German Shepherds Forum banner

1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,389 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
If you are not a prong collar person then please don't comment about prong collars.

This is a 2 <u>prong</u> question. I'm in a dog training class at my dog club. This is my 3rd dog, so the training isn't for me, but to get my pup used to atmosphere and other dogs around. All dogs are great and doing well with the exception of a lady with a LARGE GSD. This dog is a forger, and the lady just hangs on for dear life. She's not small either, but the dog is large, and I believe he is young. She comes to the first class with a flat nylon collar and has to sit on the sidelines and watch. Second class somebody in the club store fits her with a prong, but still needs to learn how to use it. I see her leaving the club with the dog forging and her giving the prong micro-jerks. The good thing is I found out the dog is friendly and just wants to play with all the other dogs. He got excited when we were doing recall exercises and broke loose from the woman and ran towards my dog. I stopped the big guy before he could get too close and the lunk did a happy play bow.

So.....I SO want to help this lady. I'm not inexperienced with prongs, I've used them with great results on all three dogs, so that I don't need them anymore. But I don't want to butt in. She might just think I'm some kind of know-it-all and dismiss me. I also don't think the store fitted the dog correctly, because the collar rides way too low. They also gave her a medium size, but I don't think that's a big deal. I used this size with all my adult dogs (60-80 pound dogs.)

http://www.leerburg.com/Photos/prong.jpg

Would you guys make an attempt? I would do it very nicely and give her the option of hearing me or not. I did talk briefly to her as she was leaving the club last night, but she was in no mood. I sure don't want her to give up on the dog. Also, I want to see if she's made any progress over the week.

Also, does everybody agree with the Leerburg fitting? I use mine just a bit lower than him, maybe an inch.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,389 Posts
Discussion Starter #2
Also, our class instructor has been referring her to other people regarding the prong. I think the instructor is a small dog person and doesn't seem like she knows much about prongs. She told the whole class the first night that the prong should just slip over the dog's head.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,782 Posts
I would "butt in" but in a nice way like you mentioned. More as an offer for some additional help, rather than like she is an idiot.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19,451 Posts
I agree with Tracy, you know, come up with some way to preface it like..."I had trouble fitting my first prong, but I've learned they work a lot better like this, do you want me to show you?".... She can say yes or no, take it or leave it. If you try to help and she doesn't like it, she can pass it up and change her prong back.

Another possibility that the prong is not the right tool for this dog. Some are so willful and strong, you would really have to puncture skin to make a point and you don't want to do that.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,184 Posts
Write down the Leerburg link and give it to her. Then ask if she would like some help fitting and using the prong. I have done this many times, and I explain where it should fit and the difference between live ring (only one clipped to leash) and dead ring (both loops clipped to the leash). She wants to use the dead ring to it's a directional correction for forging.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,371 Posts
I agree, butt in. Maybe compliment her on her dog too and then offer to help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,782 Posts
Originally Posted By: KathyWI agree, butt in. Maybe compliment her on her dog too and then offer to help.
Thats kinda what I was thinking too. Tell her what a wonderfull dog she has, and that you think you may be able to help her with him.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,348 Posts
I say butt in-- with the words "I really think I can HELP you out..." The woman may be scared, and confused-- and really let down, if the instructor cannot support her in using this tool. (I am not even saying the prong is a good idea for her... you SURE the dog just wants to play and is excited? That's BAD-- because if he is happy and excited to see other dogs and wants to play NOW... a prong used incorrectly as she does, or even correctly-- can ramp this dog's frustration level up through the roof until she has a leash-reactive monster on her hands) I say butt in and be sensitive to if the prong helps or hurts in this situation. Again, if the dog gets frustrated easily, is happy-excitable.. this tool MAY make the problems explode. Or, it may do fine in showing the dog borders. It depends even more on the dog that it does on the handling techniques with this tool. What's the dog's tolerance for frustration? Some dogs calm once they feel limits, some get ramped up by the stress of the prong biting their necks... that's nature for many dogs.

I say help her. I say butt in nicely.
I say evaluate this dog and situation carefully.... it is more than her technique, it is wether this tool is right for this dog. A prong either helps or exacerbates in this situation. Good luck!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
67 Posts
I would of been gratefull if someone would of helped me with the prong collar at dog class. They were all so anti prong and pro halti that I felt out of place.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
12,442 Posts
I agree with everyone else - introduce yourself to her if you've not done that already, explain that you have several German Shepherds and ask her if she would like your help in fitting and using the prong correctly.

From your posts, it seems obvious to me that the trainer does not really know how to fit and use a prong collar, especially if the trainer said that it should "slip over the head" which is about the wrongest (is that a word?) place to start.

The Leerburg article on fitting the prong is great - I would give her the link or print it out. If her dog is a really heavy puller, then I would say she should fit it as high up as the Leerburg site shows since that's the most sensitive part of the dog's neck and it would take hardly any force or strength on her end to correct him when the collar is fitted like that. She can always start moving it lower on the neck as she gets further into the training.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,389 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Wow, thanks for all the great information. I even had trouble sleeping thinking about this last night. I won't see her until Wednesday, but I'll be ready to talk to her then.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,767 Posts
Since the instructor is not qualified to answer questions and has referred her to other people, talk to the instructor.

Perhaps if the instructor refers her to you that will a good starting point.

I would not want to do anything that could adversely effect my dog. Having someone jump in who is knowledgeable and has expereince is totally different than have Joe Cool on the street tell you how to do it because he watches Cesar.

Those of us in classes, whether instructors or students, all have first hand experiences that can help others. Give the lady a chance to either use what you have to say, or nod politely and go her own way.

(I didn't look at the leerburg site, but I can tell you the prong should fit so it stays high up on the neck.)

Go for it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
15,138 Posts
Raya and I were in a class with a very large under trained overly friendly and happy Goldendoodle. They tried the harness, they tried the Martingale to no avail, this happy pup was happy doing what he wanted to do. I asked the trainer if she thought the owner and dog would benefit from the use of a prong collar for a while. The trainer said yes, but that isn't a peice of equipment she is use to or really knows how to use. So I asked if it would be ok if I helped the handler and dog. I got a yes, at least she will learn the proper way to use the prong. I said, I think once the pup understands what is expected that they could go with a different collar.

Val
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
27,244 Posts
We were in class and a few of us during break were discussing how well the prong worked in certain situations. A guy with a big lab pup(choker collar) was sitting nearby and was listening in, decided that his dog would do better on a prong instead of huffing and puffing on a choke.
Next class, he was so proud of his pup and how much more under control and comfortable he was during the class! I would not want to see a dog go thru a class with ill-fitting collar, or the wrong training on the handlers part on using any type of collar. Too bad the instructor couldn't have helped better, so you could get a good nights sleep!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,389 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
Well, I got a chance to talk to her a little yesterday. Her dog is a big sweetie and about a year and a half. I gave her the leerburg web site for the prong collar fitting, she has it low on the dog's shoulders, so I hope she goes and reads it thoroughly. I showed her where it should be on her dog's neck.

She and her dog are doing much better, but she still doesn't have good control at all. And we all know how well those prongs work when they are fitted properly.

She says she comes here to read, so I hope she gets the help she needs.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
218 Posts
I agree with the others- butt in- but in a nice way =D I like the idea of complimenting her or the dog. I would also make sure your timing is right in the situation- maybe catch her before your next class, or afterwards but definitely make it a one on one thing. good luck!
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
15,195 Posts
we can comment on any collar we choose. i don't think you should ask some one not to comment on a collar because they're not an advocate of that collar.
Originally Posted By: BlackPuppyIf you are not a prong collar person then please don't comment about prong collars.

This is a 2 <u>prong</u> question. I'm in a dog training class at my dog club. This is my 3rd dog, so the training isn't for me, but to get my pup used to atmosphere and other dogs around. All dogs are great and doing well with the exception of a lady with a LARGE GSD. This dog is a forger, and the lady just hangs on for dear life. She's not small either, but the dog is large, and I believe he is young. She comes to the first class with a flat nylon collar and has to sit on the sidelines and watch. Second class somebody in the club store fits her with a prong, but still needs to learn how to use it. I see her leaving the club with the dog forging and her giving the prong micro-jerks. The good thing is I found out the dog is friendly and just wants to play with all the other dogs. He got excited when we were doing recall exercises and broke loose from the woman and ran towards my dog. I stopped the big guy before he could get too close and the lunk did a happy play bow.

So.....I SO want to help this lady. I'm not inexperienced with prongs, I've used them with great results on all three dogs, so that I don't need them anymore. But I don't want to butt in. She might just think I'm some kind of know-it-all and dismiss me. I also don't think the store fitted the dog correctly, because the collar rides way too low. They also gave her a medium size, but I don't think that's a big deal. I used this size with all my adult dogs (60-80 pound dogs.)

http://www.leerburg.com/Photos/prong.jpg

Would you guys make an attempt? I would do it very nicely and give her the option of hearing me or not. I did talk briefly to her as she was leaving the club last night, but she was in no mood. I sure don't want her to give up on the dog. Also, I want to see if she's made any progress over the week.

Also, does everybody agree with the Leerburg fitting? I use mine just a bit lower than him, maybe an inch.
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top