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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
Just stumbled across this excellent 2017 New York Times article about the Vietnam war dogs:

http://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/03/opinion/the-dogs-of-the-vietnam-war.html

Most people still don't know what happened to these heroic dogs when the US military withdrew from Vietnam. You can see the full story on youtube.com. It's not a new movie, but few people have seen it. I think everyone in this country should watch it. Just click on the link Watch this video on youtube in the video below when you try to play it and get the "Video unavailable" message.


It is one of the most heartbreaking things I have ever seen. America's betrayal of these magnificent dogs is unforgivable and should never be forgotten.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thank you. It’s a whole movie! I’m going to try to stream it on my TV rather than sitting over a tiny screen.
Thanks for your interest. Many people would rather not know.

I'll be very interested in hearing what you think. I think the movie is outstanding--very gripping and nothing like a boring documentary. Once you start watching, it's hard to stop.
 

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As Sherman said ...."war is ****"........




The video portrays a perspective which should get to the core of most all.....dog enthusiast or otherwise.





SuperG
 

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This is a really touching video. I think it was shameful how the army treated these animals when they chose to leave them behind.

Things are much different now. If a handler gets wounded and returns home, so does the dog. If a handler is KIA, the dog returns home. If a dog gets wounded, they have the same priority as a soldier. They are often flown to Germany with the handler to receive the best veterinary care available. No U.S. Military dogs get left behind.

There are still some major issues in the military dog world, particularly with adoption after the dog is retired, but things are much better than they used to be.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
Laws were passed almost 20 years ago to help keep anything like that from happening again.
The best way to ensure that something like this will happen again is to assume that it never will.

Laws change. Another unpopular war, more claims of foreign canine diseases coming back with war dogs to the US, and it will all happen again.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana

That is why it is so important to never forget what happened to the Vietnam war dogs.

And watching the War Dogs video is a good way to honor these splendid dogs. Also, for people who don't fully realize how much these dogs are worth, the movie makes it totally clear.

Interesting that you are discouraging people from watching a movie that honors war dogs.

For folks who like to make up their own minds, you might want to check out the video. I guarantee you won't be bored. And you will come away with an understanding of war dogs far beyond what most people have.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
There are still some major issues in the military dog world, particularly with adoption after the dog is retired
And that is just disgraceful given the sacrifices made by these dogs and their handlers. There should be no issues at all.

Yet another reason for people to watch the video so they understand what war dogs are worth and why they and their handlers deserve so much better than they are getting even today.
 

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https://justice4tedds.com/robbyslaw/

Laws were passed almost 20 years ago to help keep anything like that from happening again.
Are you familiar with Justice 4 TEDDs? They are a fantastic group working really hard at bringing people to justice for some less than stellar behavior. They also do everything possible to get retired dogs back to their handlers.

Fama was initially a TEDD dog. I was lucky enough to hear about her retirement on this forum and I had some friends here and in high places that enabled me to get her back. It isn't always so easy.

The producer of Black Fish is doing a documentary on the TEDD dogs.
 

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Discussion Starter #11 (Edited)
Are you familiar with Justice 4 TEDDs? They are a fantastic group working really hard at bringing people to justice for some less than stellar behavior. They also do everything possible to get retired dogs back to their handlers.
An outstanding group, but it looks like they try to help only tactical explosive detection dogs. What about the other war dogs? Who (if anyone) helps them? What would have happened to Fama if she hadn't been a TEDD dog?

David, what can civilians do to make sure war dogs are treated right, including being promptly reunited with their handlers who want them? Public outrage over highly publicized cases like Sergeant Rex have forced the military to finally do right for individual dogs (although belately--Sergeant Rex didn't live long after the military finally allowed him to go home; I think it was hemangiosarcoma that killed him). But how to bring about general changes so the right thing is automatically and routinely and promptly done for the dogs and their handlers?

Obviously, civilians first need to get it about what war dogs and their handlers are worth. Which is why the video is so valuable. But then what? How to force the military to do what they are supposed to do?

I realize it's a lot easier for folks to sit around on their behinds going la la la, everything's fine now, don't worry, be happy. But for those of us who are livid about how many of these dogs are treated, what do you suggest we do to change this?
 

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How incredibly sad that they were let down by the military that recruited them, and left to a fate worse than death if abandoned, or given over to the South Vietnamese. I'm sure they couldn't smell the difference between North and South Vietnamese- to the dogs they were the enemy. That was a heartbreaking film to watch.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
How incredibly sad that they were let down by the military that recruited them, and left to a fate worse than death if abandoned, or given over to the South Vietnamese. I'm sure they couldn't smell the difference between North and South Vietnamese- to the dogs they were the enemy. That was a heartbreaking film to watch.
No, they couldn't tell the difference--that is an excellent insight. Here's a very sad comment on the New York Times article that speaks to this:

"Gilbert
Oct. 4, 2017
We were able to adopt 1 of those soldiers who were left behind. I was 8 years old and remembered that we took good care of him(we were well off & we did give him beef & he reluctantly ate it for his meals). However, he was quite unhappy (since he was trained to chase down VC and like it or not we looked like VC). We used a veterinarian to put him down after a 3-4 weeks as he refused to eat and was giving up on life. At least for 1 soldier who was abandoned, we gave him the best care."

From:

http://www.nytimes.com/2017/10/03/opinion/the-dogs-of-the-vietnam-war.html#commentsContainer

America's betrayal of these dogs and their handlers was unforgivable and should never be forgotten.
 

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Who is discouraging it? I think we all are pretty firm on the fact that the dogs have been wronged in the past, it’s been brought to light via many avenues. And people are standing up for these dogs and their rights as much as they do for human soldiers. It’s not something that’s being swept under a rug once a law is past through Congress. There are still people, to this very day, fighting for these dogs.
 

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Are you familiar with Justice 4 TEDDs? They are a fantastic group working really hard at bringing people to justice for some less than stellar behavior. They also do everything possible to get retired dogs back to their handlers.

Fama was initially a TEDD dog. I was lucky enough to hear about her retirement on this forum and I had some friends here and in high places that enabled me to get her back. It isn't always so easy.

The producer of Black Fish is doing a documentary on the TEDD dogs.
Not really. I remembered there had been some legislation and I had looked at some available dogs a couple of times.
 

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There was some post on this forum awhile back on just for TEDD the program had many issues and the people managing did a lot of mismanaging and crooked things despite the purpose of the program not all for their dogs back. I do understand they are suppose to change make revisions to the law.
 

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@JonRob you need to chill out no one is discouraging anything. It is good to make people aware who are not but to make assumptions is questioning. Write to your representative is a start. There are organizations that help place military dogs to their handlers I just posted one.
 

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Are you familiar with Justice 4 TEDDs? They are a fantastic group working really hard at bringing people to justice for some less than stellar behavior. They also do everything possible to get retired dogs back to their handlers.
An outstanding group, but it looks like they try to help only tactical explosive detection dogs. What about the other war dogs? Who (if anyone) helps them? What would have happened to Fama if she hadn't been a TEDD dog?

David, what can civilians do to make sure war dogs are treated right, including being promptly reunited with their handlers who want them? Public outrage over highly publicized cases like Sergeant Rex have forced the military to finally do right for individual dogs (although belately--Sergeant Rex didn't live long after the military finally allowed him to go home; I think it was hemangiosarcoma that killed him). But how to bring about general changes so the right thing is automatically and routinely and promptly done for the dogs and their handlers?

Obviously, civilians first need to get it about what war dogs and their handlers are worth. Which is why the video is so valuable. But then what? How to force the military to do what they are supposed to do?

I realize it's a lot easier for folks to sit around on their behinds going la la la, everything's fine now, don't worry, be happy. But for those of us who are livid about how many of these dogs are treated, what do you suggest we do to change this?
Fama was initially a TEDD, then a PEDD. That program (J4T) came about after I had already gotten her back. I was also a contractor for the same kennels that handled the TEDD program for the first few years. Another company won the bid and all the dogs that hadn't been rotated into regular Army dogs were moved. That's when all the alleged shady stuff went down.

Mission K9 Rescue is a great organization that deals with military and contract dogs. They help get contract dogs stuck overseas back to the U.S.

There are several Facebook groups dedicated to helping find handlers when dogs are in disposition.

Retired dogs can be adopted from Lackland AFB. They have a website for retired working dogs that outlines the process.

Write your congressman and tell them it's important to you.

Just to be 100% clear, there is no reason to be livid about how the vast majority of these dogs are treated. I thought I explained that in my earlier post. The only trouble with the military system is that some of the dogs are misappropriated after retirement. They go to a civilian home instead of to one of their prior handlers. I don't think that's mistreatment, but it certainly isn't right.

There are some companies that will keep contract dogs that are being retired down range until they have amassed a lot of them to get them home for less money per dog. Some are left there if the contracting company is dropped. Mission K9 Rescue helps those dogs. Most of those companies are not U.S. based. These are NOT military dogs.

If you want to help, it's fairly easy to do a search for retired military working dog assistance organization and see what's out there.

Another way to help is to get on anysoldier.com and search for dog teams to send care packages. Things like Kongs, tugs, Scentlogix training aids, gloves, poop bags, tennis balls, water filters, long lines, leashes with frog snaps, ... All good stuff to send a deployed team. The best thing to send them is a letter and your email address (and Girl Scout cookies).
 
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