[berno von der seeweise]

Hate to sound all flaky but full moon. No kiddin'. Makes a big difference. You may have just picked the wrong night for your first home depot exposure. Try it again Dec. 7 (last quarter) and again Dec 14 (new moon). Also, be more of a leader/handler and less of an observer. Ignore the other shoppers and focus training to walk on lead.

as for the crate screaming, whatever you do, don't react to it. Don't look at it, don't talk to it, just ignore.

make it a point to let pup see that you just don't care. Get some headphones, park yourself right in front of that crate and binge watch a few seasons on netflix. LOL it may take 2 weeks, but pup will catch on eventually if you do your part.

 

[JodieRN96]

Depends on the dog. Maybe next time put her in a cart and let her look around.

The first time we took our Moose out for socializing we took him to the local Ace Hardware. We figured less people, less intimidating. I placed him in the shopping cart and he was a little nervous at first, but did very well. We have taken him to the feed store several times since, to Bimart, and back to the local hardware store. Each time he does better and we have received endless comments on how handsome and well behaved he is. I'm sure your girl will do better in time. Just take it slow and start with someplace a little less busy, and with much less stimulus.

 

[wolfy dog]

OP, how are you doing? I mean this in a serious way.

 

[EgansMom]

OP, how are you doing? I mean this in a serious way.

We had a more quiet close to home day. Mostly because I get wicked weather headaches. Lots of play inside and out. Some some engagement & name stuff. Provided she gets exercise she is great at calming herself and relaxing.
Good news: she is not afraid of the sound of rain, being in rain, umbrellas, being near the car. Tried a little walk on street but she is distracted by everything (and we haven't really done leash pressure so it's a mess). Good news is she is distracted -interested in everything. It was just now so it was quiet-no dog/people but at least she wasn't scared about being a little further from home.
Also good is that she is getting a little more comfortable exploring further away from me in the house and vice versa.
But when we were playing in the yard just now the neighbor started dragging his garbage bins to the curb. She ran to the side door to come in. I made no notice of it and just got a stick and made playing motions and called and she came racing back to play. Would that be considered "able to recover" from a startle ?
Next on the to do list is bring her out and lots of treats while I rattle my bins.

How am I ? ... trying to take advantage of any quiet times to catch up on rest.

 

[Sabis mom]

But when we were playing in the yard just now the neighbor started dragging his garbage bins to the curb. She ran to the side door to come in. I made no notice of it and just got a stick and made playing motions and called and she came racing back to play. Would that be considered "able to recover" from a startle ?

That is a perfect recovery! I'm glad you got to relax and have some fun together.

 

[EgansMom]

That is a perfect recovery! I'm glad you got to relax and have some fun together.

Ya... she didn't stay stuck. With a little encouragement that is was no big deal she was fine.

 

[Miika's Mom]

Glad to hear that today went well. Now for a restful night😴, or as much as you can with a new baby in the house! 😉

 

[EgansMom]

Ok .. I think she passed the rattle my bin test. It's in the front yard . She moved away at first but easily come back with upbeat fun voice from me. She checked out the metal bin. Sniffed. Took a walk around it. I dragged it a foot (enough to make noise)she moved away again but this time she came back a little more confident and curious. We also saw a neighbor across the street with his little dog just coming in from a walk. She gave them a cursory glance and moved towards them a few steps then came back to me (but she knew I had treats in my pocket).
I think she is doing fine. Maybe these accomplishments seem minor because some of the pups on here are scaling Mount Everest and they are pretty amazing, but I'm proud of her as a little girl away from her family with no pack here except this strange lady.
She also catches on super quick with training. She already goes to the door if she needs to pee (about half the time) and is responding to her name. And she learned VERY quickly how to jump on the couch (I'm ok with it) because she loves snuggling.

 

[wolfy dog]

All good but don't overdo it. You have a lifetime ahead of her. There is a good sticky post about over-socializing but I can't find it. My pups were still in the litter at this age until 11 weeks. The 8 week age can also be a fear period.

 

[EgansMom]

All good but don't overdo it. You have a lifetime ahead of her. There is a good sticky post about over-socializing but I can't find it. My pups were still in the litter at this age until 11 weeks. The 8 week age can also be a fear period.

Sorry just re read my post. By "we saw a neighbor" I meant she gave them a cursory glance from across the street in our front yard. Her reaction was kinda like "ya, whatever". Perfect !

She seems to think under the couch is something of a den. She's flaked out.
Yay. I get to watch a show then we are up to bed. Our schedule starts and ends later.
I had forgotten how exhausting puppyhood is and how you wonder if you both will survive it. lol

 

[Jenny720]

A crate Near your bed at night will not effect anything but Allow you to sleep better. I had one crated one near my bed and one downstairs in the kitchen. You can try a blanket covered partially with adequate ventilation to try to calm her down. I would only let her out of the crate when she is sleeping and not when she is crying - this is the biggest most important lesson in crate training. The pup must be calm and quiet before allowed to leave the crate. If you are letting her out of the crate as she is screaming you are rewarding her for screaming. And showing her wrongly how to behave in a crate. In regards to people it is interesting to compare to see if pups have changed and how. With that said though you should not judge a pup on one outing even a few with no time to bond ever. Just like kids there dots are connected with growth. It can be possible though it would give you a glimpse on how the pup responds to a particular pressure and what will be needed to work on in the future. There are all different kinds of pressure maybe it’s people he is unsure of. Or it can mean a new day can mean a new start and without cause of concern. It can mean all they need is direction to get over the hump and some time and patience. There is always something to work on with your growing pup they are living beings and not machines or fictional characters made of steel. Enjoy your outings with your pup it is important with any degree and kind of nerves. Bad experiences will shape the dogs outlook. You can not judge by one bad outing And not should judge a line but only what you have in front of you. It is important to relax. Nerves are not black and white as you often hear about.

Only going down memory land -The next day after bringing Max home from the breeders. I had brought him to my nephews bday party the day after we had him. it was the end of the party And was my moms house with only my family but yeah he took it in stride. A few days later we traveled out of state with Max to a aunts party xmas eve party where the house was jammed with people and he had no crate and he settled in automatically. iThe very first night I brought Max home (who is a asl line ) who was very quiet at the breeders when we picked him up seemed to know what was going on and also cried a lot on the way home in the car. He investigated the house as soon as we put him on the ground and was chasing all the leaves in the backyard and running around with my son who took to him instantly. There are woods in our backyard and it was at night and was so loud, windy and eerie -almost hurricane type of winds. The trees were blowing like mad. Max was off the leash. He had an option to run back in the house as the sliding glass doors were open but he walked over to me where I stood and middle of the back yard and sat down right next to me and quietly watched the trees dance in the madness with me it was a site to see. It told me a lot about him even back then that we will face any storm together and so we have. I remember going to the breeders and at 4 weeks of age is saw Max cry and whine as his dam left the whelping box through the doggy door to her kennel to eat a cookie. All the other 7 pups just played with each other without a care in the world to where their dam was. Max is still a mommas boy and by my side all the time without being anxious or clingy. I remember he could not get out of the whelping box as a 4 week old pup he just perched his paws on top of it. I remember for a brief moment thinking as I observed this pup at the breeders pining for his momma, I was concerned would this pup have separation anxiety issues and would he be unathletic. As it turned out he is the most athletic dog I ever owned and has no separation anxiety, extremely environmentally sound dog with strong pack drives ,food ball and prey drives and strong protective instincts with a really connection to me.

A 10 week old pup I hooked him up to a sled to as a young puppy and he was happy to pull it. He would check out any thing he was unsure. There were balloons blowing on a bench at the end of the trail he could not wait to put his head in the middle of it. Still to this day heis very forward in that regard right in the middle of what he is unsure of to investigate: We live near Atlantic Ocean - giant sized waves in Ny but more so strong waves and really strong tides much different then Florida. Max would chase a ball and dive through any sized wave or he will swim out to me to check on me without a ball investigate, crawl into sewer tunnels he is unnerved not by much. He Will scent work a room unleashed without noticing a room filled of dogs., He does not like smoke I would say smoke is the one thing that will rattle his cage And want to get away from heavy smoke.

Luna a wgsl was a happy loving exciting puppy to see us from the start she adapted immediately to the house she was naturally obedient even then . Her first outing was at the people park with the family the day after. A week after I had her in a shopping cart. I remember it was right after the election at home at home goods 4 years ago. I then had brought her to petco I remember there was some kind of event and it was a bit to busy to my liking but there were people in wheel chairs in crutches and she was just as happy to see them. Both dogs were always very comfortable and happy with attention as pups from people. Max maturing being more watchful of strangers outside the circle and Luna being more social accepting of large scale attention from strangers outside the circle. Max never liking strange dogs as he was never around any dogs but he does now mind his manners and all is needed is a leave it. I feel as if used this from the beginning it would go been never an issue. Luna is not as environmentally sound to certain objects in as comfortably walking in a tv sized box or searching in a swinging bucket filled with water but has strong environmental in regard to loud sounds she cares nothing about she will not want to search the house to find and eat a block buster firework that is set of on the house behind her but sleep through one and she would jump in on anything. Luna loves the bay but unsure of the giant powerful waves of the Atlantic Ocean In Ny. Some days the ocean is to powerful for me to go in myself: They are both really good sold strong nerved that make excellent family dogs that can was seen at a young age. My entire point is look for your pup strong points and focus on those. A dog with strong nerves will have weaknesses and the things that you consider a weaknesses will be hard to notice eventually as they mature because their strengths are greater.

 

[violetmd]

Hey EgansMom,

I think that's normal behaviour because she's still a baby and unsure of the world! Don't be hard on yourself. Right now she's going "what is this?!?!" She'll bounce back once she knows it's safe. She's only 8 weeks, give her time.

 

[LuvShepherds]

She’s doing very well and so are you. I know that feeling of panic when something is not what we expect, but these dogs are a very resilient breed in general. She’s a beautiful dog, sounds like just what you wanted. So much can be fixed with early exposure.

 

[Chip Blasiole]

So Jaimie has been home for a couple of days just spending tons of time with me. The only issue we were having...I thought..was screaming in the crate.
I took her out to home depot tonight to see her reactions. I thought "oh this is good" when the big automatic doors opened and she stopped but then followed me with no hesitation. She trotted along beside me no problem till the first person walked by her. In fact every person that walked by within about 10 feet she would freeze then avoid.... backing away as much as the leash would allow.
I really didn't expect that. I guess I got a little flustered. (Haven't had much sleep). I ended up kinda half sliding/half quick stepping her out of there. I didn't want to pick her up and reinforce her fear.
In hindsight I think I should have just stopped at a distance from people and given her treats as they passed ?
I walked her around the parking lot for a few minutes. She seemed a little nervous about the few moving cars in the parking lot.
When we got home of course she wouldn't come out of the car. I should say...she wouldn't come towards me and the open door so I could help her down. Finally I just reached in and got her out.
Overall a disaster.
Worried about her reactions and not sure how to proceed ?
She is clearly not as confident as I thought she would be. Am I just doing this all wrong ?

"What is a weak nerved dog? Simply put, a weak nerved dog shows avoidance or aggressive behaviors in response to non-threatening people, situations or objects. This includes the shy dogs and the fear biters. Nothing is more difficult for a breeder or dog owner to hear than that her dog has a nerve problem. People will go to great lengths to bend reality around and deny the problem. All the alarms should go off in your head when you hear a breeder attempting to blame the environment for a dog's behavior. For instance, the shy pup who cringes and skitters away from you when you crouch down to pet her. I'll bet the breeder told you not to worry, she's just a little shy and needs time to get to know you. And I'll bet the breeder told you that is perfectly normal for a puppy. Or the young adult dog who lunges and snaps at a neutral stranger you see walking down the street and you decide it's because the stranger was wearing a funny hat or that your dog is just incredibly perceptive and recognized some evil trait in the stranger from which she was bravely protecting you. (Actually, if your dog did this only once or twice in a lifetime, I'd be inclined to buy it). A dog's reaction to neutral strangers is always significant. By neutral, we mean the stranger walking down the street who pays no attention to you or your dog. Does the dog ignore the stranger? Fine. Some curiosity is well within normal range as well. Avoidance or aggression are signals of a serious nerve problem."

Probably not what you want to hear. It could pass. Has the breeder agreed to replace the pup? If you see this avoidance/freezing/nervousness much longer I would strongly suggest you replace the pup. I think you are getting some bad information here about the behavior you described as normal for a GSD or, she hasn't had time to adjust, or the situation was too much. As the writer above stated, people will go to great lengths to the deny the problem. JMO

 

[LuvShepherds]

Chip, read all 7 pages. There Is more information further down. It seems the OP has figured it out.

 

[Chip Blasiole]

I read all seven pages. In addition to the quote from the OP above, she said the pup screamed and howled in the crate for an hour, ran from the garbage cans that the neighbor dragged, moved away from the rattling of the metal bin two times. The pup might be showing improvement but I think the reactions described indicate a nerve issue. She might end up being fine as a pet but I would not keep this pup. The breeder should have sent the OP some video showing the pup exposed to potentially stressful situations. Wonder why she didn't.

 

[Chip Blasiole]

"Understand that nerve problems are not fixable. Skittering away from a scary object or noise is not a training problem, it is a temperament problem. With enough training, you could teach a dog to inhibit his response to a particular stimulus, but you will not fix the nerve problem. For example, you could teach a weak dog not to run away from a moving wheelchair. But suppose the wheelchair user dropped a book on the floor. You can be certain the dog would panic all over again. Training can, to an extent, modify specific behaviors, but it cannot change the dog's genetics. Weakness in temperament will always resurface under stress. And it requires stress tests to weed weak nerved dogs out of the gene pool."

 

[Chip Blasiole]

For the record, I have talked to Christine about a pup and was interested in a breeding, but as I said, I don’t want Anrebri dogs in a pedigree. Doesn’t mean they are crap dogs but to me, increases the odds of nerve issues. The other thing about the OP’s breeding is that there are quite a few dogs whose primary drive is defensive aggression vs. prey. That is not necessarily a bad thing either, but defensive aggression is fear based. It is a double edged sword where some dogs with such genetics will be able to channel their defensive aggression into fight while other lean more toward flight. Not at all knocking Wendelin but they do breed a lot of dogs. I believe she is an honest breeder and would accommodate the OP. With all her recent losses I would hate to see her get a dog that is not a good representative of the breed. I also understand that returning a pup would be another loss but you have to detach and think about it like buying a lemon of a car. Good luck.

 

[MineAreWorkingline]

For the record, I have talked to Christine about a pup and was interested in a breeding, but as I said, I don’t want Anrebri dogs in a pedigree. Doesn’t mean they are crap dogs but to me, increases the odds of nerve issues. The other thing about the OP’s breeding is that there are quite a few dogs whose primary drive is defensive aggression vs. prey. That is not necessarily a bad thing either, but defensive aggression is fear based. It is a double edged sword where some dogs with such genetics will be able to channel their defensive aggression into fight while other lean more toward flight. Not at all knocking Wendelin but they do breed a lot of dogs. I believe she is an honest breeder and would accommodate the OP. With all her recent losses I would hate to see her get a dog that is not a good representative of the breed. I also understand that returning a pup would be another loss but you have to detach and think about it like buying a lemon of a car. Good luck.

The bolded, don't look for Labradors and Goldens. Nothing wrong with suspicion, GSDs cannot protect or guard naturally without it as called for in the breed standard.

 

[Bearshandler]

No matter what drive the dog works in, you want good nerves.