Kudos to your training and to Berlin for not biting the guy. People can be weird. I'm surprised the guy never tried to communicate with you at all.

Had one of my boys out at a Pets and Pumpkins street festival yesterday and was constantly amazed at how many people would just run up and start touching him. Good thing he loves people and attention.

 

Yeah, Berlin has been accompanying me everywhere since i've had him, and I am shocked how many people (mostly kids!) just RUN up to him and touch him. I am very glad I socialized the crap out of him. My guy loves attention too, I am glad, but this kind of attention was a little too much. He liked it at first, but then with the freaky rubbing and pulling my dogs skin, Berlin was like...uh okay guy go away. I am surprised the guy never tried to communicate either. He didn't even really look at me. My sister and I were just so weirded out by the whole thing.

 

When Echo was about 9 months old, we had to take him on a ferry. He was very nervous, visibly so, and laying under the bench underneath me. I turned around to hand something to my husband (I was still sitting down, immediately above where he was laying). I turn back around and a guy is putting his INFANT son in my dog's face, his hands ON his face, telling him to pet the doggie. Echo didn't do anything, but I asked the guy if he was insane and told him that putting his BABY in the face of any strange dog, let alone one who was agitated, was probably the stupidest thing I'd ever seen.

The stupidity of people blow my mind. And the scariest thing is that no matter how good of a watch you keep (I was sitting ON mine, for pete's sake), it just takes a second for someone to be an idiot.

 

Was that guy CRAZY? geez, some people...I swear. I agree, all it takes is one second for someone to do something stupid. And the crappy part of all this, is IF this guy DID get bit for agitating MY dog, my dog looks like the bad guy then. And then its MY fault. Sigh.

 

I agree some people are fools sometime people who own dog even more so as i witness, the other day in the pet store a lady who had a gsd pup starts talking to another lady who has a huge pure black gsd im paying for my stuff and was standing very close so i could hear there whole convosation and clearly hear the black gsd owner say her dog love other dogs but is very nervous of people the puppy owner the procedes to start trying to stroke the black gsd he avoids her hand she trys more than onece more before the dog very gentley mouths her hand and moved next to his owner out of the way the conversation lasted about 5 mins most of the time she was trying to stroke the black gsd
if this was my dog i would have walked away almost instantley im glad she diddent get bitten but i would have been her own fault if she did and i wouldent have been surprised.

 

I'm very glad that Berlin did such a good job.

I've honestly been downright rude with people that are too in my dogs face and harshly told them to BACK OFF and pulled the dog back and stepped in between and backed up keeping myself in between. I figure it's always best to be considered rude then chancing a bite Unfortunately it's always the dogs fault 99.9% of the time. Both my dogs are extensively socialized but all dogs have their limits

 

Neighbor Gets $10.000.00

My pup Dieter was harassed by the dog next door since we brought him home. Neighbors would let thier dog out to run free day or night. He would visit at night and bark and bark in front of our pup's room. So... Dieters now 90 pounds and pissed off permanantley at the dog next door. Dogs meet near the property line and Dieter's gonna kick some dog ass, child runs in between fighting dogs and gets a small nip one tooth mark from one of the dogs..not conclusively mine. I get sued for $10.000.00.. Now Iam the bad neigbor. (I Support the Effort To Bring GSD"s of War Home)

 

Hi,

Wow, that's not good. Sorry that happened. Also welcome to the site!

(btw good cause, I support the War Dogs efforts too! )

My pup Dieter was harassed by the dog next door since we brought him home. Neighbors would let thier dog out to run free day or night. He would visit at night and bark and bark in front of our pup's room. So... Dieters now 90 pounds and pissed off permanantley at the dog next door. Dogs meet near the property line and Dieter's gonna kick some dog ass, child runs in between fighting dogs and gets a small nip one tooth mark from one of the dogs..not conclusively mine. I get sued for $10.000.00.. Now Iam the bad neigbor. (I Support the Effort To Bring GSD"s of War Home)

 

Uhg, how awful. I have zero tolerance for that kind of thing!

I was at the pet store with two of my friends and their dogs today, and these 13 and 15 year old boys kept harassing Hunter, and kept following us around the store trying to give him milkbones and peppers the one kid had in a container he got from a restaurant. We were working on obedience, so it was a great distraction but my friend told the kids to get lost in a snappy way. Then they came back, and it was my turn to tell them to leave my dog alone. They kept grabbing his tail while we were heeling!! UHG! People!!

 

That's nuts! Glad Berlin was able to show restraint, some people are just plain weird.

 

Good boy Berlin!

And good training Katie!

I'm finding that Lisl is starting to settle down a lot since she was a very young pup. She's not the nerve bag she used to be, but I don't think she would have tolerated what you described this douchebag did to Berlin.

 

Thanks, I'm glad he was able to refrain from biting. I have zero tolerance for this sort of thing too, and I was (trying!) to be rude, but since the guy didnt speak English, or even pay attention to me, it was kinda hard to evacuate the situation, especially since this large group of crazies was practically surrounding us, and this guy was physically grabbing my dog. I am just glad I finally DID get away from them before Berlin did get really irritated.

Angel, that is really crazy about those kids with the peppers and pulling Hunter's tail. I cant STAND when punk kids think its funny to mess around with a dog, and don't stop when asked.

Things I've realized since owning Berlin: people are weird, and some people really have no idea how to approach a dog. Especially a big dog. Also some people dont teach their kids how to properly approach one either.

I wouldnt ever be able to not bring Berlin with me everywhere. Its great training and socialization for him. Plus, I enjoy it. But I am always, ALWAYS on top of my game when in public. I know the risks. I know people are unpredictable (yesterdays incident was just plain ODD, lol)...so I never ever get too comfortable when we are out. I never want anything to happen.

 

when you have a dog in public they should be solid and not react to
people doing what you consider strange or doing what you think they
shouldn't be doing. if a dog isn't solid keep them away from public places,
crowds, children other animals.

 

I totally agree with you! my dogs are in training and i don't allow anyone to pet my dogs at this time.

 

Good for your boy!
We went to a pumpkin patch yesterday, but it has clear no dogs allowed signs. In fact almost all of the orchards and pumpkin patches have those signs and one website explains they have produce, they don't want kids picking and eating something a dog pee'd on. However apparently leaving peanuts everywhere and offering free samples, they don't have an issue with.
We generally stay away when we take the dogs, there is a beautiful park on the lake 10 minutes away, it faces West, so you can watch the sun set, we go in a team when we take the dogs, dh and I switch off watching DD while the other sits with the dogs, but most people have been pretty normal, we put ourselves where nobody can really approach us, and if they do we see them coming for 20 meters at least.

 

Man! I know for a FACT that Phoenix would have bitten this guy. No question in my mind.
What a good dog!
Do you think he was actually trying to get bitten? I've heard of people who do things like that purposely to get bitten so that they can sue the owner.
Scary world we live in.

 

I know right! Some people are just as shady as the Bermuda Triangle, and now that you say it I remember this one fellow who kept coming in complaining about dog bites just to find out he was instigating dogs to get under the table apology cash from the sorrowful owner. He got caught by a parking lot cam, could you believe it??? I just have no respect for anyone who would willingly attack a dog in any way and blame the animal for defending itself the only way it naturally knows how.


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I read these stories and I just wonder where some of you live?

anyway if you're out in public your dog better be 100% rock solid, or you better be 100% on your game and your dog's best advocate. If either is present, it's a non issue. How does a complete stranger spend any time roughing up your dog if you're on your game?

 

Yup.

I've only seen one bad incident that involved a golden and some people having a picnic literally followed the (on leash) golden and his people, picnic people were trying to lure him to stop with a container of food.

Most people give us our space and don't even try to pet my dogs without asking.

I've never had something like that happen and sure hope it never does! Smitty would be O.K. with it (not Ilda) but it would be ME people like that would end up having to worry about.

I read these stories and I just wonder where some of you live?

anyway if you're out in public your dog better be 100% rock solid, or you better be 100% on your game and your dog's best advocate. If either is present, it's a non issue. How does a complete stranger spend any time roughing up your dog if you're on your game?

 

Yeaaaaa I see red if anyone touches my dogs without even establishing eye contact with me, let alone not asking in general. What I just learned to do was create a barrier between my dog and a potential unwelcome pet-ee by using my body or straight up use my eyes as a 'back off' measure, because if A.) My pup reacts in any way I'm responsible for his behavior, or B.) The person getting too close might have a more high percentage of being bitten by me in some way rather than my dog lol.

In my case...if the leash is on and you're in my personal space...dog included...you're instantly puppy chow lol


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I was wondering if people are always like this... This weekend we took our 15 week old girl apple picking, and while many of the dozens of people who stopped to play with Juno asked me first, i was amazed how many small children and toddlers walked unattended right up to her. At one point my family and I were sitting on a blanket taking a break, and Juno was having some food that I packed for her, and a 2 or 3 year old kid came right up and grabbed a handful of her food right out from under her face! We have been routinely been touching her food and moving so she isn't too sensitive about that, but what if she had been?! OMG I was stunned to see that the parents were smiling and watching right from their blanket. SERIOUSLY? I told them that they really needed to watch their child (I had three of my own with me, not including Juno) because they don't know my dog at all. They seemed insulted. Duh.

 

Congratulations to you for having the courage to say something to the parents!!

I took Molly to a fun open swim day for dogs at a public swimming pool.
They did have lots of rules and one of them was that - No humans in the pool.. There were 2 families that let their small children in the pool with the dogs. I know my dog does not always like children, so it was a bit tense for us at times and kind of ruined some fun. Are their kids not human? Are they parents not concerned for the kids safety? This swim was for large dogs only (the small breeds had their own time) and the risk of the kids getting hurt and knocked down by happy, crazy and excited dogs that outweighed them was very high.

 

I always get shocked with these threads because people seem to forget that the public's expectation is that YOUR DOG is bulletproof. If you bring your dog around people, especially children, you almost have a legal responsibility that your dog doesn't do anything. No one is going to care that some 30 lbs 2 year old grabbed your 90 lbs GSD by the ear and that's what caused it to bite. They're going to see a 90 lbs GSD that just bit a child. And if you think your dog would react that way, and can't prevent that from happening, then you should probably not bring your dog around children.

I don't have a kid, my dog has never been pet by a single child that hasn't asked. And I take my dog to a lot of family type places like the ones that have been described by the various people here. What I quickly realize, is that its families and children first, and I'm just lucky that they ALLOW pet dogs. It's not a right for the dog to be there, its a privilege.

I'm with the one poster...no one is getting near my dog to rile it up "in a split second" and not giving me time to react and prevent it. When I walk through those types of places, he's in heel, and if someone can get to within 1 foot of me without me noticing they're there...I'm not paying enough attention to the fact that I have a dog with me and my surroundings.

 

Good post.

Have posted similar on many of these types of threads.
The OP's dog handled this situation well but no way a bloke would even get a chance to do this to my dog without getting an earful.
I am always amazed at how many people post about taking unstable dogs (not this one) out amongst the public......I don't see it happening so much over here.....probably due to our over the top laws.

 

I'm glad your dog did not reactive negatively. "NO" means no in many languages and a hand signal like open palm towards the man might also signify "stop". I know it probably happened all so quickly.

We had something similar happen to us in Carmel, a very dog friendly town. A man from another country, sounded German, and maybe was happy to see a GSD, came up quickly and was over my dog in a matter of a second it seemed. I turned my eye off my dog to take a bite of a sandwich, and then there was this huge man with his body over my dog and our table. I yelled, NO.

 

I agree the dogs should be rock solid and that is the expectation but it still surprises me how trusting the general public is in that expectation. I expect motorists to see me when I'm out running but I still look both ways before crossing them even though I have the right away because the reality is that a lot don't see me. I wouldn't let my child run up to a strange dog because the dog is expected to behave. I'm not that trusting. I guess common sense is something of the past.

 

Exactly, it's about balance. Don't bring a Cujo to a place with many uncontrollable/uncontrolled situations but also people should be respectful of other people's pets/property.

If you have a really nice car that you've restored from the ground up, take it to a public place doesn't mean people have the right to touch it, sit on it, kick the tires or open the door and sit inside with their kids and their dripping melting icecream cones.

I don't think that common sense is a thing of the past but rather we dog owners need re-establish what common sense IS around dogs.

Time to stand up to people nicely and educate them if you can and if they are really pushy rude....then it's time to be blunt and loud.

I agree the dogs should be rock solid and that is the expectation but it still surprises me how trusting the general public is in that expectation. I expect motorists to see me when I'm out running but I still look both ways before crossing them even though I have the right away because the reality is that a lot don't see me. I wouldn't let my child run up to a strange dog because the dog is expected to behave. I'm not that trusting. I guess common sense is something of the past.

 

Geez, alright. A few things: My dog is stable. My dog can be approached, I expect people to approach us. Like I said in my OP, *most* people asked. I do not care, my dog loves people, kids, animals. He is FINE in public. I've brought him numerous busy places, restaurants, downtown Chicago, pet stores...he has always been on his best behavior, and changes a lot of peoples perception about this breed.

And, I dont understand how now I am wrong for bringing my dog to a place where dogs ARE ALLOWED? There were MANY dogs there.

I dont think you guys are understanding HOW busy this place was. I literally GLANCED a different direction for one second, and by the time I glanced back at my dog, this guy was all over him. I only have two eyes, cant watch everyone at all times. I did my best.

As I've stated, I TRIED to get this guy away and off my dog. He didnt pay ANY attention to me, and his group (of like 10 people) practically surrounded us. Oh, and this guy was GRABBING my dogs fur. I dont want to pull my dog away when this guy is grabbing him. As soon as I could leave, I DID, this whole encounter lasted less than 2 minutes, I wasnt standing there for 10 minutes watching this happen.

Sure, coulda been handled differently, I guess. But the guy wasnt listening to me, didnt speak English, and him and his group apparently thought it was comical. I really think he was trying to get my dog to bite him. It was a bizarre encounter.

Anyways, I dont know why this thread went in this direction. My dog didnt do anything wrong. He handled this situation as good as any dog could. I cant control some crazy guy who doesnt understand English coming up to my dog and doing this. It happened really quick.

 

I wouldn't get too involved in some of the negative passive aggressive with ridiculously right winged ideals for a dogs personal space and comfort get to you.

What people forget is that dogs are just as valuable, and have feelings like people too. They deserve every amount of respect a human demands, because for one...no grown man, woman, senior, adolescent, teen, or child would dare walk up to someone and just get in their face, touch their hair, pull on their ear rings, or just stay in someones personal space.

It's rude.

And although they're are a lot of dog friendly places, but when a dog is on a leash and someone approaches, don't be fooled by who's side takes who's. People have common sense and responsibilities of their own, and when you see a dog you don't know-don't touch it. Literally rule number one.

You did nothing wrong, and if worse came to worse and your dog bit, in my eyes oh well. Pup is on a leash, multiple warnings were given, approach at your own risk. Common sense people.

We can't have high expectations for our dogs and demand them to act perfect with a full disregard to how they feel in any way, when in the heat of our personal moments we humans can't and don't have 100% control of our feelings when the line is crossed and we are in the same situation.


Live and learn, make mistakes, and create solutions. Don't give into the peer pressure of hypocritical dog training bullying, no dog is fully done learning, and no trainer knows it all.

You did a great job handling yourself and seeking consultation and help. And thank everyone who gave a positive, reinforcing support and advice.

It's amazing how people preach to use positive reinforcement with our dogs, yet so hypocritical when someone seeks some help.


Lighten up and support our GSD Community the right way. Positively.


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OP. You are in the right here. Your dog did great and you should be proud.

We talk a lot on this board about making sure a dog is "bomb proof" before taking them out in public. But how the heck do we do that unless we take them out in public???

This past weekend I took my 9 mo male to a HOWL-O-WINE. A wine festival that's dog friendly. I told all of my friends that it very may well be a quick trip for me. If my boy started being stupid, we were out. But he did amazing. Even being tolerant if wiener dogs dressed as dinosaurs running up to him on a Flexi leash. But we met amazing people, including a former military K9 handler who stopped to talk.

Sometimes, you just have to go. Had I been truly scared he was going to aggress, I would not have gone. I was more worried about rudeness. He is rude.

Yes we need to be proactive, especially with dogs in an environment with alcohol.

But you can't know your dog until you get them out. I feel sure that if the OP had any inkling her dog was not going to be tolerant, they would not have been there.

Good for you OP and good for your boy. Sounds like you had a great time and your boy was a great embassador for the breed!!!


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My statement stands, if they can't give you a positive outlook or advice without criminalizing you, then don't even bother reading some of the hypocritical and ill informed comments. Not every dog of any size gets put down for no reason, without protocol, quarantine, or investigation.

If a person ignores common sense of space and respect for both owner and companion over cause and effect, then you are 100% not to blame and covered. I've seen it so mamy times working in the shelter, and 98% of our bite cases turned out in home or shelter quarintine. Police who 'shoot' or 'take away' dogs is an overplayed fear based concept of bite protocol. Every county, town, state, and so on have laws that they too obey.

What others don't realize is that people of all kinds need boundaries, and dogs do too. No one can look me in the eye and say 'the law is the law and dogs are nothing but valueless property' when a leashed dog attacks the 'attacked' is always confronted with the famous, 'now what did YOU do?' despite child, elder, or adult. Every cop asks 'Where was the parent? Why was your child not supervised? Why didn't you listen to the owner when they gave warning? Walked away?' Dogs that make the news are always unleashed, out of a fenced area, dog park, etc. You don't ever really hear a properly leashed dog doing anything wrong but expressing it's feelings and boundaries of comfort. Any owner who cannot pick up on that, refuse the body language and warning signs, and does nothing to prevent it then expect their dog of any breed to be perfectly tolerant and motionless is just in denial of their own problems.

Our animals are an exact reflection of us and our energy, and the value of your dog needs to be respected in every way, just as yourself. If people are too headstrong and stubborn to realize it, then pay no mind.

A dog is a dog, and behaves like a dog. Lives like a dog. Feels like a dog. It is up to us to raise the dog right, and protect them as they would protect us with 100% loyalty. You will make mistakes, while learning from them, and pay mind to some people who are just too full of themselves to value their pup above what society labels.




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I have had someone shove their little dachshund in my pit mixes' face, had a kid that was barely old enough to walk sneak up behind us and yank on Eko's tail, people have pulled on Eko's ears and face after I gave permission to pet (but not pull on him), people have run up on my pit mix who is scared of people and pet her all over while she cowers, people letting their dogs run up to Eko even when I say no, don't, I am not surprised at what people do anymore. We are in the middle of training to work on Eko's dog aggression and Xena's fear of people, Eko wears a muzzle in public now since I don't trust him 100% yet and people still do all the same things as before. Xena will not bite no matter how scared she gets but she could be shaking, drooling, and wetting herself in a ball at my feet and people will still pet her as they would any other dog.

I agree that dogs shouldn't be out in public unless they are bulletproof but sometimes that is not always possible. People should use common sense but that's not always going to happen either. Since I can't do anything about them all I can do is work with my dogs, which in this case means I need to go out in public. So either way there are risks.

 

Sarah...

It's not that I think that dangerous dogs shouldn't be out in public, its that most people shouldn't and won't take their fearful or aggressive dog to an extremely busy place. You also shouldn't take your dog to a place where people are shoulder to shoulder if you don't know how it will react no matter what or who might come up to that dog. It's not the general public's job to socialize your dog...and on top of that...a busy fair or a place like OP was that is not the right place to be socializing your dog anyways.

Here's the point. I take my dog to a lot of places like this, but I'm never surprised at how people react when they're around my dog. If he had any issues with people running up to him or touching him without my permission...I wouldn't take him to places where that can happen. If he did have issues...I wouldn't be taking him there and then yelling at people or trying to educate people about how they shouldn't be touching my dog and how their kids aren't acting correctly. I'm always of the thought that I need to control what I can control and not expect to teach others how to act.

 

Yet in European countries you can take your dog so many more places....because people are more educated, dog owners and the general public.

In the U.S. what has happened and will continue to happen is there will be more and more restrictions placed on dogs because in the U.S. we buy into 'it's always the dogs fault no matter what' idea.

Time to push back else doing more of the same will result in more of the same, less and less freedom to take our dogs to public places.

It's about balance and most of us get you can't take a fear aggressive biter to a public gathering, the other side of the equation is even my super safe loveable goober dog Smitty, if jumped from behind and startled may nip. No dog is perfect and every dog has it's breaking point so where does this lead then? To banning dogs from public events/gatherings entirely, if you cannot 150% guarantee your dog won't ever bite/nip anyone ever.

Sarah...

It's not that I think that dangerous dogs shouldn't be out in public, its that most people shouldn't and won't take their fearful or aggressive dog to an extremely busy place. You also shouldn't take your dog to a place where people are shoulder to shoulder if you don't know how it will react no matter what or who might come up to that dog. It's not the general public's job to socialize your dog...and on top of that...a busy fair or a place like OP was that is not the right place to be socializing your dog anyways.

Here's the point. I take my dog to a lot of places like this, but I'm never surprised at how people react when they're around my dog. If he had any issues with people running up to him or touching him without my permission...I wouldn't take him to places where that can happen. If he did have issues...I wouldn't be taking him there and then yelling at people or trying to educate people about how they shouldn't be touching my dog and how their kids aren't acting correctly. I'm always of the thought that I need to control what I can control and not expect to teach others how to act.

 

Think of it this way, the more we worry about liability the more money insurance companies make.

True, but it makes me feel safer to know that I have coverage when someone tells me that they like to drink a 6-pack and swim across the river. If (or when) I accidently run them over and they lose a leg, they'll get the medical and long-term care they'll need. I can't help thinking this way, lol. Maybe things do get blown out of proportion, but even my neighbor is in the middle of something because they were fooling around with an ATV, while drinking, and a girl ended up with brain damage when she fell off. Who's fault was it? Her father doesn't think she bears any responsibility and is suing the ATV owner. But then again, permanent brain damage has ruined her future, hasn't it?

 

Eh, well, that's a call you make personally, comfort level.

But if you look at how many hours are spent boating vs how many people get their legs cut off at what point does a .000001% chance justify paying an extra $500 a month to insure a boat? Is there any real data, empirical evidence to support this?

You know it is possible to have ATVs and Cars and boats with sensors, radar, devices you blow into to detect alcohol on your breath and advanced air bags and safety devices galore (we have the tech) to almost accident/injury proof. It would, however, drive the cost of these vehicles through the roof.

So the question is, how much does society have to pay to protect itself from people who make very poor decisions and at what point does idiot proofing society (from a small overall number of accidents) restrict all of our freedoms?

True, but it makes me feel safer to know that I have coverage when someone tells me that they like to drink a 6-pack and swim across the river. If (or when) I accidently run them over and they lose a leg, they'll get the medical and long-term care they'll need. I can't help thinking this way, lol. Maybe things do get blown out of proportion, but even my neighbor is in the middle of something because they were fooling around with an ATV, while drinking, and a girl ended up with brain damage when she fell off. Who's fault was it? Her father doesn't think she bears any responsibility and is suing the ATV owner. But then again, permanent brain damage has ruined her future, hasn't it?

 

Where I live, we have legislation to protect the public from dangerous dogs. They can/will be seized and PTS. I'm assuming it would cost me $20,000 in legal fees to fight this, but that's just my guess. I wonder how many other dogs owners in my area even know about this, when I see their stressed dogs. If someone actually told me to get away from their dog because it might bite, they'd be getting quite an earful from me. I'm not saying the dog doesn't deserve personal space. I'm saying that whether it does or not is irrelevant: the dog will be judged on its behavior.

 

I am so confused.


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I am so confused.
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Me too, the only thing I understand that according to SageDogs it is all Bush's fault.