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Over the last couple weeks my GF and I have been talking about starting our own breeding program. The more threads I see on here about how the GSD is not what it's supposed to be, makes me want to do it more. I'm thinking once I retire my current dog from sport I will get my foundation started. I'm excited for what the future may hold.
 

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@ Mycobraracr.....I have been in this breed for a long time and bred my first litter of knowledge in 1975. If the breed was in the same state as it was then and I was younger and know what I know now....I would go for it. But the status of the breed today makes it very difficult to breed successful GS in line with what fairly represents the breed. The proliferation of specific lines created out of backmassing of the gene pool, make the task of breeding very daunting to say the least. The onset of many more health issues often derived from these breeding practices, also make breeding very difficult today. Is it possible....sure! Many things are possible but not plausible. I wish you the best if you decide to do this, but I feel sad that you have to attempt to breed through the mess the breed has become today.
This Mycobraracr, is being said from a breeders perspective, and does NOT reflect ANYTHING negative about pet or sport dog owners.
 

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It can be daunting, frustrating and depressing at times... but also very rewarding. The breed needs more GOOD breeders. People who are involved in GSDs and the GSD community, and who gain knowledge and experience with the breed *first* before pumping out puppies. And who have an understanding of what the breed is about and a strong dedication to preserving that. All categories you'd definitely fit into. So go for it! :)
 

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It can be daunting, frustrating and depressing at times... but also very rewarding. The breed needs more GOOD breeders. People who are involved in GSDs and the GSD community, and who gain knowledge and experience with the breed *first* before pumping out puppies. And who have an understanding of what the breed is about and a strong dedication to preserving that. All categories you'd definitely fit into. So go for it! :)
The more good real responsible breeders out there, hopefully people will start to get the message and start going to them when looking for their next puppy.

Good luck!
 

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It can be daunting, frustrating and depressing at times... but also very rewarding. :)
Frustrating is an understatement. :eek: It is getting harder and harder to find males that will bring what I want to my females without bringing negatives I don't want added to my lines. Then finding buyers who are looking for a GSD and not some extreme of one sort or another.

I had a person contact me who was looking for a dog for competition who wanted an extreme dog with a long bite like a Mali. Then I get the ones looking for a prick eared soft couch potato. Two extremes, neither GSD.

Start with the best female you can find, work her, title her and make no compromises. If she works out, hope to a find a male that will bring her balance, keep the best female from that litter, and so on and so on.
 

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the GSD needs good new breed stewards , because in breeding that is what you do . It is a responsibility . You have one to the health and welfare of the breed and you have a responsibility to those that choose the breed to work with , live with . Quality . Not quantity.
Could not have said it better than Chris or Lisa .

There is nothing more rewarding and gratifying than producing dogs that have made positive contributions in work , even though the accomplishment is not out there with some acknowledgement on paper . There is no title for "law enforcement dog who stands off bear , continues track, locates, makes clean apprehension of dangerous suspect " .
That's what keeps me going .
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Wow! Thanks for all the encouragement. From all of you it really means a lot. It saddens me to read that LE and Military are going to other breeds mainly because of nerve issues and what not. I know not one person can fix it but I do feel I can contribute to bringing it back to a true utilitarian breed.
 

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I love your phrase "true utilitarian breed" because in my opinion this is where breeders have failed.

Addressing other threads - 60 minutes , old style training (?) which morphed into police ----- I get the feeling that some , not so involved , posters think it is all about aggression. If you were to look at procurement requirements from both brokers and departments each would want a sound , stable , dog that is focused and able to work around excitement and distraction. They want a dog that is approachable , not fearing or being aggressive when in groups of people . So much for the image of the nasty dog . A dog that is too aggressive is not a good prospect . A solid , bold , self confident dog does not look or act aggressive . There is a power that oozes from them . Control and trainability. Willing and bold to take on challenges. Hunt and search drive . Natural instincts for this hunt and search . Tracking drive .
The bread and butter of work is to locate and hold , locate and alert . Bite when necessary.

utility, versatility.
 

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Thanks! Honestly that's one of the reasons I'm waiting until my current dogs are retired. One to give me more time to learn and work the breed but also I have come to the realization that my current dogs are on the "too sporty" side of things. I absolutely love my dogs and they are perfect for me but I'm not 100% convinced they are all that a GSD could be. I think my hardest thing right now is seeing what is the dog and what is training. I have learned through working some dogs that even a nerve bag can be trained through a lot.
 

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a sound , stable , dog that is focused and able to work around excitement and distraction. They want a dog that is approachable , not fearing or being aggressive when in groups of people ... A solid , bold , self confident dog does not look or act aggressive . ... Control and trainability. Willing and bold to take on challenges.
sounds like the perfect pet...you wont be able to sell all to LE, military, etc........pet homes need dogs just as good
 

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I would check out all of the different flavors of the GSD because you also need to know what you don't want as well as what you do want. You need to know the difference.
 

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I would check out all of the different flavors of the GSD because you also need to know what you don't want as well as what you do want. You need to know the difference.
Thanks for the advice. I know I want to stay working line. From where doesn't really matter to me. I think that will depend on the pairing and what I'm trying to get out of it. I'm currently very active in IPO, SDA and have recently gotten involved with AKC obedience. I've wondered over to the show ring but to be honest want to stay away from that(other than what I need for an SV rating). From what I have seen in my limited AKC show ring experience was not GSD's. Again I have very limited experience there and I'm sure they are not all like that. At this point I just know I want to breed dogs that can do anything and everything thrown at them.
 

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I would check out all of the different flavors of the GSD because you also need to know what you don't want as well as what you do want. You need to know the difference.
i resent that different forms exist and imo is a major part of the problem, are there different standards that dictate these different "flavours" or is it just like choosing yr favourite ice-cream which would make gsd breeders nothing more than candy vendors, lol the king of breeds has been reduced to a candy dog.

i stopped subscribing to clean run cos they published an article about how to take the herder out of the herding breeds - i really reacted to the concept. to me the two planks in the foundation that define the gsd are herding and and suspicion/aggression.

given that the first plank herding has rotted away in the junk pile to zero, along with all the valuable sub-traits that underlie it, we can at least try and retain some appropriatte suspicion/aggression. health should be assumed for all breeds so doesn't get a special mention.

remove this second plank as so many breeders are so bent on doing in order to have safe easy to handle dogs that suit the bulk puppy buyer profile then we are no longer talking about the gsd.

the claim to longetivity in the game is a false premise designed to mislead and impress the lazy of mind, i work with all kinds of people that have been around longer than me at whatever field - in fact thats all they got, they have been hanging around a long time, never occurs to them that duration does not imply quality it just implies duration.

the newbs did not make the mess so big deal anyone been there longer than me, i can make up my own mind.
 

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I think my hardest thing right now is seeing what is the dog and what is training. I have learned through working some dogs that even a nerve bag can be trained through a lot.
Yes! I have absolutely no interest in breeding, the task seems so daunting and overwhelming. But the quote above is also SO true for buyers as well. I have looked at a lot of breeders, and being able to tell what is genes and what is training is by far the hardest task. It will be a LONG time, if ever, that I trust myself. I will use a mentor to help me for a long time to come.

I commend you greatly for wanting to better the breed and your ability to self evaluate and reflect. You are honestly evaluating your current dogs and want to breed the best of the best. Truly, good luck to you. I hope you don't become discouraged and overwhelmed. :)
 

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mycobraracr, I wish you good luck. I think you will be good at it.
 

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here's the kicker, if he is not good at it in the sense of breeding great working dogs he can still be good at making money at it, so it's win, win.
 

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here's the kicker, if he is not good at it in the sense of breeding great working dogs he can still be good at making money at it, so it's win, win.
Were we talking about money? I thought we were talking about breeding dogs.
 

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here's the kicker, if he is not good at it in the sense of breeding great working dogs he can still be good at making money at it, so it's win, win.
I was thinking he would be good at losing money, if he does this.

Ever check into what it goes into becoming a responsible breeder?
 

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I was thinking he would be good at losing money, if he does this.

Ever check into what it goes into becoming a responsible breeder?
never looked at the details as i have no plans to become one, i would imagine a good breeder has a low profit margin and a lot of intellectual input plus just a lot of work testing, testing, testing, following up on litters, trialling, staying up to date on broader issues etc.

i am more than happy to support such people financially and not try attempt it myself as i know my own limitations.
 
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