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I think you were surprised by the fact that the dogs seemed okay to you, despite the conditions that were obviously not optimal. And that you might have considered actually getting a dog from there.

The problem with this is that it perpetuates the scenario and this type of thing will never stop if people don't boycott places such as this one.

There is more to good breeding than just producing friendly dogs. And being a member of the forum, it is easy to educate yourself and learn about everything that goes into intelligent breeding with the scope of bettering the breed, no matter the breed.
 
I know many people like this, their animals are their pets, they do show, but they also health check. There are also plenty out there that don't health check and just breed their perfectly friendly pets.

I think the big difference/shock that you get is that on the forum and when it comes to GSD, many people expect Schutzhund titles...but most American bred shepherds don't do any performance type events or trialing. The majority of American dogs are bred for the AKC conformation ring, with an aim for stable/pet type temperaments. I've spoken to many breeders who don't want to breed "German temperaments" because they have too much drive for their customers.

I wouldn't support one of those breeders with my money, but plenty of people do. They sound a lot like the people you're talking about...just cleaner and possibly a bit more responsible when it comes to their animals. The fact of the matter is that BYB doesn't mean that you're necessarily bad, it just means you don't have the knowledge to do things the way the standard would like.
 
As these aren't GSD's none of the working temperament comes into play...so clearly these dogs are being bred $oley for the pet market?
 
Yeah...when it comes to other breeds, especially those companion breeds, its not a necessity to be temperament tested so IMO the breeders have a little more freedom. A lot of breeders focus solely on AKC conformation, which isn't the worst thing, and at least they are comparing their dogs to others of the same breed.

I guess to me their living conditions aren't the most important things to look at when judging the actual dogs. As long as the dogs aren't kept in cages all day long, get some attention, who am I to judge the way they wish to live?
 
We don't know the breed, so it could be hunting dogs, or herding dogs, or a guardian-type dogs, etc.

Not all breeders think that schutzhund is the the only way to test a dog. I know people with American bred dogs that are herding champions. I think it isn't necessarily accurate to put blanket statements on lines of dogs.
 
I would probably be rather surprised at this scenerio myself..and honestly, I probably wouldn't buy a dog from them unless it was one I 'had' to have.

I realize some people with multiple dogs may not have pristine living conditions, heck I have only 3 dogs and I'm cleaning alot, BUT, for me, it wouldn't matter if they had excellent temperaments, champions running around, if I walked into that scenerio, I probably would pass .

If one is willing to have that many dogs running around inside, then one should be willing to keep the living conditions atleast somewhat clean, especially if people are coming to visit !
 
Who the heck is going to put it together who you are talking about, just by naming the breed? I don't care who the breeder is, it could be one of millions that do things the same way.

I'm curious simply because some breeds are "easier" than others, in terms of maintaining good health and temperament. With the "easy" ones, you can be a less-than-stellar breeder and still produce dogs of reasonably good health and temperament if you have a good gene pool to start with. With some other breeds, you really have to be careful, and anything less than a deeply knowledgable and diligent breeding program will result in a hot mess.
 
Where I vacation every summer there is a family that used to have a female GSD (she is long passed due to age). This is THE dog that drew me to this breed. She was intact and they bred her a few times. They would give the puppies away but kept one for themselves so the last I saw they were on their third or fourth generation. I'm sure they have no health clearances or titles but just based on my experience with these dogs I would have taken one for free at any time.
 
With toy breeds they are most often companions (except maybe the terriers) so there is no historical "job" for them to be titled or worked in.
I've looked into a few and have found with some breeds the vast majority of breeders do not do any titling other than conformation. So in some breeds it can be very difficult to find a breeder who titles their dogs in sports or obedience for example.
One toy breed I was interested in I found very few breeders who do any titles with their dogs other than conformation. I was hoping to find some with agility or other titles but IIRC I only found one breeder who did agility titling. A lot of breeders mentioned on their site that the breed does great in agility/obedience-- but they themselves don't title their dogs in those things.
 
Toy breeds are EXTREMELY prone to diseases that often times don't show clinical signs until geriatric years. Many have heart disease. Best example, MVD that affects half of all Cavalier King Charles Spaniels. Or Syringomyelia (brain too large for skull, basically), where in it's mildest forms shows no clinical signs but in it's moderate to severe forms causes excruciating pain and paralysis. Can easily be diagnosed with an MRI, as ALL breeders of these dogs should do. The big scandal in the UK where it was reported that one of the top conformation studs had a mild case of this GENETIC disease, but wasn't clinical and was being bred left and right. Oh but he looked so good in the ring :headbang:

Strong smell in the house means dirty living conditions. UNHEALTHY for animals and humans alike, especially newborn pups.

I don't care how happy or friendly or "pretty" these dogs are, I don't care what breed they are. If they're being kept in dirty living conditions it's irresponsible. You can wash a dog in a good quality oatmeal shampoo on show day and hide a lot of neglect. If they aren't being tested for common genetic diseases in their breed it is IRRESPONSIBLE. And they should NOT be bred. You could produce hundreds of puppies out of a stud dog before you realize he has severe heart disease at 6-7 years of age. Difference between this and a shelter dog, you aren't supporting bad practices with shelter dogs.
 
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