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Discussion Starter #1
Well, I guess they are bites, I am not sure what else to call them.

It happened at training Thursday night. In retrospect, I think there were just too many dogs (3 Great Danes, a smaller dog and Rocky) which led to several scuffles. Three of the dogs belonged to the trainer and one was boarding. The trainer broke up the scuffles very quickly and none of us were aware of any injuries. It wasn't till I got home and saw Rocky licking his leg several times that I saw what had happened. I cleaned the area as well as I could and put some antibiotic cream on it, but on Friday morning, Rocky was obviously favoring his leg and the area was very red. He cried every time I tried to look at it. My vet could not see him so I took him to one of the animal hospitals where they sedated him and cleaned up the bites. He came home Friday evening and was put on antibiotics and an anti inflammatory. He is eating good, going to the bathroom and the bites look much better this morning, thank goodness! He is to be on restricted activity for a week to ten days.

You live and learn...
 

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Discussion Starter #5
I blame myself. I should have said something, but in my defense, it has always been difficult for me to tell when big dogs are playing or fighting since they always sound like they are trying to kill each other. Also, the first scuffle was followed by a long period when the dogs seemed to be each doing their own thing. I think we all got a little complacent that things were going to be OK. And finally, I don't want to paint Rocky as just being an innocent victim, he started some of the trouble. He seemed to take issue with the female Great Dane. No, I footed the bill, I think it's as much my fault as anyone else. I am just glad my little buddy is OK.
 

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Well I hope he feels better soon <3

It's not your fault at all. And it doesn't matter who started it. You were paying a trainer to assess and teach control over these things, not to have his own dogs involved and inflict injury as well. I can see it happening once and surprising everyone once. But that would have been it.

What trainer allows this to happen more than once? And 3 of the other 4 dogs were his?? Honestly I'd be pretty P.O'd if I was paying good money to experience the type of stuff that causes me to avoid free dog parks. Just my .02c. When we were dealing with lunging at other dogs when Valor was about 8 to 9 months old, my trainer "used" his two dogs to help train him out of that. His dogs were 100% under his control and helped enormously just by being well trained stable good influences. I can't image a trainer bringing any other type of personal dog to one of their training sessions, group private or whatever. Has he offered to pay vet bills?
 

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In your defense, you are paying the trainer to know what is and isn't a fight. If you were at a playgroup with a friend, I'd say just foot the bill and live and learn. But it is the trainer's job to prevent fights, and to know more than you do about what is and isn't a fight. It doesn't really matter if Rocky was involved in starting it or not because he is just a dog, and it's the trainer's job to manage the dogs in his care, and that means preventing fights before they start.

I'm also a bit concerned about the location in the back of the leg? Odd spot to target in just as scuffle (Usually the ruff on the neck and front legs are involved). At a minimum, I'd recommend you avoid contact with those dogs in future.

I'm sorry he was hurt. Glad he is on the mend.
 

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I blame myself...... No, I footed the bill, I think it's as much my fault as anyone else. I am just glad my little buddy is OK.
This is not your fault. Your trainer allowed 3 of HER dogs and a boarding dog to have several scuffles at the expense of her CLIENT and another client's dog. This is not your fault. She should be footing the bill on this. 100% what Muskeg posted above.
 

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Yes, what they all said, not your fault, she should pay the bill. I do understand why you may be reluctant to ask her to - if it were Beau I’d have similar mixed feelings. At minimum, though, find another trainer.
 

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Training is NOT supposed to be a play date. I've never been to a training session where dogs were allowed to play together. The closest dogs normally get is about 6 feet, and that's if you are teaching dog-reactive dogs to ignore each other!

Playdates should be between dogs that are known to be stable, and are already familiar with each other.
 

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I'm glad that Rocky wasn't hurt worse, and that he's healing! I totally agree with everyone that it's not at all your fault, this is exactly why you're paying a trainer. And for your trainer there is no excuse for letting this happen!

I also think the location of the bite indicates that the altercation was way beyond a scuffle! When a dog targets the other dog's hind quarters like that, the intent is to do serious harm to their opponent! A scuffle can turn into an all out fight quickly, but your trainer really should have seen the signs and separated the dogs long before that happened!

Another thing to think about is the psychological impact. You've mentioned before that Rocky is on the softer side of the temperament spectrum, so chances are you'll be dealing with some changes in his demeanor regarding other dogs from here on out...the Vet bill could very well be the least expensive part of his treatment for this incident!

Given that you left your trainer's place without realizing Rocky was injured, have you mentioned the situation to your trainer since? I'd be very surprised and disappointed if once they knew about it they wouldn't absolutely insist on paying!
 

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Discussion Starter #13
I'm glad that Rocky wasn't hurt worse, and that he's healing! I totally agree with everyone that it's not at all your fault, this is exactly why you're paying a trainer. And for your trainer there is no excuse for letting this happen!

I also think the location of the bite indicates that the altercation was way beyond a scuffle! When a dog targets the other dog's hind quarters like that, the intent is to do serious harm to their opponent! A scuffle can turn into an all out fight quickly, but your trainer really should have seen the signs and separated the dogs long before that happened!

Another thing to think about is the psychological impact. You've mentioned before that Rocky is on the softer side of the temperament spectrum, so chances are you'll be dealing with some changes in his demeanor regarding other dogs from here on out...the Vet bill could very well be the least expensive part of his treatment for this incident!

Given that you left your trainer's place without realizing Rocky was injured, have you mentioned the situation to your trainer since? I'd be very surprised and disappointed if once they knew about it they wouldn't absolutely insist on paying!

Yes, he is aware. I started texting him Friday morning when I first saw the bite.
 

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I blame myself. I should have said something, but in my defense, it has always been difficult for me to tell when big dogs are playing or fighting since they always sound like they are trying to kill each other. Also, the first scuffle was followed by a long period when the dogs seemed to be each doing their own thing. I think we all got a little complacent that things were going to be OK. And finally, I don't want to paint Rocky as just being an innocent victim, he started some of the trouble. He seemed to take issue with the female Great Dane. No, I footed the bill, I think it's as much my fault as anyone else. I am just glad my little buddy is OK.
Definitely not your fault. As to should the trainer pay ? Yes, but that also depends on your relationship with the trainer. Is the trainer a also a friend or is this strictly business?.just my 2 cents.
 

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I am so sorry that this happened to him and you. How is Rocky doing now? What kind of training class was this? Puncture wounds are serious bites and the culprit should have never been close to dogs as his intentions were clearly meant to injure.
Shows how important it is to use our own judgement in classes to protect our dogs. Newlie, did you have a gut feeling that this might cause problems before it happened?
Your trainer definitely should foot the bill IMO. Did you have to sign a waiver for this class that you were responsible for any injuries etc? That may make it difficult to retrieve costs.
 

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I'm glad that you noticed the wounds relatively quickly and got him in to see a vet. The wound looks painful. My thoughts are that the trainer should be responsible for the vet bill but not just because she/he is the trainer but also because her dogs were students of the class making her both trainer and client of that class, unless she was using her dogs as models to work Rocky and the boarded dog around. Especially if there was a waiver that each client was required to sign.

Whether you choose stick with paying the bill yourself or perusing reimbursement, this is just something to consider for next time. Maybe ask the trainer if they are bringing in their dog(s) if they are under that same "responsability" waiver, if there is one.

As you said, you live and learn but don't be so quick to take blame. This wasn't your fault.

I hope Rocky recovers quickly with no ill effects.
 
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