[Jax's Mom]

What types of titles and how many would you consider "adequate" for breeding? I know the obvious answer would be "as many as possible" or SchH3, but at what point would a breeder decide their dog would make for good breeding stock?
I'm not asking because I want to breed my dog but what would you consider an absolute must before you'd put your kennel's name on a future puppy?

 

[Uniballer]

Absolute minimum for me: SchH 1, OFA hips & elbows, plus my own feeling that she is a great bitch. Better with an AD, conformation rating of "G" or better, and breed survey.

 

[DJEtzel]

I agree with Uniballer.

If they were in the ring, I'd want an AKC CH. before breeding plus hips/elbows and personal feeling.

 

[Uniballer]

I agree with Uniballer.

If they were in the ring, I'd want an AKC CH. before breeding plus hips/elbows and personal feeling.

Sorry, Uniballer doesn't agree with you. No SchH1, no breeding. It's OK to also put an AKC CH on her if you want, though .

I don't mean this as a personal attack but don't want your statement of agreement to include me as accepting a double standard for different lines.

 

[Xeph]

Championship, CD/RN (preferably both), CGC

 

[DJEtzel]

Sorry, Uniballer doesn't agree with you. No SchH1, no breeding. It's OK to also put an AKC CH on her if you want, though .

I don't mean this as a personal attack but don't want your statement of agreement to include me as accepting a double standard for different lines.

I only agreed with you on Sch, don't worry. You don't have to agree with me.

 

[GSDElsa]

I personally haven't looked at dogs in which at least one of the parents is SchH3. SchH1 OK on the other, but I want at least SchH3 on one of them. And I was to see consistent SchH3 in their pedigree (or IPO3 or whatever the equivelant is in whatever country they are from) back many generations. I think that the parents being titled is only a small part of the equation and one generation is not really a good way to tell if the parent is suitable for breeding. I also look at what titles the littermates have on them.

 

[bocron]

Kkl rating at least.

 

[Whiteshepherds]

Assuming that the double standard Uniballer mentioned isn't going to go away tomorrow, what do you want to see on the show lines, just the CH or more at the other end of the name?

 

[vomlittlehaus]

I think OFA hips at least good. OFA normal elbows. CERF cleared. At least one working title (not everyone can afford SchH). I wouldnt put a limit on the type of title, there are so many different disciplines to title a dog in. A working title shows the dog can handle the stress of training and titling at a trial. I would look at the confirmation of the dog also. I dont think I would require a working line dog to have a CH on it. I would like to get a confirmation rating on my working line female, but that would require SchH work.

 

[Xeph]

what do you want to see on the show lines, just the CH or more at the other end of the name?

More at the other end. With bitches, I am lenient with basic titles for the first litter but would like to see more advanced titles for the subsequent litters.

 

[GranvilleGSD]

I would like to get a confirmation rating on my working line female, but that would require SchH work.

You do not need to do schutzhund work in order to get a conformation show rating. You would need that for a KKL or the Seiger Show, but if you show at a club level show you can enter the without title class and get a show rating. SG would be the highest level you could obtain.


Even though I have put a variety of titles on my dogs, they are of little importance to me when choosing a breeding pair. Health and temperament are at the top of my list, followed by functional conformation. A title is a bonus, saying that somebody put the time, effort, and boatloads of $$$ into a dog. A title does not always equal a better dog.

 

[Uniballer]

... if you show at a club level show you can enter the without title class and get a show rating.

Yes, but if the dog is over 2 then the untitled rating is worthless for breeding qualification.

 

[AbbyK9]

Championship, CD/RN (preferably both), CGC

I understand the concept of performance titles other than Schutzhund as there are many venues out there in which a dog can compete, such as Ringsport, Agility, Herding, Obedience, etc. Personally, I would like to see something more than a CD or RN - I'd like to see the handler going further with their dog before breeding.

Nothing against earning a CD or an RN, but IMHO those are steps toward further titles, not the end-all, be-all a dog should have for breeding. IMHO it's like breeding a Schutzhund dog that has earned nothing but a BH in the sport.

A CGC should be a given for any dog with basic obedience, and I wouldn't really count it. I see a lot of backyard breeders who boast on their websites that their dogs have CGC titles, as if they're some big training achievement. (I guess to the average Joe who does not do any training with their dog, it could seem that way, however.)

Health testing, such as CERF and OFA should be a given for anyone who is going to breed. I am surprised that a lot of people mentioned those in this thread, since those aren't titles and the topic for the thread is which titles a dog should have earned.

 

[Xeph]

Personally, I would like to see something more than a CD or RN - I'd like to see the handler going further with their dog before breeding.

For boys, I certainly would. But I'm considering how long it takes to get a really nice, consistent, competition style heel (as opposed to going into the ring, rushing through, and just barely passing all three legs of the venue), and from what I've been reading, it actually takes a couple of years. Bitches do not have the same breeding capacity and timeline as males do.

 

[Whiteshepherds]

Is there a way to compare the tracking and obedience portions of SchH1, 2 & 3 with the tracking and obedience titles from the AKC?

In other words, would the tracking portion of SchH1 be similar to a TD or a TDX, that kind of thing? Or is it impossible to compare the two? (I understand only Sch has protection)

 

[Ruthie]

Is there a way to compare the tracking and obedience portions of SchH1, 2 & 3 with the tracking and obedience titles from the AKC?

In other words, would the tracking portion of SchH1 be similar to a TD or a TDX, that kind of thing? Or is it impossible to compare the two? (I understand only Sch has protection)

AKC has tracking and obedience, but how would you evaluate nerves and aggression without a protection title?

 

[Andaka]

For my dogs I require a male to be a champion before I would breed him or breed to him. For a female, if she can't have puppies then I am not sure that I want to spend the money required to finish her championship. Before she had a litter, I would want her to have some points toward her championship, and a performance title, but I wouldn't spend a lot of money until I was sure I was going to like what she produces. I have also finished shampionships on bitches that I had no intention of breeding, but they didn't have to take time off to have puppies either.

 

[Whiteshepherds]

AKC has tracking and obedience, but how would you evaluate nerves and aggression without a protection title?

You wouldn't. I guess I didn't ask that so it made sense.

If you weren't thinking about breeding, just comparing skill sets.
Would the dog with an SchH3 and a dog with a CT (Champion Tracker) from the AKC be on par as far as JUST tracking ability goes?

I'm trying to figure out how similar or different the tracking and obedience is between the SV and the AKC.
If a dog was trained for AKC tracking would he have to be totally retrained to do tracking if he joined the SV?

 

[Xeph]

If a dog was trained for AKC tracking would he have to be totally retrained to do tracking if he joined the SV?

Possibly. Certainly fine tuned. Dogs are allowed to cast in AKC, but not in SchH. From what I've heard though, the VST can REALLY be hard for a lot of the SchH dogs, which I find interesting.