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Please help us decide if and when to neuter our mason...wife and i are on the fence...he was pick of the litter and is one year old next week...she wants to and i want to at least wait till he is 2 or so....what say yall?
to fix or not to fix that is the question
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if he doesnt have any behavior or temperment issues & is not at risk of getting anyone pregnant, then sure wait until two. i'm confused as to why you mentioned he was pick of the litter - is there a chance that you'll breed him? because whether or not you should breed is a different story. but even still, gotta wait til two for ofa's.
right off the bat tho, if you arent a professional breeder, and he wasnt sold to you with breeding rights... then neuter him!
right off the bat tho, if you arent a professional breeder, and he wasnt sold to you with breeding rights... then neuter him!
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I wish I wouldn't have, only because my GSD has a number of health problems and I often wonder if the hormone imbalance from neutering isn't a contributing factor. He was neutered at about 1 1/2 years. I noticed very little change in him at the time.
Of course I'm assuming that you can train your boy while he is unneutered, and also that you can ensure that there are no unwanted pregnancies.
Of course I'm assuming that you can train your boy while he is unneutered, and also that you can ensure that there are no unwanted pregnancies.
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Thanks for the replies ...he has proven very easy to work with ...great with small kids and very quick to learn...we did not get him with intennt of breeding but do have the rights...and he is showing alot of "natural"ability to search and trail with little training...my wife is a Homemaker so he gets lots of time to work.We feel we are able to prevent any pregnancies as he is always with one of us or inside the house...
My main concern is him getting stuck in puppyhood if he is fixxed before mature.Is this warrented?What are the benifits of an intact male other than breeding? what do people feel the benifits of neutering are? thanks
My main concern is him getting stuck in puppyhood if he is fixxed before mature.Is this warrented?What are the benifits of an intact male other than breeding? what do people feel the benifits of neutering are? thanks
Many people say wait until 18-24 months old. I knew for sure I wanted to wait until Keefer was a year old, but I didn't really want to wait until he was two. I ended up having it done at 15 months. He already had a big head and masculine look to him, and I don't see any personality changes at all. He'll be 3 at the end of August.
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I think that getting a dog fixed is purely for our convenience unless there is a medical reason, such as testicular cancer. Testicular cancer happens in less than 1% of dogs and is easy to fix when it is found.
However, there is a correlation between early spay and neuter and osteosarcoma which is a death sentence. There are many other things including problems due to improper growth that are related to spaying or neutering before a dog is full grown.
There is always the threat of side effects or death from the anesthetic. It happens. Even if the dog just has a bit of oxygen deprivation and lives, it could cause siezures later on. At least this is known to be the case with humans. With all the dogs out there with epilepsy, I wonder how many are neutered, and how many did not show any problems before they were neutered. My friends bitch was nine when she spayed her. Shortly after she started having siezures. A lot of dogs are diagnosed with epilepsy between 2 and 3. It just makes me wonder.
Doubtless you have a list of pros and cons. No one from your vet to your groomer to your trainer will tell you NOT to neuter your dog. Perhaps it is true that 90% of people cannot keep an intact dog celibate. Who knows? But Neutering is not synonimous with responsible dog ownership.
Good luck.
However, there is a correlation between early spay and neuter and osteosarcoma which is a death sentence. There are many other things including problems due to improper growth that are related to spaying or neutering before a dog is full grown.
There is always the threat of side effects or death from the anesthetic. It happens. Even if the dog just has a bit of oxygen deprivation and lives, it could cause siezures later on. At least this is known to be the case with humans. With all the dogs out there with epilepsy, I wonder how many are neutered, and how many did not show any problems before they were neutered. My friends bitch was nine when she spayed her. Shortly after she started having siezures. A lot of dogs are diagnosed with epilepsy between 2 and 3. It just makes me wonder.
Doubtless you have a list of pros and cons. No one from your vet to your groomer to your trainer will tell you NOT to neuter your dog. Perhaps it is true that 90% of people cannot keep an intact dog celibate. Who knows? But Neutering is not synonimous with responsible dog ownership.
Good luck.
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to me, an un neutered dog is the equivalent of a man that cannont have sex or masterbate for 12-14yrs.
its just my personal belief, therefore i wouldnt do it to my dog.
until spaying & neutering is linked to HD or obsession with the cat litterbox - i will continue to have my girls spayed before their first heat and my males neutered once his desired male characteristics are developed (as cassidy's mom mentioned above) which is usually prior to two. i've yet to experience any 'cons'.
its just my personal belief, therefore i wouldnt do it to my dog.
until spaying & neutering is linked to HD or obsession with the cat litterbox - i will continue to have my girls spayed before their first heat and my males neutered once his desired male characteristics are developed (as cassidy's mom mentioned above) which is usually prior to two. i've yet to experience any 'cons'.
Never fix a good male GSD. Opionated yes, but recent medical studies indicate that neutering a male GSD creates more health problems then it alleviates.
The same studies regarding a female are quite different.
If you want a copy of the recent info I will be glad to try and find, and post. The study has been posted on this board before, but if you cannot find it, i would be glad to help.
The same studies regarding a female are quite different.
If you want a copy of the recent info I will be glad to try and find, and post. The study has been posted on this board before, but if you cannot find it, i would be glad to help.
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Osteosarcoma (bone cancer) in both males and females is linked to early spay/neuter.
Joint porblems due to speuter before the growth plates close may contribute to hip and elbow dysplasia.
I do not ever want a dog to go under anesthesia unless it is NECESSARY. Neutering/spaying is generally done for CONVENIENCE.
I have two young intact males and they do not seem frustrated like a guy who hasn't masterbated or had sex in fourteen years. Sorry, but that statement just bothered me. Every training class I go to, Rushie becomes an exhibitionist, but Cujo lets his dothingy out and about on occasion too and he was neutered at 18 weeks. And my older boy, almost 4, I never notice his out. Yes, they will grunt at eachother and pace if there is a bitch in heat, but it doesn't hurt them any.
There was a study that showed that spaying bitches young often makes them more fearful. There are studies about all kinds of stuff, but I have heard in more places than one that spayed bitches can be more guarding and aggressive than intact bitches.
Those hormones are there for a reason. They are for people, and they are for canines too.
The next canine of mine that gets fixed will have a life threatening condition. To me it doesn't make sense to threaten your dog's life and health to fix something that isn't broken.
Joint porblems due to speuter before the growth plates close may contribute to hip and elbow dysplasia.
I do not ever want a dog to go under anesthesia unless it is NECESSARY. Neutering/spaying is generally done for CONVENIENCE.
I have two young intact males and they do not seem frustrated like a guy who hasn't masterbated or had sex in fourteen years. Sorry, but that statement just bothered me. Every training class I go to, Rushie becomes an exhibitionist, but Cujo lets his dothingy out and about on occasion too and he was neutered at 18 weeks. And my older boy, almost 4, I never notice his out. Yes, they will grunt at eachother and pace if there is a bitch in heat, but it doesn't hurt them any.
There was a study that showed that spaying bitches young often makes them more fearful. There are studies about all kinds of stuff, but I have heard in more places than one that spayed bitches can be more guarding and aggressive than intact bitches.
Those hormones are there for a reason. They are for people, and they are for canines too.
The next canine of mine that gets fixed will have a life threatening condition. To me it doesn't make sense to threaten your dog's life and health to fix something that isn't broken.
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Holisticly, for the sake of the 'whole' dog, I would never neuter. I have never had a neutered male, and truly, the dogs were never restless, pacing, superdominant, aggressive, testoreone-hyped maniacal monsters hellbent on conquering females and territory and ruling the roost... just calm, well-trained dogs. To be truthful, I have never had a male who marked-- not even on walks. Just my experiences.
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Your post cracked me up!
I have a male that is almost 9yo and NOT neutered. Has never "done it", and is not a phsycho, "sex" driven maniac either. In fact when we are out in public, folks are SURPRISED when they discover he is intact. (He is not a GSD he is an ACD/Aussie mix. He has less coat than a GSD and you can see his testicles when he is walking away from you due to the shorter coat and natural bob-tail. That is when folks figure out he is intact, because they see "them," not because he "uses" them.)
As far as marking, intact males, neutered males, spayed and unspayed females can ALL be "markers" or not.
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Please post research, not sponsored by a biased organization, NOT in breeds already predisposed to osteosarcoma, to substantiate this.
Not saying that information doesn't exist, just want to see it! Thank you!
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Hmmm...lots to consider...I belive that most problems such as marking and excitability around females in heat can all be overcome with proper training and repeatition...I too feel that the majority of pets are fixxed for their owners convience...For now we will wait awhile and see...How do you know if you want to breed before he fully develops?That is a decision that can not be reversed.I am fully aware of responsable breeding so that to me is a mute argument...Thanks for all the first hand knowledge offered ...has more weight to me than someone who profits from their recomendation...
Pictures coming soon...I am still amazed at how easy and great he has been to deal with ...1 year and only one shoe:]
Pictures coming soon...I am still amazed at how easy and great he has been to deal with ...1 year and only one shoe:]
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I'm not sure it's out there when you put not in breeds already predisposed since that makes up most of the med/large dog breeds.
This piece is from an article not on neuter.org
"Risk for bone sarcoma was significantly influenced by age at gonadectomy. Male and female dogs that underwent gonadectomy before 1 year of age had an approximate one in four lifetime risk for bone sarcoma and were significantly more likely to develop bone sarcoma than dogs that were sexually intact [RR ±95% CI = 3.8 (1.5–9.2) for males; RR ±95% CI = 3.1 (1.1–8.3) for females]. 2 test for trend showed a highly significant inverse dose-response relationship between duration of lifetime gonadal exposure and incidence rate of bone sarcoma (P = 0.008 for males, P = 0.006 for females). This association was independent of adult height or body weight. We conclude that the subset of Rottweiler dogs that undergo early gonadectomy represent a unique, highly accessible target population to further study the gene:environment interactions that determine bone sarcoma risk and to test whether interventions can inhibit the spontaneous development of bone sarcoma. "
http://cebp.aacrjournals.org/cgi/content/full/11/11/1434
I think what needs to be done is to use EXTREME caution in suggesting that everyone leave their dogs intact for their entire life.
Everyone who has been on this board for more than a month knows that there are a lot of irresopnsible owners out there who will take that and run with it....and that would not be a good thing.
I do think though that responisble, careful pet owners should consider leaving their dog intact until mature.
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Thanks for bringing up that study, mine was in an e-mail format, and though I know I kept it, it would take forever to dig it out.
What irritates me about spay and neuter is that everyone is so gung ho for everyone to do it that they ignore all the risks and put out a lot of misinformation about it.
For example, my main reason for neutering Cujo was that I was giving him to my parents, and I was encouraged by vets and by trainers that neutering males will make them easier to manage. Cujo is no easier to manage than Rushie and Rushie has all of his parts. That is one case.
People come up to me in pet stores and while discussing how great my dog is, they then accuse me of wanting the dog to get cancer because he is not neutered. When in fact the opposite is true.
Rescue people pretty much feel that the ends justify the means when encouraging people to spay neuter.
Vets pretty much figure the price tag of the spay neuter is worth encouraging everyone to do this. And they do not bother to mention the problems that spaying/neutering and anesthetic may cause.
And people like attach spaying/neutering to responsible dog ownership like love and marriage. When there is nothing further from the truth. Spay/neuter allows you to be less responsible about your dogs, it is ok if he runs over and plays with the neighbor's bitch, he's fixed. I think not.
And all of this leads the way for legislation to be passed for spay/neuter requirements for dogs as young as four months old.
I would rather see us tell people, that if they wish to keep their dog intact, they need to be vigilent about containing the dog. Whether the dog is neutered or not, they need to be vigilent about containment. People have to stop being lax about security.
What irritates me about spay and neuter is that everyone is so gung ho for everyone to do it that they ignore all the risks and put out a lot of misinformation about it.
For example, my main reason for neutering Cujo was that I was giving him to my parents, and I was encouraged by vets and by trainers that neutering males will make them easier to manage. Cujo is no easier to manage than Rushie and Rushie has all of his parts. That is one case.
People come up to me in pet stores and while discussing how great my dog is, they then accuse me of wanting the dog to get cancer because he is not neutered. When in fact the opposite is true.
Rescue people pretty much feel that the ends justify the means when encouraging people to spay neuter.
Vets pretty much figure the price tag of the spay neuter is worth encouraging everyone to do this. And they do not bother to mention the problems that spaying/neutering and anesthetic may cause.
And people like attach spaying/neutering to responsible dog ownership like love and marriage. When there is nothing further from the truth. Spay/neuter allows you to be less responsible about your dogs, it is ok if he runs over and plays with the neighbor's bitch, he's fixed. I think not.
And all of this leads the way for legislation to be passed for spay/neuter requirements for dogs as young as four months old.
I would rather see us tell people, that if they wish to keep their dog intact, they need to be vigilent about containing the dog. Whether the dog is neutered or not, they need to be vigilent about containment. People have to stop being lax about security.
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Yeah-Rottweilers are one of the breeds that really get hit hard by it. http://www.vet.uga.edu/vpp/clerk/Kramer/index.php lists the breeds. There is another article refuting the information in that study, but just want to agree with you about the need for caution in terms of your last three paragraphs-that makes a LOT of sense. If you can be on top of your dog all the time-and honestly you understand you, your limitations, your dog and their drives and have them trained to a high level...it is possible to keep them intact until maturity. But if you have an ounce of lazy in you...I'd be careful!
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I'll never forget the first time I saw a grocery basket of adorable puppies being wheeled off to be euthanized. Why? The shelter already had too many dogs. Until that stops I won't stop advocating that people speuter. I have no issue with waiting until the dog is mature IF the people are willing to be extra vigilant. For many people that isn't going to happen.
For some reason our shelters are full of unwanted puppies. So there must be some dogs out there who smell a female in heat and get the idea that it's a good idea to climb the fence and get to her.
My brother had an unneutered male who would take off for weeks sometimes. I saw his dog wandering around the neighborhood after my brother had moved out of the neighborhood...and then realized it must have been one of my brother's dog's offspring. Was my brother responsible? Nope. And why didn't he get his dog neutered. Because "it wasn't natural."
Unfortunately while the OP is hopefully very responsible, there are far too many people out there like my brother. They open the door, the dog scoots out and before your know there are puppies in the picture. Or maybe they want their kids to experience "just one litter." What their kids don't experience is the puppies getting big and ending up in shelters.
For some reason our shelters are full of unwanted puppies. So there must be some dogs out there who smell a female in heat and get the idea that it's a good idea to climb the fence and get to her.
My brother had an unneutered male who would take off for weeks sometimes. I saw his dog wandering around the neighborhood after my brother had moved out of the neighborhood...and then realized it must have been one of my brother's dog's offspring. Was my brother responsible? Nope. And why didn't he get his dog neutered. Because "it wasn't natural."
Unfortunately while the OP is hopefully very responsible, there are far too many people out there like my brother. They open the door, the dog scoots out and before your know there are puppies in the picture. Or maybe they want their kids to experience "just one litter." What their kids don't experience is the puppies getting big and ending up in shelters.
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So basically, the ends justify the means.
I am probably one of the laziest people alive, but I have yet to have a litter I did not plan. Rushie is over two and has not yet had the pleasure of performing the deed. I have five intact females and not a one of them has gotten preggers yet, the younger ones will be two in August, the older ones will be three in August.
It isn't that hard.
There has to be two irresponsible people for an accidental neighborhood breeding. Encouraging everyone to speuter in hopes that the group of ignorant people who let their animals breed indiscriminently will not breed them isn't the answer. Especially with the risks associated with speuter. Because only the people who ARE responsible will bother. These people COULD manage their animals being intact. The idiots will not bother and you will still have dogs/puppies dying in shelters.
I am probably one of the laziest people alive, but I have yet to have a litter I did not plan. Rushie is over two and has not yet had the pleasure of performing the deed. I have five intact females and not a one of them has gotten preggers yet, the younger ones will be two in August, the older ones will be three in August.
It isn't that hard.
There has to be two irresponsible people for an accidental neighborhood breeding. Encouraging everyone to speuter in hopes that the group of ignorant people who let their animals breed indiscriminently will not breed them isn't the answer. Especially with the risks associated with speuter. Because only the people who ARE responsible will bother. These people COULD manage their animals being intact. The idiots will not bother and you will still have dogs/puppies dying in shelters.
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