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And now a happy-go-lucky labradoodle "learns" how not to jump and... Wilkes is miraculously not getting any "rebound aggression" to quote his own words :LOL: (as we all know, had this Labradoodle been confused he'd have gone straight for the jugular as they usually do)
God... I'm done with this guy, what a joke. And people pay to watch and applaud this, well you'll learn something everyday.
This guys actually angers me now. The problem isn't just some poor trainer dog owners are going to listen to this guy, but this guy actually believes what he's doing has merit. These soft excited dogs are terrified and just because he pulls them in to be pet, he thinks that's evidence of them being OK with it.

Am I wrong here or should a 3rd party not correct the dog in the control of the owner/handler as in him throwing the towel from 6 feet away or the stranger from outside the house door? No he's not hurting the dogs physically, he's damaging them mentally.

I'm not surprised there are "trainers" like this out there, I'm surprised there are people willing to pay for and sit in a hotel, watching this hog wash.
 

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One needs to think about the message that is sent to the dog by bonking. I don't think it is conducive to building a positive relationship. I've also had working line GSDs who would most likely turn around and bite if I did that to them. I'm not opposed to corrections and do use them, as well as an e-collar. But honestly, the most effective training I have done is more in line with Susan Garrett's philosophy of guiding dogs to make the correct choices. I am not patient or persistent enough to do ALL positive training, but I think the true teachable moments in my training have come through this philosophy and not from corrections. Memo, you should Google Susan Garrett and check out her stuff. She has a lot of free stuff online.
 

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This guys actually angers me now. The problem isn't just some poor trainer dog owners are going to listen to this guy, but this guy actually believes what he's doing has merit. These soft excited dogs are terrified and just because he pulls them in to be pet, he thinks that's evidence of them being OK with it.

Am I wrong here or should a 3rd party not correct the dog in the control of the owner/handler as in him throwing the towel from 6 feet away or the stranger from outside the house door? No he's not hurting the dogs physically, he's damaging them mentally.

I'm not surprised there are "trainers" like this out there, I'm surprised there are people willing to pay for and sit in a hotel, watching this hog wash.
I know... So irritating.
 

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Wow, never heard of this bonkers technique, don’t even want to watch the videos, the comments are enough for me...

Re who pays for such advice... A new dog owner has no clue who is a good dog trainer vs who is a fraud. The first advice a new owner hears, even on this board, is “Go get a trainer” so s/he goes and gets one that promises the most amazing results, trains police dogs, specializes in GSDs, competes in SchH etc.

I guarantee that almost every person has at least one experience with a “trainer” that s/he is still ashamed of and feels responsible for subjecting their dog to. I do, and after that experience many years ago no “trainer” is touching my dog, period.

I’m all for and welcome expert help and advice and even hear a not very good advice but it doesn’t mean I am going to follow it blindly. My dog - my responsibility, and I take this very seriously.
 

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It's weird, because I agree with some- even most- of what Gary Wilkes writes about dogs and how to teach them, but the training I actually see him doing- I don't like at all.

I am totally fine with an un-warned (no marker or command) startle response or a correction IF the dog is at that moment doing something that could seriously and immediately harm himself or others. Jumping does not count unless it was a little old lady who cold be knocked over and seriously hurt... . But, I also make sure to train the dog so a correction isn't necessary for response. I've had times when I called the dogs off something, they came, then I looked down only to realize the e-collars were off, not linked up, etc.

Shield K9 has some really great YouTube Videos out there- highly recommend checking them out. He has a much (incomparable really) deeper and appreciative understanding of dogs than someone like Solid K9.
 

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Wow, never heard of this bonkers technique, don’t even want to watch the videos, the comments are enough for me...

Re who pays for such advice... A new dog owner has no clue who is a good dog trainer vs who is a fraud. The first advice a new owner hears, even on this board, is “Go get a trainer” so s/he goes and gets one that promises the most amazing results, trains police dogs, specializes in GSDs, competes in SchH etc.

I guarantee that almost every person has at least one experience with a “trainer” that s/he is still ashamed of and feels responsible for subjecting their dog to. I do, and after that experience many years ago no “trainer” is touching my dog, period.

I’m all for and welcome expert help and advice and even hear a not very good advice but it doesn’t mean I am going to follow it blindly. My dog - my responsibility, and I take this very seriously.
I have never used a trainer so no bad (or good) experiences here, or corresponding bias for/against them. But I also believe the majority of GSD owners are not well equipped to begin with (this site is not a good cross section) so take that with a grain of salt.

When we recommend to get a trainer, it's when people are clearly in over their heads with their dog and/or in a dangerous situation with them. With them, the correct response is often to find a GSD specific/experienced trainer.
 

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I have never used a trainer so no bad (or good) experiences here, or corresponding bias for/against them. But I also believe the majority of GSD owners are not well equipped to begin with (this site is not a good cross section) so take that with a grain of salt.

When we recommend to get a trainer, it's when people are clearly in over their heads with their dog and/or in a dangerous situation with them. With them, the correct response is often to find a GSD specific/experienced trainer.
Or they’ve gone through several crappy trainers and now have more issues then when they started.
 

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It's weird, because I agree with some- even most- of what Gary Wilkes writes about dogs and how to teach them, but the training I actually see him doing- I don't like at all.

I am totally fine with an un-warned (no marker or command) startle response or a correction IF the dog is at that moment doing something that could seriously and immediately harm himself or others. Jumping does not count unless it was a little old lady who cold be knocked over and seriously hurt... . But, I also make sure to train the dog so a correction isn't necessary for response. I've had times when I called the dogs off something, they came, then I looked down only to realize the e-collars were off, not linked up, etc.

Shield K9 has some really great YouTube Videos out there- highly recommend checking them out. He has a much (incomparable really) deeper and appreciative understanding of dogs than someone like Solid K9.
I used to follow his work but I can’t anymore.
 

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I have never used a trainer so no bad (or good) experiences here, or corresponding bias for/against them. But I also believe the majority of GSD owners are not well equipped to begin with (this site is not a good cross section) so take that with a grain of salt.

When we recommend to get a trainer, it's when people are clearly in over their heads with their dog and/or in a dangerous situation with them. With them, the correct response is often to find a GSD specific/experienced trainer.
I always recommend a trainer for a newer owner who is getting themselves into trouble. It’s better to err in that direction than to end up with a teenaged dog they can’t handle that ends up in rescue. It never hurts to consult with a good trainer. A bad trainer is worse than none though.
 

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I have found that going to a trainer can be useful even if you’re not having problems with your dog. I’ve taken my dog to several different trainers (maybe 7?) for different classes or sports or just regular lessons. Admittedly, some of them haven’t been worth the money, but the good ones have been invaluable to me. There has always been area we can improve on and I almost always learn something new.
 

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I've not done individual training just some group classes. I mainly use them to work on 'yes you have to still listen even when there are a ton of things going on' with my puppy since we live a fairly isolated home life (i.e. not a lot of people going in and out, other dogs, etc.).
 

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Sadly, there are very few good dog trainers.
I think there are quite a few good dog trainers (and generally quite a few people good at what they do in the world...), just not all of them have a social media empire.
Filming videos and doing social media takes a huge lot of time and most people who love working with animals don't love technology.
My trainer himself doesn't want anything to do with it, he's just lucky as his partner does social media for him :)

We just need to keep in mind that being good at selling yourself and getting clicks and likes doesn't necessarily mean you're a major dog trainer. Beware of guru-minded people and wannabes. You want to assess if a trainer is good for you? A quick look at what he's been up to should give you an idea of his mentality (what's the motive? Is that person really on a mission to help people and dogs?)
Then just meet that trainer, and you'll see all you need to see.

And never let anyone, no matter what they call themselves and how many followers they have, do something to your dog that gives you a bad feeling. Always listen to your gut.
 

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I've not done individual training just some group classes. I mainly use them to work on 'yes you have to still listen even when there are a ton of things going on' with my puppy since we live a fairly isolated home life (i.e. not a lot of people going in and out, other dogs, etc.).
Group classes are all over the place from excellent to bad. I will always observe one for a few weeks before paying to join now that I’ve had a few extremely bad ones, or else bypass classes and do other training.
 

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Everybody will have their own training methods. Some are great, others are plain awful and damaging. I trust my dogs with my life and I want my dogs to trust me with their lives at all times. I don’t believe in harsh corrections, because I wouldn’t want to damage our trust and I don’t want to punish my dogs out of anger, frustration, and what I would perceive as my personal weakness.

Instead I prefer to find ways to teach my dogs what I want them to do by making them want to exhibit good behaviors because they’re being rewarded. It’s easier to avoid bad behaviors than to correct them.

I strongly believe in positive training, but every dog needs to understand the meaning of “no”, and it’s our job to teach them the meaning, hopefully without the use of force or adverse methods. Yes, I can throw a bonker at my dog today and once that gets old, what do I do or throw next? My older GSD is very sensitive, not fearful, but he would get his feelings hurt if I ever yelled at him, which I haven’t done since I got him 9 years ago. My new puppy is the exact opposite and I have had to find a different training approach to get through to him without the use of force or bonkers. Dog training can be challenging, and if you messed up something in the past, you can start over. We all fail sometimes, but it doesn’t mean we’re failures.

Everybody has heard about GSDs who just “turn” on their owners one day, and from my experience, those owners typically used unnecessary aggressive training methods or they didn’t train at all. I’m very sensitive when it comes to aggressive training methods because I love dogs and don’t find these methods necessary. I grew up around GSD and trainers and I’ve seen different methods and what they do to the dogs. And I’ve seen dogs “turn” on their owners, or abusers in some cases, who were completely surprised that the dog became aggressive, when every normal person could have predicted that things would go south at some point.

You’re already in charge of your dog. You decide when they eat, when they go for a walk, when they play or eliminate, and pretty much every aspect of their lives, which is why I don’t buy into the alpha dog business. You are the alpha as soon as you bring the dog into the house. Everything that happens after that is about finding constructive ways to train your dog and companion.
 

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Everybody will have their own training methods. Some are great, others are plain awful and damaging. I trust my dogs with my life and I want my dogs to trust me with their lives at all times. I don’t believe in harsh corrections, because I wouldn’t want to damage our trust and I don’t want to punish my dogs out of anger, frustration, and what I would perceive as my personal weakness.

Instead I prefer to find ways to teach my dogs what I want them to do by making them want to exhibit good behaviors because they’re being rewarded. It’s easier to avoid bad behaviors than to correct them.

I strongly believe in positive training, but every dog needs to understand the meaning of “no”, and it’s our job to teach them the meaning, hopefully without the use of force or adverse methods. Yes, I can throw a bonker at my dog today and once that gets old, what do I do or throw next? My older GSD is very sensitive, not fearful, but he would get his feelings hurt if I ever yelled at him, which I haven’t done since I got him 9 years ago. My new puppy is the exact opposite and I have had to find a different training approach to get through to him without the use of force or bonkers. Dog training can be challenging, and if you messed up something in the past, you can start over. We all fail sometimes, but it doesn’t mean we’re failures.

Everybody has heard about GSDs who just “turn” on their owners one day, and from my experience, those owners typically used unnecessary aggressive training methods or they didn’t train at all. I’m very sensitive when it comes to aggressive training methods because I love dogs and don’t find these methods necessary. I grew up around GSD and trainers and I’ve seen different methods and what they do to the dogs. And I’ve seen dogs “turn” on their owners, or abusers in some cases, who were completely surprised that the dog became aggressive, when every normal person could have predicted that things would go south at some point.

You’re already in charge of your dog. You decide when they eat, when they go for a walk, when they play or eliminate, and pretty much every aspect of their lives, which is why I don’t buy into the alpha dog business. You are the alpha as soon as you bring the dog into the house. Everything that happens after that is about finding constructive ways to train your dog and companion.
I try to see both sides of the coin (not bonking) but the middle ground and I believe, necessity of both firm fair, age appropriate corrections and positive (not all positive) training.

Saying "my dog would get his feelings hurt" is a bit troubling to hear for me but perhaps I've never had an overly sensitive or soft dog. Lord knows I've been told I must never have had a hard dog ;)

People talk as if correcting their dogs will somehow "damage their relationship" all the time and honestly, it gets more of an eye roll from me. I see these owners often walked all over by their dogs and many of the dogs "turning on their owners" as you put it stems from a lack of leadership and proper training as often as what's more like the abuse you describe.

We see it on this forum all the time, daily, weekly at the most. There's a middle ground that's well worth exploring imo. And I just don't think it's one size fits all.
 
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