There are so many "rescues" around here who are rehoming mixed breed dogs for $350. It drives me absolutely insane.

 

Well. . . yes and no. I have a lot of respect for good mixed-breed rescue groups because on the whole, it's harder to adopt out a mixed-breed than a dog of a recognizable pure breed. There are certainly more mixed breed dogs in need of rescue than purebreds, as evidenced by how very very many mixed breed dogs end up in shelters. And it's certainly not cheaper to vaccinate or sterilize or treat heart worms in a mixed breed than it is in a pure breed. Mixed breed rescue doesn't have lower operating costs than pure breed rescue and I can promise you that those of us in legitimate rescue are losing money on it. The life of a mixed breed dog is worth as much as the life of a pure breed dog. There's just less market for them.

 

Rebel, it sounds like you just have a huge chip on your shoulder. It's just funny to me because I have observed the opposite in everyday life. It seems now that people who purchase dogs from ethical breeders are bullied and made to feel guilty and horrible by rescuers and lumped in the same category as people who purchase dogs from backyard greeders and pet stores. I get interrogated by rescue nut cases nearly every time I bring my intact doberman to a dog event! Even when people don't approach me with questions, I feel their eyes burning in the back of my skull when they see my intact dog. So many of them jump on the bandwagon and think they are superior and get on a power trip because they saved a dog's life. I am very involved in dog rescue and witness this! I am just rational and logical, many people in rescue are jaded and emotionally unstable, they lose themselves in it and there is no balance in their lives.

 

OMG THANK YOU!!! I have noticed this big time. I was doing SAR with Jinx and everyone said she was the best on the team, had the most drive etc... even the trainer was blown away by her however CONSTANTLY talked bad about her because she was "bought" and it was so bad. We had a news reporter come out to do a story on the team and she even talked about how all of the dogs were throw aways on their last days of life and now are saving lives etc... then goes and starts bad mouthing Jinx because she's the only one on the team who was bought from a breeder etc... Im constantly dealing with people talking junk because Jinx was not a rescue however as we speak I have a foster pup laying across my lap fast asleep on the couch with me.

On this forum I have seen MANY "breeders" chased away but not the legitimate ones same as "rescuers". I have seen "rescuers" run themselves off because not every dog can be saved and they just can't handle it so abandon ship. However, on this forum, I have seen many people come on here looking for a dog asking specifically for breeders and some breeders turn them to rescues as well as others or people looking for a breeder because they want something specific from the pup (in terms of drives, nerves etc..) and MANY rescuers have thrown rescueing at them non stop and actually made the poster upset as a result.

As far as the vet it sounds like you've gotten some jerks I've had some bug me because of not fixing Jinx and just poor care in general however never had any treat my fosters any worse then my own dogs. Actually when I rescued in Michigan the vet there gave a HUGE discount to the rescues and would always get me in same day that I called for anything and treated the dogs great and spent alot of time with them.

The vet I'm at now they are working to give a discount to the rescue for dogs I bring in there I can just walk in and always get seen and they are great with them. I can take the foster in there and they will play around with them and socialize on the floor behind the counter weight them etc.. and not charge anything they are in the vet business for the right reason (animals) sounds like you found the bad vet just like the bad breeder and the bad rescue... in it for the money and not the animals which always causes caring and quality to decline.

 

those of us that work out of our own wallets are a little different. we don't have the backing of a legitimate 501 to help us cover costs. we also don't handle as many dogs at one time. we do one dog at a time, so we're very picky, if we can be, about who we pick up. i've taken in some pretty rough cases and the costs have been astronomical, set us back personally quite a bit and there's no one to help us cover them except a little more over time for my husband, and some cutting back on personal expenses for ourselves. but those dogs get healthy and get placed and do wonderfully.

the last real expensive pair i had i just finished up with was a pair of brother cockers. they came in a mess and left in perfect health. hugo my "new" gsd came in at thanksgiving underweight, eye infections, bruised, w/stitches and needing neutering. he's gained 15lbs, eye infections are gone, bruises are gone, stitches are out and he's scheduled to be neutered on the 2/07. but all of that comes out of our wallets, not donations, or adoption fees.

no adoption fee can ever return what we put into those dogs. the most i've ever charged for an adoption fee is $65. no matter how much they pay, it doesn't guarantee they won't abandon the dog in the future. expense doesn't guarantee responsibility. nothing will not even the deepest background check will. you do the best you can, and try to stay in touch, and hope for the best. that's all anyone can do.

maria

 

My vet's is opposite. I think he dislikes PB dog's....or maybe it's the owners.

He always asks the same questions....did you get this dog from a breeder?

I actually think he doesn't really like GSD's either.

He has a ton of office cat's running around. They always remind you when you go in...that they can be adopted. Last time I went in...there was a mommy dog with a few pups. I guess somebody dumped her....they tied her up to the front door when she was still pregnant. They were trying to find homes for mom and pups. Anyway, his office always has countless animals up for adoption.

 

Gatordog...it probably depends somewhat on the location but a lot of the owner surrenders here in the (deep) south aren't UTD, spayed or neutered.

Also consider this, it only takes one or two very sick dogs with in a rescue group to sky rocket expenses.

The costs for these dogs is leveraged against the healthy less expensive dogs in the adoption fee.

Otherwise some dogs would cost $1500 or more to adopt and others maybe $75 and that just wouldn't work...

Really, now-a-days $350 for a healthy, vaccinated spayed/nuetered dog isn't too high....

 

I honestly would like to see a Humane Society that is making a profit--even a decent one. Everyone I've ever seen is basically making costs, with maybe a bit above to use at the shelter for improvements.

 

Alexis, I think you should spend some time volunteering for rescues. That is not how most operate and it certainly isn't reputable. Dogs are highly undervalued in this country which is a big part of our overpopulation problem. I don't see how someone could consider a pure-bred pup for $2,000+ from a breeder but thinks a "rescue" dog isn't worth $350.

 

I would pay $2000+ from a breeder when looking for a puppy that possess specific qualities I am looking for in a working dog. I never once I didn't think a rescue pup wasn't worth $350...so I'm not sure what you're getting at with that comment. I paid $250 for my rescue and would have been willing to pay more if I needed to.

And I spent 2 years volunteering at the last rescue that I worked with and they turned me off from it completely. When I hear from someone's mouth that, "We've got some puppies coming in, so we can get more money from people" I found it to be ridiculous.

There are so many people who are looking to rescue dogs because it it cheaper than buying from a breeder, and when the adoption fees are slowly starting to close in on the fees you would pay when purchasing from a breeder, you are going to see less dogs adopted. I completely agree with you about it not being reputable, but unfortunately that is the one and only experience I had when volunteering with a rescue.

I thought the purpose of rescues was to rehome animals in need. I know more than a few people who aren't looking to spend $300 initially on a dog, and in return just won't rescue at all, and a dog somewhere just missed an opportunity to be adopted.

 

My only problem is that rescues are turning people away who are uncomfortable paying their $300 adoption fee. When someone is willing to offer a dog a perfectly good home, but is only willing to pay half the fee, they are turned away.

What we tell people when they come in like this, "Then look at Bonez over here, his fee is $150". If they don't like our fees, they can go to the shelter or another rescue. Why bug us about a dog who is $300 when there's dogs for much less? Why not look at the dogs in your price range??

I liken it to this - say you want a gallon of milk. You go to one store, and it's $4.00/gallon there. You know the store across the street charges $2.00/gallon. Do you go to the store manager and complain that he has $4.00/gallon milk and "you know it's only worth $2.00/gallon because store B has it for that much!" or do you leave the store and go to the one across the street??

 

Maybe I just worked with a neednewwords rescue. They just seemed much more focused on getting dogs out and making money than finding the "right" home. My last foster through them was a corgi mix who had to have maybe 20 teeth pulled. He had some bad DA and marking behaviors, and they adopted him to a home that fed him kibble and kept him tied outside all day. He lost almost half his body weight because he couldn't eat the kibble, he got heartworm, and was just in generally horrible shape when the adopters finally returned him to us. It was the last straw for me and it broke my heart. And I always tried to say to them that if it wasn't the right home, the dog would end up coming back in the long run. Being so young, no one listened to me, so I had no choice but to leave.

I know not all rescues are like that, but this one proved that they do exist. So I just have to caution those who are looking to rescue to make sure it is reputable.

The daycare that I work at is riddled with pits and pit mixes because the owners "don't know why the dog is so crazy." They adopted the dog at 8 weeks from a rescue and were told it was a lab mix puppy, when it was clearly a pit bull mix and the potential adopters didn't know any better. The rescue just knows that lab mix puppies are more easily adopted than pit mix puppies. Just another excuse to get money faster.

Maybe I just live in a crappy area for rescue. I'm learning not to like New York so much.

 

there are non reputable rescues same as with breeders etc.. and it can leave a bad taste in your mouth. I was with a rescue in MI and they were "less than reputable" They would guilt fosters into taking more dogs then they could would call and say "I know you have 5 fosters right now but if you don't take this entire litter they will die tomorrow because of you" There was an owner surrender of an AKC registered yellow lab and they hiked the adoption fee up quite a bit because she had papers and they flat out said they were charging extra for her papers to come with her. I agree puppies go quicker and since they are more adoptable charging a bit more however I believe it should be a bit more even we all know $50 covers nothing however if they had a flat fee say 250 for adults and 300 or 350 for puppies then thats fine in my book so long as its consistent however undercharging for an adult then over charging for a puppy might equal out over time but just not what I prefer. They do however have the bad rescues that will take in all the healthy pups then flip them consistently and making a profit from it because they never take in any sick dogs and don't do anything to keep up the dogs.

 

What a double standard. We've argued and argued on this forum over whether or not a breeder should make a profit but rescue (which is a full time job) must absolutely operate at a loss.

They do however have the bad rescues that will take in all the healthy pups then flip them consistently and making a profit from it because they never take in any sick dogs and don't do anything to keep up the dogs.

http://www.germanshepherds.com/foru...doption-information-general/85919-how-distinguish-reputable-rescues-others.html

This would be a good time to remind everyone to check into a rescue that they are considering volunteering with, donating to or adopting from. Ask for 501c3 paperwork, check out previous years 990 forms. If they don't have a 501c3, ask if it is in process. Ask where the money is going. Ask for references. Do your homework.

There are people trying to scam others in so many different aspects of life. It is the consumer's responsibility to do their research and make informed choices and to realize that just because group A is less than honest does not mean that groups B,C, D....Z are.

 

I'm tired of charging flat fees for puppy litters and having all the dogs with color (as opposed to plain black) go flying out while the black litter mates sit here for weeks longer, or the females fly out faster than the males (that never ceases to amaze me).
We have ended up asking $50 more for females or colored puppies when the black siblings will not go as quickly. We still have to feed them all!

I was griped at last night because of a $200 fee! "Way too high" is what I was told.
You cannot make everyone happy and to begin to try to do so is the end of your mission.

I'm curious what people think, we're going to give them a free dog, or as others said, take a hit on every dog that someone feels they cannot pay over x-amount for (that's a different cost for every person apparently) and then go broke and have to close the rescue doors?

They do however have the bad rescues that will take in all the healthy pups then flip them consistently and making a profit from it because they never take in any sick dogs and don't do anything to keep up the dogs.

Last year we took in a Cocker that another rescue refused to take, told the finder, take it to the Humane Society (who'd have euth'ed upon arrival) "He's too old to come to rescue". So yes, they exist all over the place. This particular dog cost us way more than it should have on dental (we've since found a place who costs less for those) and he had a thyroid problem. Went out to live for another 8 mos. before he passed away suddenly in his new home. But he had a terrific 8mos., and you cannot really put a price tag on that, and another rescue telling the finder he couldn't come into rescue because of his age...I simply have no words for that

 

kept him tied outside all day.

We have an extensive screening process that weeds out people like this. If they lie, we have the right to repossess the dog.
We don't adopt to people who keep dogs outside all day except in certain circumstances like if they work and the dog is a quieter one, and they have a dog door (for instance).
If people do not want a house-dog they probably won't get one of ours - not because we "believe in house dogs only", but because most our rescues had exposure to and/or lived in houses and to ban them from houses would be devastating to them.

 

All I'm saying is that if OP was indeed interested in adopting, they need to find rescues like yours. Not like the one I worked with. They gave dogs away to anyone as long as they could pay the adoption fee, and that's obviously not the most important part of rescuing an animal.

 

I know that many people pay less for a dog and cherish it. However, if they cannot come up with the fee to adopt it, how in the world are they going to come up with an unexpected veterinary expense.

One time, I took snow plowing for my home and my parents in trade for a puppy. The owner was good about doing the plowing. However, the recently called me and told me that since they moved the dog has started itching, and is now losing its hair. They think it has mange. I told them to take the dog to the vet. They will not have the money to do so until after their income taxes come back.

I really do not care where you get your dog from, the fact is that sooner or later your dog will need veterinary care that is not the well-dog exam and vaccinations. And there is more, when people value what you do for the dog, and expect to compensate/reimburse something for dog, it says something about their accepting responsibility.

Giving dogs away for less or nothing because the great home is too good to lose, is really not always in the dog's best interest. Some people want something for nothing, some people value a dog less if it is free or cheap. Not everyone, but some people do. Our pound gives them away for $25 -- small dogs and puppies are a little more. People like my brother take these dogs and let them run free on their property and get smooshed in the road. They do not learn after Dog 1 gets smooshed. They just go back to the pound and shell out another $25. They let Dog 1 exist for YEARS with a dislocated hip from the accident because they cannot afford to pay for a vet to deal with the problem. And Dog 2 dies when it gets smooshed in the road.

But they are better than me, because the rescue ALL their dogs from the pound.

 

Yes, poorly run, unethical and truly awful rescues do exist. Like GSDRaven said, you need to really look at things before you go to adopt or go to volunteer. Just like with purchasing a dog from a breeder. We are doing a better job of educating people in these areas but it's a process.

As for the vetting, I absolutely hate to say it but I have seen/heard what Rebel is referring to. In a few ways:
1. Vets who have worked with rescues who do a poor job overall - adopting dogs out with parvo and seeing it on the adopter end when the adopter brings an unhealthy dog in - so think that all rescues do not vet their animals.
2. Vets who think you treat a rescue dog as less - because "you can't save them all" and wants to PTS a dog that has an issue that, in your own dog, you would treat. Not something like cancer, I'm talking pneumonia.
3. Vets who say they need to prioritize treatment, appointments and meds for pets of "paying customers" even when the rescue brings in far more complicated and expensive cases and pays more than a typical pet owner (unless that typical pet owner has 50 new dogs a year that need some kind of care).
4. Vets who will say well, yeah, it's a rescue, about a foster when talking about care planning, with that meaning, yeah, you don't want the same level of care for the basics as you would your own dog.
5. Don't get me started on emergency vets. The triage...I will not say this is the case for all...but I believe is skewed against non-owned dogs, and it makes sense if you think about it. It's not right, but if you think about being responsive to a client...

Many of you may not have seen this because you are not taking multiple dogs, that are not your own (meaning foster dogs) to multiple vets. In a rescue with fosters spread out, you can see this more clearly. Some of it is individual vet personality and some of it is systemic.

On the other hand, I have not seen it at Cornell University nor have I seen it systemically in my own vet office. My own vet office loves fosters and rescues and wants to be a part of all the dogs we bring in. The new vets are learning expectations and I hope that we are educating them that while these dogs may not have one owner right now, they are our dogs when they are in our care, and will be treated as such.

 

If a rescue accepts donations as a not for profit business, then they should not make a profit. I think it would be next to impossible to make a profit as a rescue if you are doing it halfway decent. There are scoundrels doing just about everything though, so I am sure there are people who are making money rescuing, but they are such a minority, they are really not worth mentioning, save to understand that they exist, just so that inadvertantly you do not support them, or send dogs to them.

Profiting off of an individual dog, charging $200 or $300 for a dog that ended up costing a total of $110, I see no problem at all with that. That money will get sucked up in helping another dog, and the alternative would be putting dogs to sleep that could be reasonably cared for because they do not have a prayer at finding an adopter willing to pay the accumulated total of their vet care, etc. If Dog A and Dog B both go to their respective new owners, vetted and altered, than why should it matter that dog A costed the rescue 110 and dog B costed the rescue 590, and each costed their owners $350. Only we all know that it is not as clean as that.

For every dog that is fully vetted for $100 or less, there are probably a score or more that cost way more.

People who run rescues put their heart and their money into it. I would not be surprised if helping dogs has bankrupted some of them. And others become totally overwhelmed and end up over their head with just the number of dogs they care for. And people grumble about $200 or $350. Kind of sad really.

 

3. Vets who say they need to prioritize treatment, appointments and meds for pets of "paying customers" even when the rescue brings in far more complicated and expensive cases and pays more than a typical pet owner (unless that typical pet owner has 50 new dogs a year that need some kind of care).

We recently had this problem. We've since changed vets

 

I can't remember what I paid for my rescue, I think it was 300, then I spent over 1000 just for the Vet in the 4 months she was in my home.

Do I feel guilty buying my dog? Nope.

 

Awww, what happened to her?

Sue Selzer, yes, on all and just got an email forward yesterday a lady in GA was trying to wind down the rescue, but got a drop off of a mom and pups in a ditch...so needed help getting them vetted. It's like organized crime, but without the money and (thankfully!) violence - you try to get out, but they just keep pulling you back in.

To get on topic, I would have no need to buy a dog. I have at my access (and through good rescue, our good applicants do as well) literally thousands of dogs, GSDs and other, throughout the north/south east at any time of the year. If I can't find one to fit me in that giant pool...I'm in trouble. I am VERY hopeful that by the time I want to add another GSD, that my access will be severely limited because there will be so many fewer dogs in the shelters, but still know that no matter what I want and what I want to do, I could still find one, and that will be what I will do. For me, this is who I am as a person and in my life. I can understand people wanting to buy from truly great breeders to get exactly what they want. What stinks is when people buy from what they think is a good breeder (based on their info at the time) and do not come close to getting what they want. Or go through a bad experience in rescue that does the same.

 

We just tell people we'll charge less when we get all our dog food donated (like many shelters) and even vet care donated (like some shelters) because I've heard "you only pay $100 at the Humane society!"
A simple vet visit could run $100 and easily run much more for an injury or illness. If you can barely afford a $100 fee, how will you pay for if the dog needs to see a vet?

 

I agree that some of the posts here seem condescending - making general statements instead of making "you" statements goes a long way in allowing a post to be educational, and not confrontational (hint, hint).

People need to be aware that not all rescues are created equal, just like not all breeders are created equal - but in both cases, whether a person chooses to buy a dog or rescue a dog, that is their choice, one that fits into their present wants and needs and circumstances, and the topic of this thread. So would be nice if we could leave the rescue comparison out of it, and get back to people sharing their thoughts about feeling guilty (or NOT feeling guilty) if one decides to buy a dog.

 

:thumbup:

 

The Animal Rescue League asked for a donation of $115 when I adopted Viktor... but I gave them more because his medicals, which they covered, were so extensive.

 

For me obtaining a dog is not JUST about me and my dogs. It's not just about how much I want to pay to whom and for what. For me, loving GSDs is about more than simply owning a few of them but about my interpretation of the breed and the direction it is going. I want to select dogs that I feel are good representatives of the breed. That is why I take years carefully selecting dogs and breeders. It's not just about getting a healthy dog for my family but what lines I'm willing to put my money down on. I want to train them and showcase them to the best of my abilities and their potential (usually the former being the lowest common denominator). There may be a time in the distant future when I will breed or own dogs available for breeding. I'm not saying rescues can't be ambassadors for the breed but they can't move the breed forward. No sane rescue is going to adopt out breeding prospects.

 

YAY! That's good for everyone, J/Z.

No sane rescue, that's for sure!

 

On the flip side, no sane breeder will be seeking breeding prospects on Petfinder.
Not saying it doesn't happen...just that no sane breeder would be doing it!!
:rofl:

 

I, like a lot of others on here, have both rescued, and purchased from breeders.

Our current GSDs are both rescues, with the latest one being taken in over the weekend. We gave a lot of thought to purchasing a puppy this time, but decided that our current lifestyle wouldn't provide a blank canvas with all of the tools he/she would need to grow up "right".....so we opted for a mature dog that needed a good home and companions, and I'm glad we did.

There's no right or wrong answer here just a personal preference.


BTW, I am starting to feel like trying to adopt is becoming more and more of a hassle. Within the last couple of weeks I spoke to a local GS rescue and was told that it was required that I get training with the dog I was looking to adopt FROM the rescue. I explained to them that I'd rather use someone that was closer to me and that I was more familiar with and was told that in that case, I would not qualify for the adoption! Obviously, I told her to drop dead. lol.

I was also told by another rescue that I could not adopt from them because they saw that I had a kennel in my backyard.

 

I, like a lot of others on here, have both rescued, and purchased from breeders.

Our current GSDs are both rescues, with the latest one being taken in over the weekend. We gave a lot of thought to purchasing a puppy this time, but decided that our current lifestyle wouldn't provide a blank canvas with all of the tools he/she would need to grow up "right".....so we opted for a mature dog that needed a good home and companions, and I'm glad we did.

There's no right or wrong answer here just a personal preference.

I honestly think that's what it will come down to for me, where I am exactly in my life and what kind or age dog will fit my lifestyle best at the time. I won't be buying a puppy if I can't raise it the way I feel it should be properly raised and a rescue may be a great path for me to take. Either way I'm sure I'll end up with a great GSD.

I certainly didn't foresee this thread taking off in this direction but I've read through what everyone thinks about reputable rescues/breeders and vets, etc. It's interesting to see the wide range of experiences and opinions.

 

Money is the main reason why I had to stop rescuing about 5yrs ago. I did rescue solely on my own and was not 501c3. I had a separate bank account for keeping rescue money separate from my money which was where all adoption fees went and where I pulled money from to pay pull fees, vet bills and transport costs. I had to keep moving my own money over to that account because the adoption were not even letting me break even let alone have a little extra for the next dog. When I had kids is when I had to stop because I simply no longer had "extra" money that I could funnel into that account in order to keep rescuing. I tried the flat adoption fees at first and was losing so much that I went to charging more for puppies and still didn't have enough to support it. Not being a non profit meant I could not ask for donations so I stopped doing rescue. I am hopeful that once I finish my bachelor's degree this summer (I have gotten nowhere with my associate's degree in vet tech, completed in 2007) I can get a higher paying job to once again have extra money to be able to start rescuing once more.

I am trying to raise my daughter to rescue dogs as well. For Christmas 2010 I took her to a dog pound and let her pick one puppy to rescue. She helped me with getting the puppy, whom she named Ollie, ready for adoption by getting him vet checked, vaccinated, microchipped and neutered. Then I went over applications for him with her and we met one woman who really stood out as being the right one for him. Bianca and I delivered him to his new home and she gets e-mail updates on him all the time which makes her happy. That was her first rescue and I hope she and I can do more in the future. She was sad about him leaving at first, but I kept explaining to her what rescue was about and she eventually got it. She wants to go save more already so now I have to tell her to save her money so she can - we paid for Ollie's care out of her savings money. I of course put the money back into her savings, but she doesn't know that!

 

I don't think anyone should feel guilty. I admit I do lean more towards rescues, but I see no reason to go to a breeder. I do think people need to get out of the mindset some seem to have with rescues. Bad experiences happen all around. One bad experience with a rescue dog coming into the home doesn't qualify the response of "rescue dogs are all unknown and you will never know..." blah blah blah.

But I see no reason to feel guilty if one does their research.

 

One bad experience with a rescue dog coming into the home doesn't qualify the response of "rescue dogs are all unknown and you will never know..." blah blah blah.

Exactly...and I'm seeing the same generalizations (no rescue would adopt to me, I was turned down, they charge too much, etc.) about rescues that people who buy from breeders, and breeders themselves hate, such as "all breeders are bad/bybs". Even slams against the people rescuing (mental cases, etc.)!
Each should be judged on it's own merit, not on past experiences.

If you don't like being judged, then don't do it yourself. That's a collective "you", not a specific being.