfort in that. At first he was still crazy scared, crawling, shaking, not seeing the handler at all. I was so embarrassed because it was an obvious 100 steps back from when I picked him up last Sunday, I swear he thought for a second I was beating the dog (I promise I'm not). We got him outside and he was still skittish but then the handler said he wanted to see if another dog would help. He fetched his own giant, playful shepherd and let him loose in my yard. Haku wagged his tail for the first time! We let them loose in the yard and it helped so much. After 15 minutes it was a completely different dog. Haku spent the rest of the day running up and down my indoor stairs about 50 times (he just loves them). It was so nice to see him relax. But at the same time I think I realized I cannot help this dog. Well, I know I CAN if I put in the time, effort etc. But just seeing the whole setup I had a sick feeling that he needs a different setup. That deep down, despite wishing differently, I am too anxious a person to take this on right now at this point in my life. I have actually just recently come back from over seas that turned out to be 2 of the most stressful years of my life. Anyway, I am trying to clearly separate my logical thought from my "puppy blues" and assess the situation. I have reached out to my family to help as they are involved in this too.

Watching him yesterday, Haku is going to be absolutely fine, especially with a person who expects nothing from him but what he can give. As sick as it makes me, I don't think I can do that, or I will, but somewhere inside I feel I might keep regretting, "what if...". What a terrible side of myself this has revealed.

I know it is too early to tell but my impressions so far is that he is super intense, very intelligent, extremely curious and just never wants to stop moving forward. In true Shepherd fashion, he is going to need a job to do. On a more practical level, I am concerned that I cannot keep up with him even if he does mellow out. But that is a separate issue.

If I do decide on returning him, I want everyone to know this is not a shelter drop off, but a completely legitimate rescue. He will not be put down, he will not be shuffled off to the first person who asks. They are a lovely group of people, require a house visit, check lease agreements etc. and even said they would help me look for a more balanced dog if I would like. The only thing that just tears me up inside is moving this poor boy again, especially back to the noisy run he was in. Although getting some peace and quiet, warm food and learning how awesome stairs and peanut butter are could not have been all that bad. But the handler will continue to work with him there and I know there were other people wanting to adopt him already. He is so freaking beautiful too which also helps.

I will keep everyone updated. Thank you.

 

If you have untreated problems with anxiety, and the dog is becoming a focal point for mental health issues (like anxiety or depression), and you find yourself blaming the dog and its problems for making you miserable, then you cannot solve this dog's issues. I'm not saying this to criticize but to be real with you. This is one of the few obstacles that will block progress.

Dogs sense human anxiety with perfect precision. You can't hide it from them. If they are already anxious themselves, the human's own anxiety merely confirms to them that the world is a scary place. The owner and dog are then in a self-reinforcing feedback loop.

OTOH, if either the dog or the owner is solid, either one can learn to get the other out of panic attacks or moments of extreme anxiety. It's why good, clear-headed dogs are so excellent for veterans with PTSD--they quickly learn to recognize, respond to, and help their humans out of it. Similarly, patient, dedicated humans learn to solve this for anxious dogs they're rehabilitating. It only works if one or the other is working from a solid foundation.

From your second post, it sounds like maybe neither you nor the dog are in a position to help each other though. I really hope the guy this dog loved at the shelter is willing to take him on as a foster. If they already have trust, it is what this dog needs.

 

If you have untreated problems with anxiety, and the dog is becoming a focal point for mental health issues (like anxiety or depression), and you find yourself blaming the dog and its problems for making you miserable, then you cannot solve this dog's issues. I'm not saying this to criticize but to be real with you. This is one of the few obstacles that will block progress.

Dogs sense human anxiety with perfect precision. You can't hide it from them. If they are already anxious themselves, the human's own anxiety merely confirms to them that the world is a scary place. The owner and dog are then in a self-reinforcing feedback loop.

OTOH, if either the dog or the owner is solid, either one can learn to get the other out of panic attacks or moments of extreme anxiety. It's why good, clear-headed dogs are so excellent for veterans with PTSD--they quickly learn to recognize, respond to, and help their humans out of it. Similarly, patient, dedicated humans learn to solve this for anxious dogs they're rehabilitating. It only works if one or the other is working from a solid foundation.

From your second post, it sounds like maybe neither you nor the dog are in a position to help each other though. I really hope the guy this dog loved at the shelter is willing to take him on as a foster. If they already have trust, it is what this dog needs.

@Magwart, The second to last paragraph hit home. big time. I don't want to derail the thread but wanted to second what you said. And I'm pretty sure the give and take of drawing from the strengths of each other once a bond is formed happens more often in less stressful circumstances than many realize. Relevant to the op's issues from what was posted I think he/she deserves a dog that can offer that kind of support. Perhaps this dog does have that ability that can be tapped into sometime down the road but we (general) can't see the future and can only make the best decisions base on our (general) past and what we know of the present.

 

@Magwort. Thank you for being honest. What you have outlined is exactly what I am fearing and as much as it makes me realize something about myself that I wish I had not, I cannot let my guilt or ego affect this dog. I wish I was the confident person I was a few years ago but I guess who I want to be and who I currently am are very very different.

 

Also the shelter needs to be more forth coming when their is an interest in one of their dogs. From your first post, it sounds like they downplayed the issues as in "The shelter seemed to play it really low key, saying he just needed love and time but I am starting to think I should have trusted my instincts better".
. You have learned a lot in a very short time. In dealing with shelters and rescues I have learned to read between the lines in dog descriptions.
You gave it your all and realized you reached your limits. That is only fair to yourself and the dog. Take a breather and let it go for a while. Choose a dog, that is interested in YOU, who freely approaches you out of interest and who doesn't need therapy. A tweak here and there is all you need.

 

I "wish" you would at least at this time (and such a short time that it has been), would lean toward the idea of fostering Haku (as you had mentioned) rather then him going back to shelter.
Huge strides were made in such a short time...15 mins, by bringing the other dog in...I am late to the party, and was going to suggest this, so I am thrilled to read this now.
Imagine 15 mins and what change you have seen.
Also wanted to suggest a martingale with clip so you don't have to put on and off and adjust, as well a 20 ft to 30 ft drag lead...you stay at the threshold of door, sitting in a chair and let dog out to explore. He spooks, you still have him and he may just come right back to you.


You have a right to have a normal dog life. Doesn't mean you won't, but no guarantee either. Nor will it with the next. So many people here got the perfect puppy, so they thought. They had doubts, they reached out. Many still have that dog they wanted to rehome. Others rehomed.


I too have a scared rescue. She is cross. We have been together a yr and a half. She doesn't want anyone but me. No human, no dogs. It is hard, but I live a quiet life, not a lot of company and sometimes I regret it. But when she folds her body and wiggles and wags when I get home, it is just the best....before she would skulk and lift her back leg at me in a submissive way.
Walks...she would look at me like "whatever you want, don't hurt me". She was afraid on walks. She was afraid of the door. Afraid of the fridge door. Afraid of the TV. Afraid of her reflection in the stove. Afraid of me reaching to pet her. Afraid of the crate. She didn't know how to play with toys or chew a raw bone.
She wasn't afraid of food or counter surfing as she seemed to be starving (she was also very sick)


Now she has her spot on sofa, she hangs on back of it guarding/watching life go by. She is insane and climbs over my shoulder and does head stands on my hip as she play bites me for attention.
When we go for our walks she is wagging, at the door she used to be afraid of, anxious, runs out ahead of me, jumps up on deck rail "hurry up!" as I turn to lock door. Whips my make shift gate open with her muzzle....sigh. she still doesn't care for others on walks.
I open the fridge, she sticks her head in and sniffs all the condiments. She has learned to get vocal (never barked before), she makes what I refer to as baby seal noises, She freaked out just recently, barking and growling as I was in bed and someone or two had hopped the raining on the front deck outside my bedroom window. I think she thwarted a potential break in (I called 911).
She goes insane when "it's shower time" and has total bark/howl thing and pounces at me as I turn water on.
TV, no problem.
Toys...I wish she didn't learn how to play with them...It's costing me a fortune...LOL
I don't crate her anymore ( I will if HAVE to, if landlord had to come in when not home)
I play music, I dance with her, she goes through my legs as I give her a rub down to the beat of the song.


Anyway, that is just some stuff.
She can be a bit of a pill when I have company (which is rarely), and has attempted to bully or maybe even bite when the person moved too suddenly in my direction. But they were between Her and I.
Stuff to work on. But right now, she is a happy, fairly confident, playful clown