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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
i was very excited when i got a GSD because every lab i have ever owned barks but they dont have the same drive GSD's have, so im not sure if i should go forward with schutzhund? im very interested in the tracking portion of it all and the protection too. but i dont want my baby to be a robot i want him to be my giant love bug still.. he starts petsmart trainging in a week, (whitch i know the course by heart and have already started him on almost everything,) but i like him to be scocialized. what is everyones thoughts on shutzhund? I have friends that do it and love it. so Im confused.
 

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What is there about SchH training that makes you think it will turn your dog into a robot? The training you will get there is by far superior to the training you would get at PetSmart.

Go and get your dog evaluated and see if you would actually like it. That's the only way to decide if it's for you or not.
 

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Raising a pup for SchH requires a different approach, and PetsMart obedience would be a less than ideal way to start.

If you're serious about SchH, find a local club now and start investigating the training. Folks at a local club should be able to evaluate the pup, and offer guidance on raising a dog for SchH. Until then, I would hold-off on any obedience, and focus simply on socialization, exploring new places, and building the puppy's confidence under your immediate supervision...ensuring only good/positive experiences.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
yeah im going to take him and have them look at him. Im not sure whu i think he would be a robot.. I just dont want him to be serious all the time. my neighbors had a rottie that did it and he went from fun dog to all buissness. and i e-mailed a group not far from me and they recomend i do not do the petsmart training and schutzhund at the same time that theyare different methods. and ive already started him on a clicker. i think i might just try to teach him tracking on my own. i just would like to have him know the protection part but they said its a sport and he would have to participate in all three parts of the program.
 

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I would suggest to you that SchH isn't as much a type of training as it is a lifestyle. The level of commitment required is significant in time and money. I also think there are no finer GSDs than those accomplished as working dogs regardless if that is herding, schutzhund, agility or whatever. A GSD with a job never becomes a robot if well trained.
 

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Initially I was concerned about Schutzhund training also (years back) because I thought it was a little too hard core for my taste and especially on a dog. The key in my case was lack of knowledge about the training. I was always open to learning more and went to my local club and watched for several weeks. I was totally impressed. It's not about making the dog a robot at all like you can see some trainers turn their dog into. There's obedience and then stupid trainers who want to impress people and go overboard. Schutzhund training is nothing like that.
It takes the strengths of the breed of the dog and fine tunes them so the dog harnesses what the breed was historically used for. The dogs are completely themselves, they just follow directions.... AWESOMELY and they absolutely LOVE performing. The dogs that I've seen, perform on the field or where they are required to, but off-field they are still the big furry love bugs you're looking for. It doesn't change who they are, their personality, just their skills. :)

I would recommend finding a trainer or a club where you live and contact them and see if you can go watch some of their training and ask questions. People are always very willing to share their knowledge, just be open to listen. I plan on beginning this type of training very soon also. I hope this helps
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
thanks guys that helped a lot! I do want to get him evaluated, the only problem is distance, the closest clubs my e that i found are about an hour away :/ i will continue my search!
 

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I would suggest to you that SchH isn't as much a type of training as it is a lifestyle. The level of commitment required is significant in time and money. I also think there are no finer GSDs than those accomplished as working dogs regardless if that is herding, schutzhund, agility or whatever. A GSD with a job never becomes a robot if well trained.
I agree with Wayne. If you are serious about doing Schutzhund with your dog, it influences everything about how your dog is trained and raised. I still do "pet" dog training and puppy classes with my dogs, but I understand my dogs and have my own Schutzhund "program" for each one, so I know when to bow out of a certain exercise at puppy class. Plus I have a great all-breed pet type trainer that understands and respects my commitment to Schutzhund. She doesn't mind if I do things a little differently than the rest of the puppy class or sit out an exercise because it conflicts with what I'm trying to teach my dog. The "pet" thing and Schutzhund thing aren't necessarily mutually exclusive, but you have to understand your dog and your Schutzhund program otherwise there will probably be conflicts.
 

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. i think i might just try to teach him tracking on my own. i just would like to have him know the protection part but they said its a sport and he would have to participate in all three parts of the program.
SchH tracking is a very precise type of tracking and unless you know what you are doing, I wouldn't recommend trying it on your own. The reason you can't just do tracking and protection is that the obedience is what holds it all together. Protection is basically just obedience with a bite for a reward. So you can't do SchH without the control that obedience gives you.

I'm not sure if you are worried about being able to continue clicker training or not, but there's no reason you can't.
 

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Just curious - what are the differences in how one should try to raise a puppy destined for sch compared to one who will not be in sch?
A few examples I can think of from my last puppy class:

Standing in a circle and then rotating who handles which puppy - Sorry, no one handles or trains my dog but me.

Teaching the puppy to give/out/drop toys and things right away, usually with food or "trading" - I don't really do any outing until the dog is older, if we are tugging or playing games with toys I'm focused more on encouraging drive than doing obedience. I teach obedience with food with a little puppy, toys come in later but early on toys are for playing and drive building.

Open puppy playtime/socialization before and after class - When I'm there we are there to work and not socialize, I socialize my dogs with a few friends who have dogs I know well and will be safe with my dogs.
 

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I took Karlo to a beginning obedience class when he was about 4 months.
Part of the training was teaching them not to jump up. I didn't participate in that. And like Lies said, the out was out! The pup should only focus on the handler, no one else, so interaction with other people is not happening during training.
When young pups come to the club, if it runs up to people the pup gets ignored so it will see that his handler is where he needs to go for his fun and praise.

I did take Karlo to a couple of puppy playgroups early on as he was acting like a bully to an elderly dog(he chomped her in the back), so I wanted him to not be reactive or a "bully" to other dogs.
Even though I had two adult female GSD's I wanted him to see other dogs as no big deal.
He is mostly aloof to other dogs now, I'd much rather have him be this way than reacting to every dog he sees.

If you put too much obedience on a young pup then go on and try to do SchH they may not be as eager to engage, or will act reserved.

I think building confidence, letting them bark and not correcting(though having house manners) is a good start for a SchH pup.
 

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.....Standing in a circle and then rotating who handles which puppy - Sorry, no one handles or trains my dog but me.

Teaching the puppy to give/out/drop toys and things right away, usually with food or "trading" - I don't really do any outing until the dog is older, if we are tugging or playing games with toys I'm focused more on encouraging drive than doing obedience. I teach obedience with food with a little puppy, toys come in later but early on toys are for playing and drive building.

Open puppy playtime/socialization before and after class - When I'm there we are there to work and not socialize, I socialize my dogs with a few friends who have dogs I know well and will be safe with my dogs.
Why wouldn't you want a puppy to get used to being handled on leash by someone else? I must be a little slow but I don't see what potentially bad impact of this. Do you usually teach this capability later when the dog is older?

The reason I ask is that we once met a famous German judge (we were looking for an imprted GSD puppy) at a dog show and my wife took his personal dog for a walk around the show by herself. When she got back we found out that the dog was hi scoring protection dog at the Sieger show and he was absolutely perfect walking off with my wife.

Regards not teaching the "out" command - is it that if you teach this command to a young dog that it will have a bad impact later? What impact would it have on I assume the bite work in Sch?

Thanks!
 

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Why wouldn't you want a puppy to get used to being handled on leash by someone else?
"Schutz" Protection "Hund" Dog
Your Protection Dog. Your bond with that dog, the dog's focus on you is what it is all about. There is nobody/nothing else when you're working.
 

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Just curious - what are the differences in how one should try to raise a puppy destined for sch compared to one who will not be in sch?
If I were to ever get a working line puppy that I was going to train for SchH, God forbid.......

Maybe more specific to SchH;
I would praise the dog for barking
I would not allow it to be handled/trained by anyone but me
I would not scold it for jumping
I would not scold it for biting
I would not scold it for anything
There is time for work and time for socialization...don't mix the two. I want my SchH puppy to be a bold, confident, land shark....manners and obedience come later.
 

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"Schutz" Protection "Hund" Dog
Your Protection Dog. Your bond with that dog, the dog's focus on you is what it is all about. There is nobody/nothing else when you're working.
What about your wife/husband/kids? Are you saying that all Sch dogs are one person dogs?

If that is the case, then no thank you for me.

i had never heard that before about Sch - I had heard that one does all they can to build the dogs confidence but not the one person only handling.

BTW, I have heard of the English translation of Sch.

Thanks.
 

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If I were to ever get a working line puppy that I was going to train for SchH, God forbid.......

Maybe more specific to SchH;
I would praise the dog for barking
I would not allow it to be handled/trained by anyone but me
I would not scold it for jumping
I would not scold it for biting
I would not scold it for anything
There is time for work and time for socialization...don't mix the two. I want my SchH puppy to be a bold, confident, land shark....manners and obedience come later.
When would you start manners for a potential Sch dog? I thought that obedience was a big part of Sch?

Would you teach a dog that it is ok to bite people without teaching the obedience to help control the dog first (or at the same time)?
 
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