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Discussion Starter #21 (Edited)
You've received some good advice.....and I can personally tell you ...some of the advice regarding you being much more animated and capturing the dog's attention will make a huge difference...it would be a great place to start. I used to get hammered on by the trainers at basic obedience classes....they all thought I was way too mellow and uptight at the same time to ever captivate my dog's attention. I remember them telling me to act like I just won the lottery during basic recall training amongst other basic skills....to put some life into the process...so I tried...and thought I did....I believe one of the instructors looked at me and said " Hmmmm $5 jackpot?" Anyway....I gave in and acted the part they asked for...even though my new excitement level was mostly sarcasm because I am pretty laid back... however it elevated the "mood" and made a marked difference. Eventually....my sarcastic "excitement" became genuine and my neighbors probably hate me for it...but it worked.

I also like the clear beginning and ending advice you were also given....I employed this advice as well... it works.

Dog nails a good one and it needs to be instantly conveyed to the dog....I have found my verbal marker is much more effective at sending this message versus a clicker.

Yeah, engagement......it's the name of the game.

Have some fun training the Kody monster....it'll get you there quicker.


SuperG
Lol, thank you for the story. I'll try to be more animated. It's much more difficult to do when I'm recording myself due to my social anxiety though. I used to prefer verbal markers but now I like the clicker more just because it's so precise and consistent. I don't have to worry about my voice changing tone or anything.


Look into Michael Ellis power of food and power of tug videos. I'm renting them on bowwowflix.com his take on engagement is great and it's right on with what my trainer is teaching me. My dog now is super excited for a tug. He pushes it right back to me.
Yes I love Michael Ellis and have been wanting that video for a while actually :). I've been subscribed to bowwowflix, but I've had one dvd out for several months (forgot about it), and then just recently realized that they haven't been billing me monthly for the past several months. They didn't bill me for the dvd either. I want to send it back and get a new one, but I'm afraid that they're gonna be like hey you owe us a hundred dollars or something lol.


If you seriously want to become a trainer than you need to have a system. To learn one you need to work under someone to learn it correctly. To learn all the nuances, to learn what to do when something doesn't work. The best way to do that is to work with someone who has already learned it, that can show you how, what to look at, what you're seeing in the dog's behavior.
I would absolutely love the opportunity to work with a trainer. I've contacted countless trainers and training organizations in the past, but none ever got back to me. I really wish I could find someone to mentor me though :/


I went out and bought some actual dog treats today and haven't fed him yet (it's almost 2 pm) so that I can try that out. I'm thinking about working on "take it" and "drop it"? I read a couple studies where dogs actually learned faster by being trained once a week in a short session as opposed to longer sessions multiple times a week, so I'm trying not to work on the same thing more than twice a week.
 

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Find an obedience club around you. They have classes. If you can't find one then talk to the closest conformation club, (kennel club) they will know where there's an obedience club.
 

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UGH!!!!!! I'm never trying to train this dog again. He's so awful. Awful awful awful UGH!!!!!

Teaching him take it and drop it is impossible. I can never mark the exact instant he lets go and then he just grabs it again. All he cares about are *** bugs and grass. Wraps the leash around a bush. Tries to destroy my thousand dollar laptop. Bit the *** out of my hand when I brought out the toy. I can't even describe exactly everything he did that pissed me off. Ugh!!!
 

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Tulip GET SOME HELP.You need a good class or a private trainer.The dog doesn't understand what you want and you need someone to teach you how to communicate with him.

BTW that sort of language is not allowed here:(
 

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Yes please find someone to consult with!!:( I'm sorry you're so frustrated! Take a break from it training and let yourself calm down. I know how frustrating it can be but don't let it get to you everything will be ok!
 

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You said in another post the dog is four years old. You've had him since a puppy. You took him to some classes when he was a puppy if I understood correctly. Now you're working on teaching him to behave in the house and listen. May I ask where he was for the rest of the time? Was he in a run outside or just crated?


I think it's great that you're trying to get him to be what you want him to be, what you originally purchased him for and dreamed he'd be. But he sounds like he needs a more experienced trainer to help you with him. He's not doing these things deliberately, he's just untrained and has no known boundaries. Contact an obedience club or find a GSD trainer. If you give a location I'm sure someone on here can give you some leads where to go for help.
 

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Discussion Starter #27
I know it's not his fault; I just had to vent. He's so frustrating sometimes. I had to put him up earlier because I was so frustrated.

Both. He was always either in the crate, in the fenced backyard, or out on a walk with me. I walk him, play with him in the backyard, work on his training, and he still has SO much energy. Of course, I could probably always do more. Which is what I'm trying to do now that I have a job that gives me a much more flexible schedule plus being out of school now. I probably shouldn't have gotten him when I did just because I was honestly too busy to raise a puppy while still in school and working at the same time. But now that I have the time to work with him, I'm trying to make things better.

I would love to work with an experienced trainer, but it'll take me a while to save up for a class. I'm already saving up for my own place (which once I have, will make it so much easier to have him out in the house more often). The only place my dad will "pay" for is for me to take him to Man's Best Friend because we have lifetime free training classes there, but I feel like going there hurt mine and Kody's relationship because of how much correction they used. They did use some positive reinforcement, but it was more aversion based with some praise to the dog when he's doing what we want. No food or toy rewards. I live just north of Dallas. Collin County
 

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The best advice at this point I can give you is to lighten up and have fun. That video didn't look fun for you or the dog. I know a lot of people use them, but if I were you I would toss that clicker in the trash. I tried one once their was no emotion to it. Like your video just kind of blah. The more excitement and enthusiasm you show for training the more excitement and enthusiasm your dog will show. I have never had to withhold a meal to get my dogs to train. I have trained them an hour after a meal and gotten the same enthusiasm as before a meal etc... I truly believe that after a while the treats are cool but the dog gets more from how happy they make you. I have had Rosko take a treat only to drop it and come sit in front of me waiting for his next command. Or he has went right past my hand with the treat to jump and play with me simply because he's so happy that I am happy. Make it fun. As far as training try doing just 20-30 minutes a day off leash. Don't be afraid to look like a complete idiot to all other humans. I'm sure my neighbors and sometimes my own family think I've lost it occasionally. And keep it fast paced. I know the stays will be long
But everything else keep things moving don't give him time to get distracted.
 

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I know a lot of people use them, but if I were you I would toss that clicker in the trash. I tried one once their was no emotion to it. .
If you've had to endure this story previously.....I apologize. I bought the clicker...read the instructions and it said "click and reward instantly"...I told my dog to sit...she did...I clicked the clicker and then gave it to her instantly for her reward....she chewed it up...spit it out. Just didn't make sense to me to pay that much money for a single treat.

SuperG
 

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If you've had to endure this story previously.....I apologize. I bought the clicker...read the instructions and it said "click and reward instantly"...I told my dog to sit...she did...I clicked the clicker and then gave it to her instantly for her reward....she chewed it up...spit it out. Just didn't make sense to me to pay that much money for a single treat.

SuperG
LOL. That is the first time I've heard that story.
I will share one story regarding training I have heard all my adult life. It doesn't involve dogs but I always found it amusing. From my father.
He says Cory do you know how your mother and I have stayed married so long. It all started on our wedding day. After we left the church we walked out and got in my horse and buggy. No we didn't have a car just a horse and buggy. I grabbed the reigns and said giddy up, the horse just stood there, so I said thats 1. Snapped the reigns again and said haaa, horse just stood there, I said that's 2. Snapped the reigns again and said haaa let's go you sum a buck. Horse just stood there. So I said that's 3. At this point I got down walked up front and shot the horse dead. Your mother got mad and started yelling why did you shoot the horse. I looked at her and said that's 1. Disclaimer this is obvious made up and my mother hates when he tells this.
 

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UGH!!!!!! I'm never trying to train this dog again. He's so awful. Awful awful awful UGH!!!!!

Teaching him take it and drop it is impossible. I can never mark the exact instant he lets go and then he just grabs it again. All he cares about are *** bugs and grass. Wraps the leash around a bush. Tries to destroy my thousand dollar laptop. Bit the *** out of my hand when I brought out the toy. I can't even describe exactly everything he did that pissed me off. Ugh!!!
OK then ... now it's not a dog issue it's a people issue.

You are not the first or only one that has been seriously ticked off at there Dog. Rocky and I had a very, very very bad start ... the old my dog changed thing?? 7 months of "Zero" issues and at 14 months and 116 lbs ..Rocky decided that Gunther as dog one was not gonna stand!! Five freaking fights Gunther was a trooper and Rocky was a A-Hole!! I got hurt first stitches ever (breaking up a dog fight) and a permanently bent little finger! At the time ... I was never able to solve that issue and Gunther passed after the last fight due to unrelated issue. I was "ticked" off!!! And I can carry a grudge, I was a "Bully guy" anyway and I did not sign on for this crap!!!!!!!!!!!

Intervention required becasue this ... could get ugly! My wife said to me ... if you can't let it go ... then "Rocky" has to go!! She ... can be a "PIA" but she was right. I still remember 7 years ago. It was an actual physical effort but I took a big sigh ... and "I let it go!"

And ... ironically enough "fortunately" for me ... "Rocky's" rampage was not done??? Round two H/A issues, WTH?? He greeted company with a cold hard stare and a low growl??? Pretty sure at that point with most people ...he'd have been gone ...back to rescue you go and good luck to you sir! But for "me" ... it was "Payback Time!!" :)

This crap ... shall not stand, I just needed to figure out how?? It was actually I say "astonishingly" simple to solve pretty much just did what I also with my dogs anyway ... "leerburgh Who Pets my Puppy or Dog" except instead of always saying "Yes" I said "NO!"

And ... the rest of our story is here.:
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/aggression-good-bad-ugly/399905-what-would-my-dog-do.html

Had I chosen to say "screw this" he's out of here! That ... would never have happened and all the ten's of thousands of words I've written here and on Boxerforum would never have been written. I have no idea how many people I have actually helped (although I have a good idea of how many I have ticked off. :p )

But my point is ... your at a crossroad. So it's time to "Fish or Cut Bait" as they say. When your ready to stop doing and start "thinking" ... I got your back. :)

I tried with the "Clicker" thing but ... that was a "fail" on part ... SuperG did better there. :p

But in ancient asian philosophy "sometimes less is more." :)
 

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Bit the *** out of my hand when I brought out the toy.
Sounds like you found something that really gets your dog's attention.....granted it might not be ideal....getting some teeth...but I'd use the "toy"....as long as you can maintain a bit more discipline on your dog's behalf as well as a bit of bite accuracy.

Just a thought...so if others with more experience want to critique my thought...please do.

SuperG
 
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