[cassadee7]

I agree, people just want to make a buck.

You know the whole "doodle" craze these days, breeding anything that breathes to a poodle. I would guess they crossed a standard poodle with a GSD to get the Shepherdoodle. But omg, I cannot imagine what you would get, lookswise and personality wise, with that cross. Someone needs to be spanked...

 

[Dainerra]

our paper always has GSDs in that price range. and they are GSDs in name only. One of the breeders lives a few houses down. He heard from his daughter (goes to school with my oldest) that we have a GSD, so he was eager to show off his pups. Scrawny, extremely slope-backed (even as babies!), just horrible looking pups. and the adults? the mom was so cow-hocked and sloped that I'm surprised she could walk. Her back feet actually pointed in opposite directions and her normal standing position had her butt about 3 inches off the ground.
Of course, I had walked down, so had Rayden with me. He asked me if I was sure that Rayden was a GSD since he had never seen one that looked like that.
Of course, the local vet gave them all a clean bill of health and they have all their vaccines etc. So, as far as these breeders are concerned, that is all that is necessary. I look at as "you get what you pay for" It's possible to find a good breeder that charges less, esp if you are willing to ship the pup or travel to pick it up. But dont' pick a breeder based solely on how much they are charging.
Of course, you also have to bear in mind that a large price tag doesn't guarantee quality either. There are plenty of BYBs who charge the max that the market will bear without putting a single thought into the health of the dogs.

 

[AgileGSD]

Originally Posted By: DainerraScrawny, extremely slope-backed (even as babies!), just horrible looking pups. and the adults? the mom was so cow-hocked and sloped that I'm surprised she could walk. Her back feet actually pointed in opposite directions and her normal standing position had her butt about 3 inches off the ground.

That is actually pretty unusual for pet bred GSDs. The mother must be all show bred and likely the father as well. You rarely get extreme angulation in pet bred dogs because it disappears very quickly when it isn't selected for. Even breeding an extreme dog to a moderate dog will usually not produce extreme puppies. Cow hocks of course can come from any line but do tend to go with the extreme angulation.

 

[Dainerra]

I don't think it's anything quite that good... I think it's more of an in-breeding problem. they aren't sloped like a SL dog, more like their legs are deformed. they did "select" for it though. as they are quick to brag that their dogs are "just like the ones you see on TV at the dog shows" Mom and Dad were bred by a relative who had been doing it for years. They were the "best" and he was allowed to use them to start his own breeding.
Remember the craze of the "rag doll kittens" I think that is what they were called? That is the closest image I can give of the way these dogs moved.

 

[JakodaCD OA]

I think the area you 'shop' in also has alot to do with the pricing of puppies.

While I do think you can find a good family dog out there for under 1000$ , it's still going to be a crap shoot with any puppy no matter what you pay.

To stack the deck in your favor, it's finding that responsible breeder who is at a minimum health testing their dogs, and is knowledgeable about what they are doing, the breed itself and has a goal in mind with their breeding program.

speaking of labra doodles, a friend and I just nabbed one that was running in the streets, an 8mth old male..huge doofy boy) , no collar, nothing, owner called AC 3 days later looking for him,,she had a female at home and was gonna breed them)))...AC gave her alot of advise, and the woman ended up signing them both over, since, gee they had NEVER been vetted...happy endings for the dogs..

 

[Barb E]

This is just thrown out there, not directed at anyone in paticular and perhaps it's already been said but I didn't go back and read the entire thread.

My biggest complaint about people buying dogs from BYBs or people that just want one litter and then advertise in the paper or craigslist is that irresonsible breeding will never stop until people quit throwing money at these people.

*Stepping off my soapbox and on to read more board*

 

[GSD07]

Originally Posted By: Tihannah My breeder's words to me were that he did not breed for the money and couldn't see charging people what he paid for his dogs. The sire he'd purchased and had shipped from Germany.

Of course he couldn't. For his own dog he did actually go not two houses down the road but to Germany and paid good money for someone else's expertise and effort that created his sire. At the moment he accumulates the same level of expertise himself and puts the same effort into his breeding stock he will see himself charging the same amount of money for his own puppies.

Companion dogs should be healthier and more solid temperamented than competition dogs in my opinion, and the breeder's support is even more crucial for inexperienced owners.

 

[3K9Mom]

Originally Posted By: GSD07Companion dogs should be healthier and more solid temperamented than competition dogs in my opinion, and the breeder's support is even more crucial for inexperienced owners.

What she said.

 

[Tihannah]

Originally Posted By: GSD07Of course he couldn't. For his own dog he did actually go not two houses down the road but to Germany and paid good money for someone else's expertise and effort that created his sire. At the moment he accumulates the same level of expertise himself and puts the same effort into his breeding stock he will see himself charging the same amount of money for his own puppies. Companion dogs should be healthier and more solid temperamented than competition dogs in my opinion, and the breeder's support is even more crucial for inexperienced owners.

Ahhh, exactly, but he could've since so many BYB use this same mentality to sell their pups. i.e. "My dogs are "so and so bloodline" and I paid $$$ for the sire/dam imported from Germany, so you can be sure you are getting a quality pup." To me he was more concerned with the actual process of being a good breeder and producing quality pups than seeing how much money he could get for them. We talked for hours before I chose a puppy and he even gave me his top two choice of puppies if he was making the selection and why.
And I don't understand why companion dogs should be healthier and more solid tempered than competition dogs? Isn't this what good competition breeders strive for? I always thought in companion dogs that you search for one that can meet the health and temperament of a competition dog?

 

[WayneMeganGSD]

Just with my small experience with GS breeders, there are lots of red flags to look for when trying to purchase a puppy from them.

A lot of those red flags I had no clue about until I started reading threads on this forum. If the breeder refuses to let you come out to the house that is a huge red flag. Also, being able to visit the puppies as they grow is a really good idea. So someone local that you can drive an hour or so every couple of weeks to see the pups would help you see how the dogs are. Being able to see the parents is another great idea. If they want to deliver the puppy to you, that is a red flag. Like I said before, you want to be able to visit the puppies, watch how they interact with their litter mates, you want to see how clean the facility is, and how the parents are interacting with their own.

In no way does that guarantee their health to be perfect, but like Jakoda said. You want to be able to stack the deck in YOUR favor.

These are small things that Ive learned so far, but they are still very important. Ive also learned to use patience and caution when looking for a GS. And dont trust everything those websites say about their dogs.

 

[onyx'girl]

The Sargent, I am glad you posted that! You did pick up much info in the past couple of weeks here after all!

How is your search going for a GSD?

 

[WayneMeganGSD]

Onyx, its going fairly well. I really cant complain. I got turned down by a few adoption centers on a couple of GSD because my home is fence-less.

But thats okay. Ive made some calls and I have a few quotes from some companies that can come out and throw up a nice fence in the next few weeks. I need a fence anyway.

My fiances parents may have found us a puppy. They wont know until Monday though. Its from the same person they got their youngest GS from. So we shall see.

 

[zyppi]

If you don't know anything - cannot see - health records including hips - on both parents, if you don't know anything about the temperament of at least a generations or so back, if you can't see how pups are being raised, and breeder has no understanding of why the genes of the sire and dam might combine to make a good dog, then you're taking a bigger risk taking the puppy home.

If you're set on checking out a litter that seems inexpensive, take an informed and experienced friend with you to evaluate the puppy and be ready to walk away from a puddle of fuzzy, friendly puppy breath.

You may or may not get a good companion pup, but you might also get a put that breaks your heart and your budget with health costs. The money you saved will be a drop in the bucket of what you'll pay for health problems.

If the pup is more of a handful than you and your family bargained for, will you hang in there and spend the time and money to keep a difficult dog or will you need to give up such a dog and add one more to shelters?

Please ask yourself these questions.

Caveat Emptor!!

 

[WayneMeganGSD]

Originally Posted By: zypIf you don't know anything - cannot see - health records including hips - on both parents, if you don't know anything about the temperament of at least a generations or so back, if you can't see how pups are being raised, and breeder has no understanding of why the genes of the sire and dam might combine to make a good dog, then you're taking a bigger risk taking the puppy home.

If you're set on checking out a litter that seems inexpensive, take an informed and experienced friend with you to evaluate the puppy and be ready to walk away from a puddle of fuzzy, friendly puppy breath.

You may or may not get a good companion pup, but you might also get a put that breaks your heart and your budget with health costs. The money you saved will be a drop in the bucket of what you'll pay for health problems.

If the pup is more of a handful than you and your family bargained for, will you hang in there and spend the time and money to keep a difficult dog or will you need to give up such a dog and add one more to shelters?

Please ask yourself these questions.

Caveat Emptor!!

I couldnt have said it better myself.

Nice post, Zyp.

 

[Myamom]

"irresonsible breeding will never stop until people quit throwing money at these people."

 

[Barb E]

Holy cow I guess I felt so strongly about it that I didn't even notice that I didn't spell irresponsible right

until I'm quoted

 

[Myamom]

eh...I didn't notice either Barb

 

[GSD07]

Originally Posted By: zyp
You may or may not get a good companion pup, but you might also get a put that breaks your heart and your budget with health costs. The money you saved will be a drop in the bucket of what you'll pay for health problems.

If the pup is more of a handful than you and your family bargained for, will you hang in there and spend the time and money to keep a difficult dog or will you need to give up such a dog and add one more to shelters?

Please ask yourself these questions.

Everything what said above applies to a PUPPY regardless the place the puppy comes from.

As much as I despise BYBs it is possible to end up with an exceptional dog from them.

 

[GSD07]

Originally Posted By: Tihannah
And I don't understand why companion dogs should be healthier and more solid tempered than competition dogs? Isn't this what good competition breeders strive for? I always thought in companion dogs that you search for one that can meet the health and temperament of a competition dog?

Because companion dogs have to be more trusted since less effort is put into their formal training, and they are expected to use their own judgment and be bomb proof in all expected and unexpected environments. They don't need to perfect a certain routine but they need to perfectly fit into any lifestyle they find themselves in.

People who look for companion dogs also are not very skilled in recognizing and correcting an emerging problem, so they more prone to ruin a dog that is less then stable. Not the rule but quite often.

Yes, competition breeders are striving for that that's why they are a good source for companion dogs. What do the pet breeders strive for?

 

[Tihannah]

Originally Posted By: GSD07Yes, competition breeders are striving for that that's why they are a good source for companion dogs. What do the pet breeders strive for?

Oh, don't get me wrong. I completely agree with your statement, I'd just never thought of it like that~the companion dogs needing more of those qualities. And to answer your question regarding "pet breeders"? In my experience...most strive for the almighty dollar...