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David,
There are so many variables just like peoples’ temperament/ personalities. And each dog’s prey drive is in comparison to every other dog. There is threshold to prey, how a dog’s eyes reveal his prey drive, extinction of prey with some dogs motivated to go all day long and some coming down in drive fairly quickly. I just thing the term off switch has become non useful jargon.
 

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Discussion Starter #62
Reactive in what way? Reactive to what? Are they able to recover? Do they have high suspicion but are able to still be stable? Or are you just talking crap nerves and fear that can't leave their homes? What do you consider "anxious" that is unacceptable? Btw...the term is actually "nerve" not anxious.
They recover, most do I think. Very crappy nerves and fear people
 

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David,
There are so many variables just like peoples’ temperament/ personalities. And each dog’s prey drive is in comparison to every other dog. There is threshold to prey, how a dog’s eyes reveal his prey drive, extinction of prey with some dogs motivated to go all day long and some coming down in drive fairly quickly. I just thing the term off switch has become non useful jargon.
Sure, the ability or tendency to chill comes from different places. Perspective matters, as I'm often in need of reminding. Common vernacular tends to lead to common conversation, and in some ways is necessary to graduate to uncommon conversation.

Motivation is clear and obvious to an experienced trainer, but eludes most until they have the opportunity to learn dogs. Settling in the house means a thing that comes from different places. When you don't understand those places, it's just a thing.
 

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I messaged Jax, she said the Grandmother of the female being bred can bring aggression.

Éos vom Haus Bergblick – working-dog This is the female

And here are the two possible sires.
Bordy - Bordy Blendy – working-dog

Irck - Irck de la Hutte du Berger – working-dog

EDITED
I had a female by Eyko Morfelder land - super temperament, solid solid nerves.....however, there IS one element of the pedigree here ) which can give you rather unstable aggression....depending on how the genes shake out and what combo she will be used with! I can see alot of aggression in both males pedigrees....

As far as the males? One misses alot I have been told....and the other left Europe due to high percentages of poor hip production....again, what I am hearing from others who have pups from him or were contemplating getting pups.

EDIT: Sorry - did not read whole conversation before posting.....can't seem to delete this

Lee
 
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If you have a GSD that is displaying behaviors that you think are abnormal anxiety, describe them and you will get a more reliable answer to your question. Solid pups show little to no fear about basic things such as a broom falling next to them or smacking the ground when doing bite work. If they do, it is quickly extinguished with good training.
I'm just trying to understand what exactly it is that people are saying about Wendelin producing "anxious" dogs. There is another known and very experienced breeder in southern Ontario that titles her own breeding stock and I've heard people say that she too produces "anxious" dogs. Sure, with the amount of dogs these two breeders produce, there is bound to be a few imperfect dogs. But to say that in general they are producing "anxious" dogs is very hard to believe.

I am just wondering if people are using terms loosely and not really understanding those terms. Are we talking about outright fear, sharpness, threshold, nerves, mistrust, suspicion, drives, or a dog getting excited in the truck as you approach their favorite park?

I am just really curious to know what sort of behaviors are people seeing that they would slap a label on that dog as being "anxious".



ello to all of my lovely friends here on this forum. I have come across Christina in my search of finding a good breeder. I have heard many great reviews and other awful ones of the dog they received from her. The great ones varied from "amazing dog, super companion, awesome service, knowledgeable breeder, etc" the negative reviews have usually been about her dogs having anxiety. So here comes the glorious question I have for you all, what are your experiences with Wendelin Farms?
However, she does breed heavy on the Czech lines so I don't doubt that some are sharper which would translate into "anxiety".
I worry about the anxiety. I want to be able to do Personal Protection but also be able to not worry if the dog has to go to a boarding for a day or so if something happens. I need a really well balanced dog.
Good breeders like Fraserglen as well as I am sure many others, you get dogs that are naturally confident and ready to go. All of the dogs coming from Fraserglen... not one has been ridden of anxiety, all confident and collected.
 

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reactive to things
They recover, most do I think. Very crappy nerves and fear people
So you are saying that the dogs you've heard of as being labeled as "anxious" are:

-reactive but recover - startle and recover ?
- they fear people and have crappy nerves

What do you mean when you say they fear people? The are hiding behind the couch when someone shows up at the door?
 

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So you are saying that the dogs you've heard of as being labeled as "anxious" are:

-reactive but recover - startle and recover ?
- they fear people and have crappy nerves

What do you mean when you say they fear people? The are hiding behind the couch when someone shows up at the door?
I'm just trying to understand what exactly it is that people are saying about Wendelin producing "anxious" dogs. There is another known and very experienced breeder in southern Ontario that titles her own breeding stock and I've heard people say that she too produces "anxious" dogs. Sure, with the amount of dogs these two breeders produce, there is bound to be a few imperfect dogs. But to say that in general they are producing "anxious" dogs is very hard to believe.

I am just wondering if people are using terms loosely and not really understanding those terms. Are we talking about outright fear, sharpness, threshold, nerves, mistrust, suspicion, drives, or a dog getting excited in the truck as you approach their favorite park?

I am just really curious to know what sort of behaviors are people seeing that they would slap a label on that dog as being "anxious".
Replies like thes make it hard to have honest conversations about dogs and breeders.
 

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Why is that?
If you don’t understand what it means when certain terms are used, that’s one thing. This comes off as an attack on these opinions. Some of these were questions asked looking for more clarification or information. Your responses are as if you take offense to things being said.
 

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If you don’t understand what it means when certain terms are used, that’s one thing. This comes off as an attack on these opinions. Some of these were questions asked looking for more clarification or information. Your responses are as if you take offense to things being said.
Well I apologize to you, @mattishere, and anyone else who was offended by my replies. I didn't mean to attack anyone. I'm seriously trying to understand what behaviours are people seeing in German Shepherds that they would label a dog as having "anxiety". What sort of traits are breeders producing that you can say that these are anxious dogs? Separation anxiety?
 

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I have a female out of haakons full brother Gerry morfelder land son can speak a little to the bitch lines. Social , hi drive, very intense, very stable with the family, no handler or food aggression. However does not slow down much and would be a lot for a first time buyer.
 

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Well I apologize to you, @mattishere, and anyone else who was offended by my replies. I didn't mean to attack anyone. I'm seriously trying to understand what behaviours are people seeing in German Shepherds that they would label a dog as having "anxiety". What sort of traits are breeders producing that you can say that these are anxious dogs? Separation anxiety?
Someone said earlier what he probably means is nervy.
 

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How many of these "anxious" dogs that some breeders are producing come from novice/poor or anxious owners as well?

We have a friend who is very anxious around large dogs. Guess what? Her kids are very anxious around large dogs; she has transferred her anxiousness to her kids and you can also do that to dogs.
 

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Discussion Starter #74
Well I apologize to you, @mattishere, and anyone else who was offended by my replies. I didn't mean to attack anyone. I'm seriously trying to understand what behaviours are people seeing in German Shepherds that they would label a dog as having "anxiety". What sort of traits are breeders producing that you can say that these are anxious dogs? Separation anxiety?
I am not upset, no worries friend.

Let me put something out there. You can say a breeder has a ton of dogs and a few turn out bad, but what if its the opposite and few turn out good? This is not directed to anyone... but some people I have talked to say a breeder is good and they have anxiety. Sooner or later even bad dogs will possibly give good off spring. Finding the right breeder is difficult :/
 

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Discussion Starter #75
So you are saying that the dogs you've heard of as being labeled as "anxious" are:

-reactive but recover - startle and recover ?
- they fear people and have crappy nerves

What do you mean when you say they fear people? The are hiding behind the couch when someone shows up at the door?
Essentially. Look up nervy gsd
 

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Discussion Starter #76
I'm just trying to understand what exactly it is that people are saying about Wendelin producing "anxious" dogs. There is another known and very experienced breeder in southern Ontario that titles her own breeding stock and I've heard people say that she too produces "anxious" dogs. Sure, with the amount of dogs these two breeders produce, there is bound to be a few imperfect dogs. But to say that in general they are producing "anxious" dogs is very hard to believe.

I am just wondering if people are using terms loosely and not really understanding those terms. Are we talking about outright fear, sharpness, threshold, nerves, mistrust, suspicion, drives, or a dog getting excited in the truck as you approach their favorite park?

I am just really curious to know what sort of behaviors are people seeing that they would slap a label on that dog as being "anxious".
When I was talking nerves I was talking about, getting scared of little things, etc.
 

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I'm just trying to understand what exactly it is that people are saying about Wendelin producing "anxious" dogs. There is another known and very experienced breeder in southern Ontario that titles her own breeding stock and I've heard people say that she too produces "anxious" dogs. Sure, with the amount of dogs these two breeders produce, there is bound to be a few imperfect dogs. But to say that in general they are producing "anxious" dogs is very hard to believe.

I am just wondering if people are using terms loosely and not really understanding those terms. Are we talking about outright fear, sharpness, threshold, nerves, mistrust, suspicion, drives, or a dog getting excited in the truck as you approach their favorite park?

I am just really curious to know what sort of behaviors are people seeing that they would slap a label on that dog as being "anxious".
I see you quoted me and took it out of context...so yeah.... Perhaps I should have used the word "could" instead of "would" and instead of quoting his terminology used the word "nerve". And as I stated....I like the Wendelin dogs I've met so really no need for anyone to be defensive. My point was that Czech lines generally tend to be sharp and some people could define that as "anxious" as a dog really can't be sharp without having a little nerve contributing. It's what they were bred for.

I'm sure my definition of acceptable sharpness is not going to be the same as someone getting their first dog and wanting a hiking partner to go everywhere with them. My female is sharp and suspicious but has the nerve to keep it all under control. I'm not going to drop her into a neighborhood BBQ and expect her to be social. I'm also sure the OP would classify her as having "anxiety" because of her suspicion even though she shows no fear.

The problem with your question to the OP is that he obviously doesn't understand sharp vs nervy if he doesn't even know the terminology and doesn't understand the varying degrees of nerve if he stated that dogs "react and recover" are "anxious". Which I why I've told him at least 3 times to go watch the dogs and meet them. It's hard to have a real opinion when you've never been exposed.

To answer your above question - I'm well aware of what the terms mean and how to apply them. :)
 

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Essentially. Look up nervy gsd
Let me solve this for you. Shadow is "nervy". She relies on familiarity and routine. New stuff scares her, people scare her, bags blowing in the wind scare her. She bites when she's scared, or bolts. She is an anxious dog.
This is a huge, massive difference from sharp or suspicious. Those things are correct in a GSD as long as they have "the nerve" to back it up.
 

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Perhaps the confusion is in that certain established breeders have reputations and when sweeping generalizations are made about their puppies, such as that the majority have “anxiety” and exhibit it “from day one”, the members with GSD experience are trying to figure out where such statements are coming from. If the majority of claims are coming from novice owners who don’t have direct experience with working line shepherds prior, there is the possibility that “anxiety” is being mislabeled for what is suspicion/drive/under exercised/under stimulated/owner anxiety transference etc. The occurrence of misunderstanding from novice owners could also be higher when there are litters being produced at a much higher rate. Some breeders regularly video their litters before they are sent to their homes, such as the breeder in this discussion, and their confidence over being exposed to a variety of stimuli can be observed. This is what I understand from this discussion anyways.
 

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I may have missed it but I don't see "frustration" anywhere here. A dog that has performed, or is intent on reacting to perceived threats can also be frustrated and appear anxious, while being deterred by its handler.
 
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