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Good thing I don't remember the last time I bought anything there. Flash and I were there working on obedience with distraction. He **** well knows what sit and platz means, no excuse for him to not do them. He was a little too into another dog when I told him platz so he ignored me. I corrected him with the fursaver and told him platz again. He ignored again, I corrected him harder. The whole time I'm very calm and matter of fact, I'm not losing my temper at all. About that time the manager comes running up with a very disturbed look on his face, "Ma'am, ma'am! You can't be choking your dog in this store, we are positive training only and I don't know what technique you are using but that just won't work here." I was floored. I pulled out the hot dog I was using as a reward, he had gotten way more hot dog than corrections up to that point, but apparently I was choking the life out of him and I'm an evil wench. I said wow and just walked off towards the door. I couldn't hold myself as I walked out and said a four letter word. Oh well. I wanted to tear into the guy. Petsmart workers are the last people I'd take dog advice from.

My DH got a kick out of the story, though. I think anyone who has seen me with Flash will get a kick out of this story.
Now I'm just mad that we have to find somewhere else to do obedience around dogs.
 

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That's horrible. I'd like to see what methods PetSmart uses, and if they ACTUALLY work?

OT, but is platz pronounced like "plotz"? Pronouncing the "ot" as you would in "hot"?
 

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oh... lovely ol petsmart. the place where i was "under investigation for cruelty to animals" because surely allowing a half gone baby hamster to be eaten alive by the mother was better than me...

a) removing a hampster from its mother to starve
b) placing a live animal in my pocket to suffocate
c) feeding the baby hamster to my dog (this one still has me confused
)

perhaps i should have put it in the freezer alive like the other employees did


needless to say i quite before they could fire me. what a thing for a teenage girl to have to deal with.

ah well.
 

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I am sorry, but I am glad they are on the lookylooky for someone that maybe mistreating their pooch...Not to say that you did whatsoever. I would have maybe been tee'd like you at the employee, but at least they didn't ignore the situation. And maybe your level of frustration was elevated as Flash didn't Platz when asked more than once, so your voice maybe sounded harsher than normal?
Think of the volume of dogs that go thru the place with ignorant owners, the employees have to be on guard, IMO, and then they are de-sensitized because of this. Not that they need to voice their opinions every time, should just observe and then see what action to take if necessary.
 

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I find it's always hard to have someone come down on you when you didn't realize what you were doing was against their policy. AKC shows also frown on compulsion training on the show grounds. Or at least it is against the rules - or was against the rules - (we haven't been out for a long time.)

You can still train at PetsMart - you just have to use their methods. Just remember compulsion training isn't positive training whether you are angry or calm when you apply it. If they want only positive methods used in their store, that is their choice.

GSD4ever - take a peak at Pat Miller's books and Sheila Booth's book. These are two positive trainers with pretty good track records.


Jesusica - if you want to take a look at other ways to work your dog, I've been finding Susan Clothier (sp) "Bones would rain from the sky" a pretty interesting read.
 

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Originally Posted By: GSDLover_ForeverThat's horrible. I'd like to see what methods PetSmart uses, and if they ACTUALLY work?

We went through obedience training in Petsmart, it was a success with Jesse and yes it is positive training there, due to training there with all the distractions Jesse is great out in public. Jesse learned very fast that if he did what I wanted he got rewarded by praise, toy or treat if he did wrong he got "ah ah" and put back in position he was to be in and praised once in it. He is now able to at 7 months to sit, down or stand in a spot, we can walk away down one isle out of site wait a minute and come back up another isle while trainer was waiting out of site keeping eye on Jesse and he was in the high traffic area outside groomer shop in main isle.

I personally have no complaints about their training, but in reality I could train Jesse myself I just wanted to use them for distraction and socialization reasons.
 

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Originally Posted By: Sherush
... if he did wrong he got "ah ah" and put back in position he was to be in and praised once in it.
That is a correction. Different dogs need different levels of correction. You and I were doing the exact same thing except my dog needs more than an "ah ah". Cheyenne, just tell her "no". That's all the correction she needs.
 

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Originally Posted By: jesusicaDifferent dogs need different levels of correction.
Yup you are right, if Jesse wasn't as good and easy to train and obedient I would have taken him to a more serious obedient school and worked even harder on him. Not every dog is the same, not every dog responds the same way to methods. Jesse temperament works very well with the Petsmart way of things ie no choke, halties or any kind of correction collars, just flat collar or normal harness.
 

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We do trainng at Petsmart....... only because our trainer works there. I have always never liked Petsmarts training methods with the "one training method fits all dogs" mentallity they tend to have. Then I had a bad experience at a Petsmart and I had "blacklisted" Petsmart from my places to go till I met out current trainer. We had both attended a dog function and I was badmouthing Petsmart, then she pipes up that she was a trainer for them! We butted heads for a few minutes, then I started asking her training questions to see what she would do, and found out she was not one of those "mindless" trainers, but modifies her training method to fit the dog. I do not use a clicker with my GSD, and the trainer has never trid to make me use one on her either. But with one of my other dogs, I have to and we just started class with that one. The only collars our trainer does not accept in her class is a pinch collar and rarely ever a choke chain (but we are allowed to use a martingale).
 

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Quote:"Ma'am, ma'am! You can't be choking your dog in this store, we are positive training only and I don't know what technique you are using but that just won't work here."
Alrighty, since nobody else has asked this, I will ask:

Were you inside Petsmart as a customer, shopping with your dog and fitting in some training and socialization at the same time; or were you inside Petsmart as part of their training classes?

I think the two are two very, very different situations.

If you are taking classes at Petsmart and they specific what equipment and what type of corrections (if any) you can use, then not following the class instructions would be a violation and a problem.

If, however, you are inside the store as a customer, someone who has no contract with them regarding training, then they need to mind their own business. Petsmart has a great big sign at the front that says "Leashed and vaccinated Pets welcome". It says nothing about what kind of collar you may have on your dog, or whether you can or cannot correct your dog for bad behavior inside the store.

For the manager or an employee to come up to you and tell you you cannot correct your dog, that's like them coming up to a customer walking in with their dog and saying, "Ma'am, you can't bring your dog into the store on a prong collar because we do positive training only, and dogs must be on a flat collar, Martingale, or head halter."

I have no problems if a store employee goes up to someone who is hitting or kicking their dog, or in another way obviously abusing them, and saying, "You can't do that here - either stop or leave." However, this wasn't a question of abuse. This was someone correcting the behavior. I highly doubt the OP was "choking" the dog - she was probably popping the collar and then releasing it.

Quite frankly, this was none of their business and I'm surprise the OP didn't tell the manager to get stuffed before she walked out of the store. I very likely would have, right after pointing out that if they did not want people to use training tools such as chokes and prong collars in the store, then they probably should not be selling them.
 

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Selzer, How people behave on your property IS your business whether you are a corporation or an individual. PetsMart manager was very much OK in requesting that the OP stop using compulsion methods on her dog on PetsMart property. Whether she is shopping or participating in class or simply using the property for training around other dogs, her behavior is the store's business. So they were "minding their own business."
 

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where has Selzer even posted on this thread?

I have always taken my fosters to petsmart for meet and greets when I was with Brightstar and they all wore prong collars. They were all learning their manners (with people/other dogs) and I never hesitated to give them the proper correction if needed. No one has ever said a word to me and I can tell you if they did, I would kindly say oh so I should just let my dog eat that little ankle biter who is allowed to roam at the end of the flexi leash while the owners pay no attention to them or think it is funny cause they are so little? I guarentee it would be the Shepherd I was holding and myself at fault if the little dog were injured. JMHO.

Same with my own dogs, they aren't aggressive, but all dogs can act out if put in the wrong situation and I think it's the responsible owners job to be on top of that over the idiotic ones that can be in those stores... A bit off topic but what if Flash was really acting out and maybe thinking about doing something he should't? So Jessica should just let him? I do understand petsmart's side of things being their property but they should have at least asked why she felt the need to have to correct him in such way and saw the whole picture?

Just food for thought.
 

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Sorry, that should have read Historian not Selzer. I must have been crosseyed...
If Flash were really acting out, PetsMart would be in the right to step in more forcefully and see that he and his handler left.

If you have a dog that is in any way inclined to "eat" ankle biters, you should not be around ankle biters in a situation like PetsMart if the only correction you can use is a compulsion technique and that facility does not allow compulsion.

Are you not concerned about possibly getting banned from a facility?
 

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A fur-saver has those huge links, right. It is harder to hurt a dog or control a dog with large links as opposed to small links. I am not saying you should get a chain with smaller links, just that a correction may need to appear worse than it actually is.

PetsMart sells prong collars. A slight jerk with a prong collar may have provided the same level of correction without the choking-your-dog scene.

I think the manager over-reacted, but I wasn't there.

The managers need to be taught that different dogs need different levels of management, different dogs respond to different controls. And there is a big difference between a correction and abuse.

If someone was pounding on their dog, there in the store you would want the manager to step in. And we would all agree to that. Another person may look at one of us that uses a prong collar, see us administer a correction, and want the manager to step in. At some point you have to define what is reasonable force.

Oh, I like positive training methods too, and love to employ them in puppies. However, once a dog is trained, on occasion a correction or attention giver is required and to NOT adminster this at the proper time, THAT is abuse. I think that short of starving your dog to death, the absolute worse thing you can do to your dog is to be so permissive that your dog feels it has no boundaries at all. That dog's behavior problems will probably net him a death sentence down the road.

I think PetsMarts shake the can in the dogs face method of correction, holding treats in one hand and a naughty can in the other is worse than using a choke chain or prong collar properly. But, "when in Rome, do as the Romans do. " I agree that you do not have to give up your location for training, (unless they asked you not to return), just improvise a bit.

Instead of asking your dog to sit when he seems a bit too interested in another dog, give him an unannounced jerk and move away with him. The jerk will most likely not be noticed because you are not accompanying it with a displeased statement. It will not be repeated because you will then be out of range. The dog is smart, he will get the message.
 

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keep training your dog at PetSmart. it's a good place for training. there's so many dogs in and out of there. the manager just thought you were being heavy handed with your dog. he probably doesn't know anything about training. you should still train there and if you feel that strongly about it don't buy anything there. this way you have the convenience of training there but you're not supporting PetSmart.
Originally Posted By: jesusicaGood thing I don't remember the last time I bought anything there. Flash and I were there working on obedience with distraction. He **** well knows what sit and platz means, no excuse for him to not do them. He was a little too into another dog when I told him platz so he ignored me. I corrected him with the fursaver and told him platz again. He ignored again, I corrected him harder. The whole time I'm very calm and matter of fact, I'm not losing my temper at all. About that time the manager comes running up with a very disturbed look on his face, "Ma'am, ma'am! You can't be choking your dog in this store, we are positive training only and I don't know what technique you are using but that just won't work here." I was floored. I pulled out the hot dog I was using as a reward, he had gotten way more hot dog than corrections up to that point, but apparently I was choking the life out of him and I'm an evil wench. I said wow and just walked off towards the door. I couldn't hold myself as I walked out and said a four letter word. Oh well. I wanted to tear into the guy. Petsmart workers are the last people I'd take dog advice from.

My DH got a kick out of the story, though. I think anyone who has seen me with Flash will get a kick out of this story.
Now I'm just mad that we have to find somewhere else to do obedience around dogs.
 

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I would not take my dogs to PetSmart for training, and can buy most dog stuff cheaper at my Feed & Grain store.

However, as a rescue PetSmart has been helpful in helping us place dogs.

So as almost always, so negatives and some positives.

PS Someone asked where Selzer has been; that person has been around forever.
 

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"Quite frankly, this was none of their business and I'm surprise the OP didn't tell the manager to get stuffed before she walked out of the store. I very likely would have, right after pointing out that if they did not want people to use training tools such as chokes and prong collars in the store, then they probably should not be selling them. "


Word. My sweetie would have told the manager where to go and how to get there.

When we take our GSDs to the local Petsmart to visit, they always wear their prong collars. We also use an e-collar with Kenya sometimes. They've been corrected while in the store. We've never had an incident. Perhaps the manager didn't know other training methods??

If I were you, I'd keep going there and working my dog.
 
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