A big fat NO WAY on the dog parks. Leerburg | Dog Parks: Why They Are A Bad Idea
That is a decent/good article, but it must be added that GSDs also tend to play very rough...other dog owners can be quite put off by it. Also, ONE bad experience could very well give him lifetime issues.

Your little guy needs to really get out n' about! His reaction is fear based due to the submissive peeing. At least that what it seems like. If you can (I know times are tight) try getting a GSD experienced trainer to guide you and your pup.

If a trainer isn't in your financial or time budget...

Introduce him to a very playful and gentle dog. Then as many more as you can. This worked magic for me, as I could not afford puppy class. If you can afford puppy class, by all means take it!

His behavior can become a problem...there are a few things I would recommend.

1) Introduce him to as many people and dogs, in as many places, as you can. Always make it positive, and back off if he is overstimulated. Find a reward that reeeaaaally floats his boat. Use it LOTS.

2) Find that golden reward of his (pieces of steak or cheese, a certain toy, playing tug w/you, etc.) and let him have that whenever he looks at you. Build this up nice and solid, gradually increasing the time he looks at you before getting rewarded.
When you feel more comfortable, do this in more places of your house. Then the backyard. Then the front yard. Then the front yard and out on walks with distractions far away. Then keep building until he stares at you when something weird happens.
Easier said than done, I know

Things that helped me n' my pup: Introduce to other playful dogs, playing tug and fetch on a long line in my front yard while the world whizzed by, carrying food with me and counter conditioning, and time.

A lot of this could very well just be a fear period.

 

My husband and I have a 4 month old male GSD(you can see him in my avitar). We got him when he was 3.5 months old. He is extremely smart and has learned to respond to his name (Bronson) and the commands 'come' 'sit' 'stay' 'heal' 'leave it' and 'give it' in that short amount of time. We are using treat-based positive training techniques (when he does the command asked of him, he gets a treat and lots of petting and praise). We walk him around our suburban neighborhood for at least 20 - 30 minutes a day and we train for about 10 - 15 minutes a day. He is a great dog in the yard and on walks, when it's just him and us.

But when he see's anyone, dog, person, or cars driving by, he gets overly excited and barks repeatedly (machine-gun) and tries to lunge and charge at them. We've been letting him "meet" the person or dog if they are willing and he stops barking to let them pet him - but always starts peeing submissively. He does this sometimes when we're playing, or when we first let him out in the morning. :crazy:

When the people and/or dogs are not willing to meet him, (usually because he sounds and looks so fierce and aggressive) we just tell him 'no' and 'quiet' to try and stop his barking/lunging and keep walking in the opposite direction. He continues to bark and pull at the leash until they are either out of sight or far enough away that he loses interest.

I've been reading up on this and some people say that dog parks are great because it gives them lots of opportunities to socialize with other dogs and people. Some say not to go to dog parks till your dog is much older, in case he has a bad experience with another dog that will scar him for life and he will always be fearful/aggressive towards others.

In that case how are we supposed to socialize him to more dogs and people??

How have you socialized you're GSD's toward other dogs and people? And fear/aggression towards cars driving by? How long will this behavior last?

Any comments are welcome. Thanks so much!

~ Hilary

Your puppy is so cute!! You just described my 4 month old male perfectly. I feel better now! We also got Jake at 3.5 mos. old. He is smart, learns fast. We have 2 other dogs in our house that he is fine with. He will only pees submissively when my husband, son or son-in-law go over to pet him. Getting a little better, but since we are all under one roof, and he's been here for a month...I find it strange. He lets out a little bark if someone comes up to him on a walk, will allowed to be petted, but isn't overly excited about it. But if he encounters other dogs (pet stores, vet, walks..) forget it. Same situation, and very discourgaing. I honestly don't think a puppy class would let him in. I'm just going to keep bringing him around as many places as possible and try to work on his focus...which he doesn't have at the moment. Good luck with your boy!

 

I don't do the dog parks..so I have no advice about that.

Puppy class is wonderful. It's not that expensive either. You should check into that. The plus side to this..You could meet some good doggie owners to hang out with outside of training.

When my male use to be afraid.....I drove up to mall with him. We would sit out in the parking lot with the windows rolled down. He would listen and hear all the busy sounds. We did that for a week or so. Then we moved on to a children's park. We would just sit in the car so he could hear the sounds. After a few visits there, we went to the walmart parking lot. After awhile of doing that, we took him out of the car and stood by the car. It took awhile...but he calmed down. The sounds, smells, and people didn't bother him anymore.

Your little guy is just scared. Probably a huge overload of sounds, smells, and noise.

 

Dogs parks can be very hit or miss with GSDs, and often more miss than hit. He could be showing signs of fear, or he could just be that excited; either way, you'll want to work on it, and a puppy class is generally the best way to go about that, IMO. You should be able to google for puppy classes near you, and call a couple and see what the cost is, and find out if you can observe a class without your pup first. If you like the trainer's methods (I think with puppies it should really be more positive based than anything, like you're doing now), then enroll him. I feel the class should have playtime and a little bit of one-on-one focusing so the pup gets to be in with the other dogs, but also learns to focus on you with distractions. And the trainer should be able to offer you lots of suggestions on how to socialize him without letting him get scared or too ramped up.

He looks like a total cutie!

 

I would go to a obed/puppy class before I'd go to a dog park. With that, check out trainers/puppy classes in your area and get him into one. Good training not only for the dog but for you as well on how to deal with situations.

 

I'd like to share my personal experience.
My dog is now 8 months, so I'll have to go backwards for you.

When Kira was 3.5 months, I was walking past a dog park. The particular park was an open field, without fencing or boundaries..

I was simply walking, and another GSD came over and pinned my puppy, causing her tremendous fear and future anxiety towards other dogs.

Fast forward...

Following that incident, my puppy would be very afraid of any dogs larger than her. She would cower behind me, and tuck her tail.

What I did was make "play dates" with other pups, that I knew would not pose a threat. She was fine.
Then somewhere along the way, I would venture to the dog park ( just to see how she's doing), and I'd be very disappointed to see that she would just sit next to me. On occasion, another dog would aggressively play with her, and she would yelp and run and hide.

After seeing this, and taking the advice to stay away, I finally decided that dog parks were not in her best interest.

I would suggest that you make play dates, join obedience school, and bring her wherever you go. Get lots of greetings from people, and do whatever you possibly can, to make other dogs a positive experience.

Kira is now 8 months, she's fully socialized, still a bit skittish around other dogs, but very friendly and social.

BTW....puppy class are a must!!!!!!

 

Agreed with everyone who suggested puppy classes. Even if you don't need help with the obedience training aspect the classes are a great opportunity for socializing, and learning manners and bite inhibition with other dogs close to his age. We've been taking our four month old girl since she was about 12 weeks and she loves it. She is still cautious with new dogs, especially those bigger than her, but cautious in a good way, not fearful or anxious. So it's definitely worth the price of admission in my opinion, and you may learn something about training and dealing with situations and problems too.

I'm not so sure about dog parks myself either. Before we even consider taking Jasmine to one I will definitely go without her and check it out. See what the place is like, how many dogs are generally there and how easy it would be to intervene and stop a potential fight or scuffle should one occur. I'd be much more apt to take her to someplace with more control and supervision than to a park where you don't know what to expect.

 

I got my dog when she was 3 months and started classes with her about 2 weeks later. The first class only had one other dog-a german shepherd mix, so we had a lot of one on one training and puppy play time was fine because although mine was 5 months younger, she was rougher, but the other dog handled it well. We are graduating from our second class today and mine loves other dogs and people. I credit this to early socialization(or as early as I could get) in the puppy classes. I also considered the dog park, I had my dogs registered there before my german shepherd came along and my 4 month old golden was viciously attacked by a Rott. I found another dog park, with less aggressive dogs, but it wasn't the same. I had fear that a poodle would hurt my baby I guess it depends on the dog, but I know mine plays rough and that can turn into a fight(with the dog and other dog owners) Mine is very high energy and a "normal" dog would be freaked out by her play. So I'm leaning toward never going to a dog park, I don't ever want to see another dog fight like I did when my golden got attacked. But I will keep her in some kind of classes all the time to keep the stimulation and socialization at a good level.

 

I've been thru this one. I'll tell you what was suggested to me and can also tell you it worked *wonders.*

Do you have a city park or other place where you can go and just sit, far off the beaten path? Somewhere there is a decent amount of activity, but you can get away from it far enough that the dog isn't reacting? Prior to going, make sure he's good and worn out. Sit down and give him some treats, have him do some simple sits, etc. Maybe play a little tug. Let him check things out, but if he reacts, you're too close so move back. If he doesn't care about the people/bikes/kids, etc from your distance, slowly move it in. This could take many sessions. It did for us. Many. Each session might only gain five feet from the last session. You might not want to even move it up each time. Keep it at 25 or whatever feet for four or five sessions. Literally until the dog is kind of bored!

We can now go to the city park and sit within a foot of the walkway, while skateboards, bicycles, tricycles, toddlers, walkers, people pushing strollers, joggers - you name it - go on by and Bailey just looks at them all. He will get excited if a dog goes by, though, because he wants to play with all of them. I never would've believed this was possible when we first started, but it has worked better than I ever imagined. Good luck!

Oh oops ETA - No dog park now. Not a good place if he's fearful/reactive like you explain. I also strongly support the classes, but I'd try the above for a few weeks before starting. It will be very overwhelming for him if he's acting this way to just be flooded by 10 dogs and owners in a room all of the sudden. It's also likely to stress you out pretty bad.

 

Thanks for all the comments. Alot of good info!

My husband looked up some local puppy classes in our area, and there were about 8 different ones. 3 of which said they would not take unsocialized dogs (what's the point of a puppy socialization class if they don't allow unsocialized pups!?!?) or dogs that showed aggressive behavior (He's never bit anyone but with the barking/growling/lunging he seems pretty aggressive outwardly and they probably wouldn't let him in. :crazy.

They are also expensive! Anywhere from $200 to $300! Unfortunately that's way out of our budget right now.

There was a few one-on-one trainers we looked up as well, but I'm not sure he needs that since he is learning with us just fine. It's mostly just the socialization I'm worried about.

I think I will try some of the slow methods first, and try to find people with nice, playful dogs for him to meet.

 

I just want to clarify..... There's a VERY GOOD chance that your pup at 4 months is NOT aggressive. Don't tell people that he is. He's more than likely excited to play, or afraid. Bring him around people as much as possible.

Look into local dog clubs. They sometimes offer volunteer training, in exchange for joining their "club"

 

I too agree with the puppy/obedience classes over a dog park. Having done both, I feel that Juno has gotten far more positive dog and people socialization at the classes then at the park. The environments is far more controlled and it helps you to see what freaks your dog out and what doesn't and what you can do to work on it.

Juno has had three rather bad experiences (all with large male labs, a brown one, a black one, and a yellow one, oddly enough) that has made her afraid of larger dogs, particularly labs. Two of those experiences occurred at an off leash park. So I am very very careful about when and where I take Juno regarding places she might encounter other off leash dogs.

Thankfully, she's made friends with a larger male GSD pup at her obedience course that seems to have diffused a lot of the initial fear she had. But I think it's better to not put your dog in a position where it's likely you may have combat possible issues later.

Your pup's temperment sounds really similar to my girl. Especially the "machine-gun" barking. I laughed when I read that, cuz I thought to myself, THAT'S JUNO!

 

dear god, please don't take your puppy to a dog park.

find a friend who has a good dog, and take them for walks at first, eventually let them play after a while.

your guy is waaaaaay too young for a dog park. i'd wait till he was at least 2 years old before even thinking about one. people at dog parks have very poorly socialized and trained dogs, and you don't want to set your dog back or make him fearful of bigger dogs.

*edit*

just saw your respone!! yay! good for you!
don't give in to him barking and lunging. he gets to meet the dog when he's calm, not before.

also, i hate to say this, but do you have like a petsmart in your area? they usually have puppy intro classes that will let you socialize him with other dogs.

 

None of our friends or family has any dogs (weird, I know). :crazy:

Yes there is a Petsmart about 15 or 20 miles from where we live. I looked on their website and there's no information about puppy socialization classes. The closest thing to that was called Doggy Day Camp, which sounds like you leave your dog there all day - not really something I want to do, as I'd rather be part of his experience. I think I'll call them and ask about it.

 

My dog was like that at that age, and a dog park actually solved the problem. Not the type where you sit around and your dog plays with other dogs while you sit there and wait for something horrible to happen, but the type where you walk your dog over several miles or kilometers and you'll meet a few off leash dogs along the way and the most interaction the dogs have is just greeting each other and then moving on. It's a healthier interaction since the leash isn't messing up either of the dog's body language or causing tension.

The dog park pretty much taught my dog that other dogs weren't that big of a deal to warrant such an overreaction.

If you go to puppy classes, I'd go to one where puppies get to actually interact with each other, not the kind where dogs are forbidden from going near each other. That just escalates the problem and makes the dog think that there's a reason the other dogs aren't approachable.

Another thing you could try is one-on-one socialization classes with a trainer. Some of these trainers have very tolerant dogs who are totally nonreactive to even the most reactive or aggressive dogs. That can help get you started.

 

I don't suggest just letting this dog run loose in a dog park as he is clearly fearful already. That being said, if your park has a nice small dog area, you can try to take him in there. I know at our parks there are usually a very small amount of dogs (if any) in that area and your dog can build up confidence that way. A bigger park always helps so that all the dogs aren't all in one place but sometimes that's not possible.

My dog goes to the dog park on a weekly basis, but he was never fearful like your pup. He barely barks to this day. I know people have had bad experiences but I would actually say that the majority of experiences are good. If you really don't have dogs to socialize with, the small dog area might be a great way for you to go while your boy is still young and a pup. I train my dog in the small dog area of our park, that way he has distractions outside the fence but no dogs running up to him and completely distracting him. Just an observation to help you understand that there usually aren't dogs in there as I am free to take my 1.5 year old in there without an issue.

 

As someone who has raised a fear reactive pup, I would advise against puppy classes altogether. I went through several different trainers and a behaviorist and this is what I learned:

1. It is more likely than not that the behavior you are seeing is genetic. This is not something that can simply be trained out of dog if this is the case.

2. Because of these genetics, your dog has developed a certain threshold, which at this point, seems to be very low based on what you've shared so far. Puppy classes would be putting your pup in a situation that is above that threshold, and instead of learning to adapt and deal with the situations that make him uncomfortable, you are throwing him to the fire. Kinda like putting a claustrophobic in a small box, closing them in, and saying, "Deal with it!"

3. Do not seek out puppy classes, seek out a behaviorist or a class that deals with these type behavior dogs. I found regular puppy classes with a fear reactive pup to be a waste of time and money because you are sitting there trying to control outbursts, while the trainer teaches everyone how to sit, stay, and down, and your issues are not really being addressed.

4. You HAVE to condition your pup to gradually accept the things that cause him to react or become fearful. I would get up and take my pup to an empty park early in the morning or to a vacant field. We would sit and watch people or dogs pass from 100 yards away. I would give her time to acclimate to her surroundings. Let her see things from a safe distance. As her confidence built, and she grew more at ease, we would move closer. Working with a behaviorist will help you to learn to read his body signals and see the reactions before they happen, and redirect him before they happen.

5. This takes A LOT of dedication, time, and consistency, but over time, you will see improvement. It won't happen overnight, and he will most likely never be that dog you can take anywhere, but both you and he will learn to manage it.

My girl is almost 3 years old now, and I wasted a lot of money on useless classes and trainers before I learned what I was doing wrong. She is still not a take anywhere type dog, but I CAN walk her down the street or take her to the park (no dog parks!), and control her outbursts. She has learned to relax and that every person, strange dog, or object is not a cause for alarm. Look for books and articles on reactive dogs and fear based behaviors. There is a lot to learn. I wish you the best of luck with your pup, and if I can offer any further info, I would be more than happy to help!

 

I have been bringing my 4 mo. old to the elementary school just before classes begin every day. All the buses, cars, crossing guard blowing the whistle...at first he was barky and seemed "on guard"...or uncertain. Today..he was actually really good - I was very proud of him. We stand back and watch all the commotion...he just sits and takes it all in calmly.
Next week maybe we'll graduate to the dog walk and sit on a bench (away from everyone) and watch.

 

I have been bringing my 4 mo. old to the elementary school just before classes begin every day. All the buses, cars, crossing guard blowing the whistle...at first he was barky and seemed "on guard"...or uncertain. Today..he was actually really good - I was very proud of him. We stand back and watch all the commotion...he just sits and takes it all in calmly.
Next week maybe we'll graduate to the dog walk and sit on a bench (away from everyone) and watch.

Brilliant idea.

 

Most have mentioned good points to follow. Issues that effect a puppy in a negative way can go on for a lifetime. Not every puppy is the same, but given what your experiencing you have to not push and minimize the chance of those reactions at this point. Which obviously means that you need to set the table and change the situation if it causes the behavior.

As someone else mentioned socialization should be at a "safe" distance where if the pup remains calm as it looks at a dog in the distance, then they need to be rewarded big time. In some pups, if managed slowly and rewarded for positive behavior exhibited and they can grow out of the behavior. Others just do not and again, you will attempt to keep those negative triggers to a minimum as to not stress the pup/dog. Takes a plan and consistant work but the end result is surely worth it.