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Discussion Starter #1
And of course there are days well "all good intentions of a schedule are blown out the window" ..but for the most part here is our day...30

7am -- get up, morning stretches, kisses, out to do "business" ...slow stroll around the yard.

7:15am -- breakfast ( 1 cup of earthborn primitive natural)


7:30 am 10:30am -- quiet chew toy time, lazing around time in the blocked off kitchen ( my coffee time, computer time and general pick the house up and get the day started time)

10:30am -11:30 ( I run to the store and do my errands ...crate time

when I get home it's lunch time -- Roxy shares slices of apples and a slice of cheese and 1/2 tblsp of peanut butter ( natural) with me. Sometimes we have a few baby carrots


noon -1:30 quiet time again in the kitchen

around 2pm we go out for a "run" ...we fenced in a part of our yard that we can go out and chase balls and frisbees. This will go for maybe 10 - 15 minutes and then we stroll the yard ..and come back in.

more toy time in the kitchen...I usually start supper and if it's something I can manage with Roxy in there I will leave her in there..if there is any danger while I am cooking I will put her in her crate.

4pm Roxy has her (1 cup of earthborn primitive natural) ...humans eat ...and then at 5 pm she gets 1/4 cup of earthborn wet mix. 5:15 - 6:15 quiet play

then outside again for a run/play time. usually about 15 minutes and she's ready to come back in.

we usually watch a movie or something in the evening so she stays in the front room with us. I sometimes will put her in the crate next to me because about the only issue I have with her right now is she's a howler when I do run to the store...so with a suggestion of having her in the crate near me during different times of the day so she knows it doesn't always mean sleep or leaving....it's starting to help..the howling is slowing down.

9 pm --we quiet down and get ready to go to sleep. ..10pm lights out and at 11:30 I wake her up to go outside for the last "potty" break and then she sleeps until about 7am. ( on some mornings she wants to go out for a 4:30 or 5am pee ..but then she's content to lay back down until 7am.


now of course during the day there are all kinds of "pee" breaks..and she's starting to bring me her leash when she wants to go out. Which is way cool for a 15 week old puppy)..or at least I think :cool:



so...any suggestions? how does this look? She gets her final set of shots next Wednesday so hopefully we will get the all clear to go on other walks. And that is the same night our classes start ...so socialization will begin with other dogs that night. I have been introducing her to new people of all different shapes and sizes and ages...but other dogs ..no.

thank you :)
 

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Discussion Starter #2
LOL -- like today. Roxy informed me that because it's supposed to be 90 here today that we better get a morning run/play time in before it gets really hot. So we did that..and now she's crashed at my feet. I am thinking it's time to get a kiddie pool...it might actually be going to warm up FINALLY
 

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Earthborn is an excellent food - I feed it to some of my dogs. However, the Earthborn Primitive Natural formula has way too high of a calcium/phosphorus percentage for puppies. Large breed pups need slow and sustained growth for optimal health - too much calcium at this age can contribute to joint issues. I would take your puppy off Primitive Natural and switch to an Earthborn puppy formula or to another food with lower calcium/phosphorus percentages.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Earthborn is an excellent food - I feed it to some of my dogs. However, the Earthborn Primitive Natural formula has way too high of a calcium/phosphorus percentage for puppies. Large breed pups need slow and sustained growth for optimal health - too much calcium at this age can contribute to joint issues. I would take your puppy off Primitive Natural and switch to an Earthborn puppy formula or to another food with lower calcium/phosphorus percentages.
I had started her on the puppy version of the Earthborn ..but she had nothing but loose watery stools. :eek: Her poop has been GREAT since I switched her to this. I will have the vet look at the packaging from this bag when we go up next week.
 

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I am sure your vet is a fine resource, but I have my doubts on your vet's insight into large breed nutrition as many vets have a surprising lack of knowledge about breed specific nutrition.

Large breed pups should maintain a certain calcium/phosphorus ratio - all of the recommended percentages are much lower than Primitive Natural's Ca/P ratio.
Good articles:
Phosphorus and Calcuim in Your Dog’s Diet |
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC1680828/pdf/canvetj00574-0077.pdf
Calcium & Phosphorous in Dogs* - Chinaroad Lowchens of Australia -

Earthborn ratios are: Calcium, not less than 2.45%, Phosphorus, not less than 1.50%. Way too high for a puppy imo.

Here is a past discussion on Earthborn Primitive Natural for puppies:
http://www.germanshepherds.com/forum/diet-nutrition/197085-earthborn-holistic-ok-5-month.html

Stools, good coat, etc are not the only measures of how good a food is for a dog - take into account the dog's age and development requirements. EB Primitive Natural is not a food I would ever feed to a large breed puppy.

From the articles above:
"
Feeding high calcium diets with excess calcium is often blamed for contributing to bone problems in young, rapidly growing dogs. There does appear to be a link between the incidence of hypertrophic osteodystrophy (HOD), osteochondritis dissecans (OCD) and hip dysplasia, and the overfeeding of calcium. In recent studies, researchers fed dogs calcium at a much higher than recommended amount, and compared the incidence of disease in dogs that were fed normal or less than normal calcium levels. As would be expected, the animals that were overfed calcium showed increased incidence of skeletal problems including hip dysplasia."

With a breed that is ripe with bone and joint disorder issues, I would exercise caution when it comes to feeding puppies...
 

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Discussion Starter #7
..

so if not wanting to go back to the puppyvantage because of the loose stool problem..what would you recommend as another 4 - 5 star food that might work for Roxy?
I really like the "potty" solution with the primitive natural but if it's going to hurt her bones in the long run of course I would want to switch. I have spent most of the afternoon reading posts and searching foods and now I have a headache. I can go back and forth on almost every food with one person saying "yeah use this" and somebody else saying "no , that's bad". :help:
 

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Can anyone elaborate more on the calcium/phosphorous ratio for shepherds specifically?

Also, isn't dysplasia something a dog is born with and can be determined via X-rays from a young age? I was told by a vet in the past that if the hips are cleared, then we essentially really only need to worry about arthritis down the road.

Sorry to jack the thread :(


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Discussion Starter #11
Can anyone elaborate more on the calcium/phosphorous ratio for shepherds specifically?

Also, isn't dysplasia something a dog is born with and can be determined via X-rays from a young age? I was told by a vet in the past that if the hips are cleared, then we essentially really only need to worry about arthritis down the road.

Sorry to jack the thread :(


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I am curious too. I am trying to study up on it ..but seems to me it typically is something either your GSD gets or it doesn't and it really doesn't seem to be affected by much other than good or bad luck ...that's what I've read so far...I'm still reading.
 

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I feed Acana kibble supplemented with Primal freeze dried nuggets, fish oil, and borage oil.


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She gets up at 7, but no play/exercise until 2? and if I am reading this correctly, she gets 25-30 minutes of activity a day?

That does not seem like much. Of course it depends on the dog, but my experience has been that a good long play session in the morning would be beneficial.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
She gets up at 7, but no play/exercise until 2? and if I am reading this correctly, she gets 25-30 minutes of activity a day?

That does not seem like much. Of course it depends on the dog, but my experience has been that a good long play session in the morning would be beneficial.
I guess the play time/ quiet chew...that most of the time isn't so quiet. I am trying to keep the running to a minimum until 1 hour after eating. Some mornings she does sleep after she eats ...yesterday and today ...not so much. She's just now laying down for a nap.
I am guessing a lot of this sleepy time comes from a growth spurt we might be in the middle of?

yesterday I put her kiddie pool up and there were 2 extra play times in the pool. I wish I could have gotten that on video..there was no even thinking about it. She saw the pool in her run and made a run for it and was IN. It was so funny. Then she commenced to trying to push all the water out of it.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
lots of exercise and pool time today ...and first meeting with a 5 year old...she did so good. Didn't even attempt to nip ...just a lot of licking and running with the little girl. I was so happy. The only age group we have yet to introduce her to is a baby...I am looking for a friend here in town with a baby.
 

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Discussion Starter #18
We are in the process of switching our dog over to this...

Blue Buffalo Wilderness Dry Dog Food | Review and Rating

Its about $56 from petsmart for the biggest bag of large breed puppy food.

that may be what I go for too...but I am going to talk to the vet first..just to see what he says. I talked to another large breed dog person who said no food is going to be right or wrong for every dog and that I could switch her off the food she's doing good on to prevent something that may or may not happen only to go to a food that may or may not cause another issue.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
ok got the blue buffalo large breed puppy -- will be giving her some of that with her other food to see if we can switch over. Hoping for good poops.
 

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Good luck! So far we are on day 2 of a full switch and his poops are great - very solid and not runny at all like I expected with a food switch. He seems to love it too
 
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