He's gorgeous!

I went to an AKC tracking class a while back and a lady there had a young male Vlcak pup - about 10 months old. He was well behaved and got along well with Rai who was about the same age at the time. I talked to her about him and said she had to socialize him A LOT to get him to the point he was at. I knew his half sister and she was really, really skittish. I'm not sure how he's been as he's matured, but he did really well in tracking.

Good luck with your puppy Keep us updated! They're a very interesting breed

 

Wow he is amazing. Keep posting on him.

 

He looks great! Do keep us updated!

 

there are so many better ways to improve "dog" than mixing with wolf - even with generations distance . Then there are other things such as diet. Read an article recently which said the the dog is different because it lacks the ability to digest carbohydrates - Study: Ability to digest starch is critical difference between wolves and dogs.

Would anyone be excited or interested if the hybrid hinged on a coyote ? Yet coyote are much bolder , and much more adaptable than dogs .

 

Thankfully we have the Czechoslovakian experiment precisely to disprove it against those who keep doing mixes. I know it's not your point, but I've read that dog-coyote hybrids lose health and fertility after a few generations.

Most of my dog-friends have another dog besides their working dog: a Poodle, a maltesse, a Japanese Spitz, a Showline they got before knowing about the sport... I joke saying that I'm different, so if I get a dog only for his prettiness, I get a wolfdog.

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Thankfully we have the Czechoslovakian experiment precisely to disprove it against those who keep doing mixes. I know it's not your point, but I've read that dog-coyote hybrids lose health and fertility after a few generations.

Most of my dog-friends have another dog besides their working dog: a Poodle, a maltesse, a Japanese Spitz, a Showline they got before knowing about the sport... I joke saying that I'm different, so if I get a dog only for his prettiness, I get a wolfdog.

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Its not a hybrid! Strictly speaking, you need a license to own a wolf or even a first generation dog-wolf cross but the Czech Vlcak is several generations removed from the original wolf ancestor so its considered a domestic dog. It does take more work to train it and bring out its working qualities. That's why its not for the first-time dog owner. I would have to add Kavik is not typical of the breed and the personality and temperament of these dogs as individuals can vary from the breed standard.

 

I'm Czech living in USA for some years now. I do not have personal experience with vlcak, except what I saw around town. I just want to say it is not common knowledge in czech that vlcak is more wolf like than gsd. Most people view them as gsd, just maybe little harder to train.

 

Norman, I said dog and coyotes were hybrids. Besides, you have zero experience with either Vlcaks nor working dogs so you cannot say what are good characteristics or no for it, as opposed to someone like Carmen, though I'm sure you have read a lot on wikipedia about working dogs too and are ready to write a book.

Lets face the truth, Vlcaks breeders are mostly show breeders and that by itself removes working characteristics faster than having or not wolf genes. I am pretty aware that these are dogs, but when I say more wolfish than what I expected I don't mean it from a genetic point of view, but in how he looks when he moves.

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Norman, I said dog and coyotes were hybrids. Besides, you have zero experience with either Vlcaks nor working dogs so you cannot say what are good characteristics or no for it, as opposed to someone like Carmen, though I'm sure you have read a lot on wikipedia about working dogs too and are ready to write a book.

Lets face the truth, Vlcaks breeders are mostly show breeders and that by itself removes working characteristics faster than having or not wolf genes. I am pretty aware that these are dogs, but when I say more wolfish than what I expected I don't mean it from a genetic point of view, but in how he looks when he moves.

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I have experience with GSD. In regards to your statement about the Vlcak, this dog was developed by the Czech army/border guard service to create a more suitable dog for working than the GSD then in service with the Czech army and border guard service. The CSV became the Czech national breed only in 1982.

 

Never understand the purpose of dogs like this besides their looks maybe?

 

The Czechs wanted to develop a Super-GSD suitable for working purposes. That is why the Carpathian wolf was selected to develop a new breed of dog. It was mated with Czech GSDs to that end. Incidentally, the early SV breed register shows four wolf crosses listed in the foundation stock of the GSD - which was never really pursued. Its more than about looks - its about a dog that should conform to Max Stephanitz's belief a dog should be bred for working. The Czechs' experiments were evidently quite successful!

 

Here there is the better resource of first hand experience of people who, like me, is on it for the learning experience. A series of articles about their observations training CsVs. I'm already in contact with them.

http://www.siamcrowndog.com/article.php

 

Here there is the better resource of first hand experience of people who, like me, is on it for the learning experience. A series of articles about their observations training CsVs. I'm already in contact with them.

Siam Crown Kennel, Thailand - K9 Working Dogs - Malinois, Dutch Shepherds, Czechoslovakian Wolfdogs

Its a good breed for detection/tracking work. If you're thinking of taking advantage of their prey drives for protection work, this dog is not going to attack on command. The CSV has certain uses but is more of an all-around dog than a specialized one.

 

in the article about the ability of dogs being able to handle carbohydrates the researchers found that this Inability to do so lingers for a very long time after wolf genes have been introduced -- many generations.

the wolf is a specialist when it comes to food and territory and being away from human , needing vast expanses to range in.

Coyote thrives in urban wasteland, rural community , close proximity to people , eat , everything --- trash , and small game . Wild coyotes ‘kind of chilling’ by Wrigley Field - Salon.com
comfortable with the lights , the sounds, waiting patiently to go through the bleachers looking for hot-dogs, pizza crusts !

this is such a good book to read

Eastern Coyote: Gerry Parker: 9781551091112: Amazon.com: Books

this is a good read The Daily Coyote: Story of Love, Survival, and Trust In the Wilds of Wyoming by Shreve Stockton - Reviews, Discussion, Bookclubs, Lists

this is a good read [ame]http://www.amazon.ca/Part-Wild-Journey-Creature-Between/dp/1451634811[/ame]

so far this Kavik IS typical of this breed so many comments about skittishness - (The day I picked him the breeder informed me that the parents were kenneled, because that same night they had escaped his property, killed a yearling foal and brought it by pieces to the pups. I can testify it's true because Kavik has been pooping horse hair until yesterday.)

Kavik , by the way, I am told means Bear.

by the way I love the name Kavik , had one of my own K Carmspack Kavik CD TD TDX UTD --- urban tracking dog.

 

Wow, stunning pup! Definitely keep us updated, I'd love to hear about how he does training!

 

Kavik means wolverine in Inuit. There is a book called "Kavik, the wolfdog" that I read as a kid, so the name inmediately jumped to my mind.

Carmen, I saw the book when you posted it on the other thread. I'd love to read it, but I broke my Kindle. I hope the next time my brother goes to USA he brings me another one, because there they are way cheaper.

 

I adopted the breed because I think it can be MORE challenging than other breeds already proven. My next chosen dog for SAR will be a Malinois. I adopted it because I want to learn from the differences and difficulties I may find on the way to improve as a trainer.

On the worst case, he's stunning beautiful and every girl has the right of a pretty dog

 

I agree with you that your puppy will grow up into a beautiful dog. If you get past the stormy adolescence phase, Kavik should be a good fit! Make sure he gets lots of socialization and public exposure - it should help with skittishness and potential shyness. The training is the hard part - and like with tame wolves, this breed probably responds more to hand signals and food rewards than fear and coercive punishment. A well trained CSV is possible and I hope yours works out well! I think you already like him and its a good beginning, indeed.

 

I can't imagine the breed is very biddable, so a challenge to train. At least he is in a place that understands his character and if anyone can take him 'there', it is you, Catu!

 

The wolf vs the crocodile

 

The wolf vs the crocodile

NormanF, I know it's not a real wolf, but if you look carefully, you'll notice it's not a real crocodile either.

ETA: smartphone is a little bruised, but alive.

 

My cellphone!! I just saw he stole my cellphone! Pray it stills work...

 

How do you pronounce that word 'Vlcak'??

 

Vulchak - that is the closest pronunciation.

For a rare breed, they're interesting dogs. If you didn't know it WAS a dog, you'd swear you were looking at a wolf!

 

LOL

He's beautiful Catu.

I'm sure that you, with your experience, will do just fine with him.

 

Catu will get a kick out of going everywhere with a wolf! The looks enough should throw people for a loop!

 

Thank you Norman. What would be of me without your words of wisdom? I wasted 80 dollars going to a seminar with Haruo Masuda having you here.

Who knows what the reaction of people will be? No one has ever here seen a real wolf, and the area where my house is is quite rural, so maybe even not on TV. So far when I brought him 2 persons asked me if it was a culpeo

 

Interesting read, Catu. Keep us updated on how he does! And pictures...you KNOW we want pictures! Can't wait to see all you accomplish with him!

 

Very handsome pup!! Keep us posted on how he does with socialization and with eventual SAR training (hopefully he can make it ).

 

Very handsome pup!! Keep us posted on how he does with socialization and with eventual SAR training (hopefully he can make it ).

Who could possibly believe that adding wolf blood would make for a better working dog?

He does look cool tho.

 

the comment about the coyote/dog was to show that people wouldn't even give it a thought -- but w o l f ! so much tied into the romance and myth , not the reality of what a mess it could end up.

 

All dogs alive today are descendants of the grey wolf.

In 1993, the scientific name of the dog was changed to canis lupus familiaris in recognition of its ancestor.

 

but Norman , there are changes in 30, to 40,000 years --

the canine genomic study , contrary to what one would expect , found little connection to "wolf" DNA --- in the GSD which was included in the 'molosser' group.

wolf was introduced by the Phylax society which wanted to produce a wolfish looking dog , for a market (novelty) , which produced shy , skitterish dogs going quickly into avoidance. It's all in the von Stephanitz book . Wolf was abandoned as being counter productive .

mtDNA is showing another source of wolf - not the northern grey but the Indian / Iranian red-wolf which is temperamentally different - actually more coyote like ,

"
The Indian wolf was first described in 1831 by the British ornithologist William Henry Sykes under the binomial Canis pallipes.[17] In 1888, the British naturalist Blanford, working for the Geological Survey of India, described the Indian wolf as a separate species from the grey wolf and distinguished Canis pallipes from Canis laniger (the Himalayan wolf) by its smaller size, much shorter and thinner winter coat, and smaller skull and teeth.[18]
In 1941, the British taxonomist Pocock subordinated both to Canis lupus under the trinomials Canis lupus pallipes and Canis lupus laniger, respectively.[6] Today, the Himalayan wolf initially described by Hodgson in 1847 (C. lupus laniger) is generally considered to be part of the Eurasian wolf subspecies, C. lupus lupus, whereas the Indian wolf (C. lupus pallipes) is considered to be a subspecies, or a species in its own right.
Indian wolves are likely of a much older lineage than northern wolves. Morphologically, Indian wolves greatly resemble primitive European wolves from 500,000 years ago.[8] Recent DNA research suggests the Indian wolf populations in lowland peninsular India have not interbred significantly with any other wolf population for nearly 400,000 years, which could possibly make them an altogether separate species from the grey wolf.[18]
Indian wolves, along with Arabian and Tibetan wolves, are among the wolf subspecies generally suspected to have been the main ancestors of domestic dogs.[9] The basis for this is that Indian wolves share several characteristics with dogs which are absent in northern wolves: their brains are proportionately smaller than northern wolves, their carnassials weaker, and their eyes are larger and rounder. Their vocalisations also include a higher proportion of short, sharp barking. Their small size and less aggressive demeanor in captivity than northern wolves would have made them much easier to tame.[8] They seldom howl, unlike northern wolves.[10][19]"

 

The Indian/Arabian form and the smaller variety of the European wolf are suspected dog ancestors. The timber wolf is a huge, shaggy beast which is quite large and powerful. Not a wolf that's easily handled by humans. Its more than likely wolves adopted humans first rather than the other way around.

 

Another thing to take into consideration is that the wolf we see in this past 100 years is also a product of heavy selection caused by a pressure that has lead them almost to extinction. Today wolves are the survivors of human hunting, where precisely the more shy and skittish, those to avoided human contact at any cost are the ones who are alive to our days. On the contrary, 40,000-30.000 years ago the boldest and more human confident of the wolves that roamed around villages became dogs.

 

Catu - yup - and those traits in the Carpathian wolf are passed down to the wolfdogs bred from them. It doesn't mean Kavik won't be friendly and outgoing but dealing with the effects of that genetic heritage makes raising the dog much harder.