[msvette2u]

Actually the Dane would be taller, not smaller, due to early neuter.

 

[krystyne73]

Actually the Dane would be taller, not smaller, due to early neuter.

you think so? I have been told I runted him by the early neuter.
of course he is large to most people but his dad was 3 inches taller and 50 lbs heavier.

Max weighs only 129lbs and 33 in at the shoulder.

 

[msvette2u]

Yes, neutering before puberty can delay closure of the long-bones. Size has a lot to do with hereditary and he would have gotten half his genetic makeup from mama
I don't know what's average for a Dane, but that sounds pretty large to me!

 

[krystyne73]

Yes, neutering before puberty can delay closure of the long-bones. Size has a lot to do with hereditary and he would have gotten half his genetic makeup from mama
I don't know what's average for a Dane, but that sounds pretty large to me!

He is on the small side, but his breeder had huge danes. Females can get as tall as 33 in and males 36 in. But I figure that is why he is living so long and well. lol

hmmm now I have to research this further...thanks

 

[RocketDog]

Emoore, if I already had my dog under anesthesia for a neuter I would have the gastroplexy done if there is a history of torsion. I would not have it done just to have it done and believe it shouldn't be done as a preventative in a breeding animal.

IMO a responsible owner is one that does what is best for their situation and the well being of their dogs. For some that means spay/neuter. For others that means leaving their dogs intact. This should be a choice of each owner and not something that is forced on people through guilt or laws.

Though Selzer's comments and opinions about s/n are a bit over the top and too blunt even for me I understand why she feels this way. At no time have I ever seen people trying to force others to keep all of their dogs intact. I have never seen laws being proposed to force mandatory intact dogs. I have never seen anyone attacked for not having testicles on their male dog. There is no agenda out there to force people to keep their dogs intact.

I am a fairly recent member here, but it does seem to me that OUTSIDE of this board, there is a definite information wave to spay and neuter.

ON this board however, it is definitely the other way around. People say things like "mutilate" "cut open" "sacrifice on the altar of responsibility" (which btw, there are other people who have posted on this board, not in this thread but in a similar one, who are MUCH more vehement than poor selzer, who is taking the brunt here) and make you feel like you're a uneducated monster for even considering speutering. Oh, and for sure an irresponsible one.

It's enough to just make me walk away from the whole board, which would be a loss for me, as I enjoy the pictures, the stories and the training and behavior tips I find otherwise.

 

[Mrs.K]

Why would you walk away because of somebody who has a different opinion than you?

Your post is full of sarcasm and irony just the "poor Selzer" comment alone shows me that you've got no problems at all to stand up for your believe. Don't walk away, stick to your believes and opinions. And what the heck is wrong about saying 'I won't let anyone cut open my dog.' if it is the truth, it's the truth. I won't let it happen to any of my dogs without a medical reason.

If you want to speuter that is your decision but I don't have to do it just because it's a popular thing to do. Again, live and let live. I respect your decision, you respect mine, nuff said

I am a fairly recent member here, but it does seem to me that OUTSIDE of this board, there is a definite information wave to spay and neuter.

ON this board however, it is definitely the other way around. People say things like "mutilate" "cut open" "sacrifice on the altar of responsibility" (which btw, there are other people who have posted on this board, not in this thread but in a similar one, who are MUCH more vehement than poor selzer, who is taking the brunt here) and make you feel like you're a uneducated monster for even considering speutering. Oh, and for sure an irresponsible one.

It's enough to just make me walk away from the whole board, which would be a loss for me, as I enjoy the pictures, the stories and the training and behavior tips I find otherwise.

 

[Freestep]

ON this board however, it is definitely the other way around. People say things like "mutilate" "cut open" "sacrifice on the altar of responsibility" (which btw, there are other people who have posted on this board, not in this thread but in a similar one, who are MUCH more vehement than poor selzer, who is taking the brunt here) and make you feel like you're a uneducated monster for even considering speutering. Oh, and for sure an irresponsible one.

Yes, it's rather surprising to me that some people feel spay/neuter is wrong and that no one ought to do it. I could understand that viewpoint a bit better if there weren't so many homeless dogs, but in light of the population problem it seems counterproductive to rail against s/n. If you don't want to spay/neuter your own dogs, that's fine, but to tell the general public they shouldn't either? It's going to compound the problem, IMO.

I have a client who breeds cats. She isn't a "breeder", she just collects cats and doesn't believe in s/n because it isn't "natural"; ergo, she always has kittens being born. She doesn't believe in vaccinations or Western medicine, either, so her cats are always sickly and full of parasites, and a good number of them die from disease despite her attempts at homeopathic and herbal "cures".

So I guess that's one method of population control.

 

[msvette2u]

...it seems counterproductive to rail against s/n. If you don't want to spay/neuter your own dogs, that's fine, but to tell the general public they shouldn't either? It's going to compound the problem, IMO.

Exactly.

 

[RocketDog]

Why would you walk away because of somebody who has a different opinion than you?

Your post is full of sarcasm and irony just the "poor Selzer" comment alone shows me that you've got no problems at all to stand up for your believe. Don't walk away, stick to your believes and opinions. And what the heck is wrong about saying 'I won't let anyone cut open my dog.' if it is the truth, it's the truth. I won't let it happen to any of my dogs without a medical reason.

If you want to speuter that is your decision but I don't have to do it just because it's a popular thing to do. Again, live and let live. I respect your decision, you respect mine, nuff said

This is exactly the problem with the internet. I'm not in ANY way trying to be sarcastic or ironic. I am not mad, sad, angry or anything other than just stating my view this morning. I did feel kind of bad for selzer, she was mentioned quite a bit. I wasn't being sarcastic at all.

In fact, I was going to PM you and ask you about Germany. My dearest and best friend is German, she's from Trier. She lived here almost 10 years and moved back two years ago. I miss her terribly.

 

[msvette2u]

I know in Germany, pet breeding is heavily regulated. We have a gorgeous Red double dapple Dachshund girl and I brought her to one of our vets we use that is from Germany. He said "She's a nice pet, but in Germany they'd have killed her".

 

[Emoore]

I know in Germany, pet breeding is heavily regulated. We have a gorgeous Red double dapple Dachshund girl and I brought her to one of our vets we use that is from Germany. He said "She's a nice pet, but in Germany they'd have killed her".

To clarify for anyone else reading-- it's self-regulated by the breeders and breed clubs. It's not like the Gestapo comes in with guns drawn and kills out of standard puppies. (The mental picture I got when reading the quoted post.) It's just a different mindset in the breeders and breed clubs.

 

[Jack's Dad]

To a lot of people on the forum their dogs are their lives and they are willing to put in many hours of training time. They will do what is required to keep intact animals from breeding. No cost is too much to care for their dogs.
I don't see anything wrong with that if that is what an individual has chosen.

My perspective is different sometimes because I spent most of my adult life raising kids. With kids come less time for dogs. I still loved my dogs and took care of them. I didn't however have time to worry about intact animals. Kids and their friends coming and going, doors and gates being left open.

That is why all my dogs were s/n. That was my decision and I didn't make it because I was irresponsible or lazy. I was busy.

A lot of people seem to have more time available to do things that families do not.
Dogs were part of the family not the family.

 

[msvette2u]

To a lot of people on the forum their dogs are their lives and they are willing to put in many hours of training time. They will do what is required to keep intact animals from breeding. No cost is too much to care for their dogs.
I don't see anything wrong with that if that is what an individual has chosen.

My perspective is different sometimes because I spent most of my adult life raising kids. With kids come less time for dogs. I still loved my dogs and took care of them. I didn't however have time to worry about intact animals. Kids and their friends coming and going, doors and gates being left open.

That is why all my dogs were s/n. That was my decision and I didn't make it because I was irresponsible or lazy. I was busy.

A lot of people seem to have more time available to do things that families do not.
Dogs were part of the family not the family.

Exactly this, too, and I might point out that in another thread, a female's upcoming heat is causing issues with an upcoming trip as well (Sorry, Kzoppa!). We're not lazy. I just really don't want huge issues with incoming fosters in heat or intact, should we have the opposite intact animal here already in our own pack. It's not fun having a Dachshund in heat and having a (now-neutered) 90lb. male who was previously used for breeding. I can think of better things to do with my time, thank you! And yes, the neutered boys can still "perform".

In fact we have 2 female Chi foster dogs that are in heat right now (LOVELY!!!! ) and must be spayed ASAP to attend an upcoming adoption event. Needless to say, they're getting a lot less time out and about in the general play area

Finally, I've made concessions with my own *ahem* monthly issues in my life without having to worry about our pets' reproductive issues for what's left of it!

 

[Freestep]

Finally, I've made concessions with my own *ahem* monthly issues in my life without having to worry about our pets' reproductive issues for what's left of it!

Haha! I totally hear that... I actually went and had myself "mutilated" because I'm too lazy and irresponsible to manage my own reproductive issues and this was the most convenient way to fix it.

Seriously, do female dogs get fibroids?

 

[msvette2u]

To clarify for anyone else reading-- it's self-regulated by the breeders and breed clubs. It's not like the Gestapo comes in with guns drawn and kills out of standard puppies. (The mental picture I got when reading the quoted post.) It's just a different mindset in the breeders and breed clubs.

Oh yeah, I mean I could imagine it the other way (the breeding Gestapo!) but no, the breeders are not breeding for "pretty colors" so wouldn't even try for those colors. They'd correctly view it as a potential health issue.

 

[msvette2u]

Haha! I totally hear that... I actually went and had myself "mutilated" because I'm too lazy and irresponsible to manage my own reproductive issues and this was the most convenient way to fix it.

Ablation works well, too LOL

Seriously, do female dogs get fibroids?

I don't know?

 

[RocketDog]

Ablation works well, too LOL



I don't know?

This. I had it at the suggestion of my gyno because of consistent LONG and heavy periods, polyps, etc...I was 38. Done with kids, etc.

BEST **** THING I'VE EVER DONE.

 

[msvette2u]

This. I had it at the suggestion of my gyno because of consistent LONG and heavy periods, polyps, etc...I was 38. Done with kids, etc.

BEST **** THING I'VE EVER DONE.

I agree! Wish I'd done it years ago, could have saved hundreds on tampax!!!

 

[Jack's Dad]

Alright already. Can we get back to dogs.

 

[RocketDog]

Sorry!