[Fodder]

I'm still up in the air as far as "to Raw or not to Raw" and figured I should exhaust every resource available before deciding.

I'm now feeding Canidae Platinum - One concern I'm having is the proper fat/cal/protein/ingredient ratios for my 85lb 8.5yr old girl with HD.

Ideally I'd like to find a food that is low fat, low cals, 30ish% protein, containing fish & sweet potatoes as both are anti inflamatories. other protein sources are fine, but i'm trying to stay away from white potatoes and they seem to be a staple in most of the grain free diets.

I also have a 1yr old male and I'd like to have him on a similar diet so that I'm not running to different stores and having one run out of food before the other.

So ya, thats MY situation... in general tho, whats important for seniors, with special attention to HD (as I assume protein levels have to be substantial to promote good muscle tone in the rear)

Thanks guys.

 

[roxy84]

Ideally I'd like to find a food that is low fat, low cals, 30ish% protein, containing fish & sweet potatoes as both are anti inflamatories. other protein sources are fine, but i'm trying to stay away from white potatoes and they seem to be a staple in most of the grain free diets

thats what ive been searching for as well for my senior. natures variety instict rabbit came close to those criteria-no potato, 35% protein, salmon meal as a major ingredient, and the calcium/phosphorus arent too high. i didnt like the 22% fat though. i ended up with the wellness core ocean. i like the 34% protein, reasonable calc/phos, and fish sources. it has only 14% fat, but it does have the potatoes. i have wondered why all the grainless foods cant substitute sweet potatoes for the potatoes. is it cost? id gladly pay more for that food

i had tried the canidae platinum, but he was losing weight and looked no slimmer. the vet and i agreed he was losing muscle mass. after doing some research, i was comfortable with the notion that a senior dog needs quite a bit more protein to maintain muscle mass. since rotating between the core and innova lg breed senior(26% protein) for a few months his energy level has gone up, he looks slimmer but has actually gained 2 lbs, so i am happy w/ results so far.

 

[3K9Mom]

roxy and I have been kind of bouncing around about what's best for seniors for a while now. I'd stick with roxy's suggestion for now. I feed Instinct to my senior. It doesn't have potatoes, but it's higher in fat. Try her suggestion first. If that doesn't work, Instinct could be an option.

If your senior pup is losing weight, then additional fat in her diet might be a good thing.

 

[Fodder]

thank you both.
i havent noticed much change in her weight aside from losing 6lbs while recently being sick. it actually brought her back to the weight she was suppose to be, so at this point i'd like to either maintain the weight or at least add new weight in muscle.

the 22% fat scares me. things will be better now because of summer and swimming, but its hard to get the proper amount of exercise so ive been trying to keep her fat under 20%. 14% sounds doable and i will check out the ingredients in wellness now. if potatoes arent too high up on the ingredients list it will be okay.

did either of you try natural balance fish & sweet potatoes, or was the protein just too low?

are either of you dealing with arthritis or hd?

 

[roxy84]

btw, i chose my nickname after the greatest dog who ever lived (well, to me anyway) , but i am, in fact , a man

ive still been thinking about using the instinct rabbit to see how my old guy handles the higher fat. i still really like that it does not use potatoes. you'd think that one of the grainless companies would come up w/ a senior formula w/o potatoes. i suppose eventually someone will, as their seems to be more and more grainless kibbles coming down the pipeline.

 

[3K9Mom]

I'm actually feeding my senior 3/4ths Instinct and 1/4th Natural Balance SP&F right now, on a trial basis. After Roxy's and my "conversations," I decided to bring down the fat some; the NB SP&F has potatoes and it's high in carbs, that's why I'm feeding it in such low amounts. I'm curious to see if it helps. My senior has thyroid issues, so she could use to lose about 4 lbs, and I'm hoping this will help.

But those carbs...and those potatoes...

I have some arthritis issues I'm dealing with. Well, we had a lot of arthritis issues, but once we went grain-free, much of the creakiness went away as well.

But if she loses the weight, that could really help the rest of the achiness and perhaps get her off of her Tramadol for good.

There is, unfortunately, no perfect kibble out there.

 

[roxy84]

i wanted higher protein than the natural balance. my dog has been dealing with arthritis since he was 9 (hes 12 now). for most of his life, i fed stuff i thought was good-iams and science diet. thats what i get for listening to vets about nutrition. i switched to canidae platinum at 10 yrs, i couldnt believe how much his energy level and coat improved. but, then he started to slow down last year and lose muscle mass. with the switch to grainless, there have been less signs of stiffness and he mostly trots on his walks and ocassionally runs after the puppy, things he never did once the arthritis started.

so, im not sure if the amount of potatoe in the wellness core is detrimental, or if the anti-inflammatory properties of the fish can cancel out the inflammatory properties of the potatoe??

and i second what 3k9 mom said about the weight. i think proper weight management played as big a role as the food changes in my dog. he also had thyroid issues, so for a while he wouldnt lose weight no matter how much i cut his food. once he was on the thyroid medication this quickly resolved that issue.

 

[Fodder]

Originally Posted By: 3K9Mom
There is, unfortunately, no perfect kibble out there.

hey guys, just thought i'd give an update on what i've decided to do.

in addition to raw 3x a week...

i took the wellness core suggestion and decided to mix the kibble with the canidae platinum which she was already on. then i merely took the average of both ingredient stats and its providing a bit of ease to my mind (as well as my pocket book). comes out to 26% protein and 11% fat which is pretty close to the innova senior but i'm getting the fish & sweet potatoes. im satisfied with this for now, and i figure the additional protein from the raw meat will help as well.

my boy can care less whats in gia's bowl so there has been no problems with the difference in food.

on another note - aside from the ingredients (turkey & potatoes) wellness core reduced fat WOULD have been the perfect food. 8% fat while still getting 34% protein

 

[BowWowMeow]

Hi everyone (and Camerafodder, you missed the part where Roxy says he's a man!),

Just noticing this thread. I have been feeding Chama the high protein, grain free foods for about 3 years now. I started with Timberwolf but ditched them when they changed their ingredients. For the past 9 months Chama has been eating either Canine Caviar or Orijen 6 fresh fish. In order to minimize potential problems from too much fat and protein I supplement with grain free canned (usually Nature's Variety duck), preprepared raw and fresh foods like cooked chicken, canned salmon, hard boiled eggs and whatever else is around.

I just bought a small bag of the Orijen Senior. I am going to mix it with the 6 fresh fish and see how that goes. It is a little lower protein and lower fat that the 6 fresh fish. Here are the ingredients (note that darn potato in there!):

Deboned chicken, chicken meal, turkey meal, russet potato, lake whitefish, sweet potato, whole eggs, turkey, chicken fat, salmon meal, salmon and anchovy oils, salmon, natural chicken flavour, sunflower oil, sun-cured alfalfa, dried brown kelp, carrots, spinach, peas, tomatoes, apples, psyllium, dulse, glucosamine Hcl, cranberries, black currants, rosemary extract, chondroitin sulfate, sea salt.

Here's the breakdown:

Protein 42.0%
Fat 14.0%
Carbohydrate 18.0%
Moisture 10.0%
Fiber 3.5%
Calcium (min.) 1.5%
Calcium (max.) 1.7%
Phosphorus (min.) 1.1%
Phosphorus (max.) 1.3%

 

[Fodder]

Originally Posted By: BowWowMeowHi everyone (and Camerafodder, you missed the part where Roxy says he's a man!),

notice the edit, i'm quick

lol

thanks for the into on Orijen. i have only found 1 store to carry near me (which is surprising) and they charge a TON. the protein to fat ratio sounds excellent, but i'm hoping that i'm coming close to that with my kibble + raw combo (?)

decisions decisions.
i suppose i could change my diet to top ramen for awhile eh?