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Discussion Starter #1
I took some videos of Stark and I doing some VERY INFORMAL training/playing around in the house, he wasn't really in the mood or cooperating, but I would like opinions as to what I could be doing better to get the results we would need for trailing. Any tips, comments, etc.. would be helpful. He is the first dog I have trained and would really like some feedback.

Thanks guys!

Heeling
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dUZMOH0P0ZI

Perch work and basic obedience
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOuj4mPog2g
 

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Still watching the perch work video, but a few things since you asked


In such a small area to work for heeling, I would suggest doing doodles and working on heads-up starts or focus on about turns. You both look great
Those would be my only suggestions on the heeling vid.

As I said, still watching the perch, but I don't get what I am seeing... I hear a lot of clicking but I am not seeing on video what you are clicking for.. (mostly he looks like he isn't moving). I hear multiple clicks and even a "yes" in just the first minute of the 8 min video but haven't really seen what it is you are marking for? Sure his feet are up, but I think the multiple clicks and "yes"s defeat the purpose. I'll go back and finish watching though before saying anything else


I think you are doing great! And Kudos to you for working with him... I have slacked off so bad because of winter and making excuses that I don't have enough room and the kids are in the way... You have far less room so I make no more excuses! I WILL train tomorrow lol

Keep up the great work
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I think the sound is off.. It is doing a weird thing on youtube, it's different on my computer. Not sure?
 

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I think you're right. I keep watching and i hear sit and click when he is still on his perch lol I see him in a platz, you rewarding, but saying sit. ... maybe it's me lol maybe it's youtube... but at anyrate, I think you're doing great working him


Try working position and doodles and such as you have limited space
Perch work is great too for getting him to understand he has a rear.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
By doodles do you mean, step with focus then click and treat. Redo, instead of a full out walk? Work on focus more? I know that's where I struggle; getting his attention.
 

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really small place to do heals but hey we work with what we have.
maybe a slow pace,
click and reward while all 4 feet are on the ground.
mix it up. some sit and wait. stays and recalls. sit for longer periods.
looks like your on the right track
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Yes, we usually train outdoors or during class (once per week) but tonight we were bored and it was already dark outside.. lol.
 

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some doodling...this one I hear Michael Ellis instructing in the background...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LOpl1xJTOf4

doodling to me is doing small steps, working on fronts up close, working on pivots and small movements. I teach focus heads up and then one step with focus....build from there.

You could work on some stationary attention as a beginning.

I begin teaching more formal heeling by showing the dog first how to give to leash pressure. I will then use the leash to assist the dog in finding position and navigating the intricacies of moving heeling. Once giving to leash pressure is mastered, I can gently move the dog up into heel position, back into heel position, off of my leg or closer to me. When dog is correct, I mark and reward.

Here is a short leash pressure vid. Use a pinch for this. It is not so much a corrective device here as a steering device.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HFEl4MEJ6RY
 

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Yes. Doodling is small steps, close fronts, turns, pivots etc.

Great doodling done here Doodling and Tricks - Border Collie 8 months in between all the tricks


Oh and if you find Stark is bored/not focused, try doing more playful tricks instead of formal "obedience". If you toss lots of stuff out like the dog in the video, he'll most liekly be more apt to focus more on you because he'll wonder what The Nut (you!)
is going to do next! lol
 

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Oh, that is better doodling example with the BC. Keeping the treats coming is important in building sustained attention and focus in your work. I used to try to see how many clicks and treats I could get in in a minutes time. It needs to be pretty rapid. Also, sometimes jackpot with several treats as that keeps interest high also.

Hurray, keep going Stark...aka Hogan's lost twin brother!
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I find I loose focus because he is not super interested in the treats (not food motivated), if I have a tug in my hands.. watch out.. crazy puppers.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
HOLY CRAP!

I just watched the BC...... We have a lot of work to do......... WOAH!
 

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What are you using for treats?
remember it needs to be better than his food (Stark just eats toooo good compared to all those kibble hounds) so you might try skimping on his meals a bit so he's hungry (include the treats in his meal calculation) or try a reward that isn't food based (treats are just so darn quick & convenient).

This is definitely something to discuss with your trainer before/after class because "booorrrrring" is exactly the feeling I get from Stark's body language in the videos (don't expect him to be a sharp as the BC in the video but he should be a little more enthusiastic
)

It may just be the sound on the video but try for a faster, sharper more sibilant "Yes", clicker also sounds a little slow so it may be the video or you need to get your thumb off for a faster,sharper sound - not meaning louder - but, again this may be the type of clicker


Kudos to you for doing this & being brave enough to post the video & actually <gasp> ask for critical commentary


btw, what camera are you using for the video?
 

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Discussion Starter #14
I have tried everything as far as treats go:

Cooked chicken
Hot dogs (both raw and microwaved)
Meatballs
Treats from the store (all natural of course)
Cheese (different types)
Steak pieces
Liver cake (homemade)
Peanut butter treats (homemade)
And a variety of other things, you think it - I've tried it.. lol.

As far as being bored, it's not usually this bad.. lol. My sisters were sitting on the couch talking and being goofy, the cat was there, he just wasn't in the mood, but I wanted to try and get a critique so I can do better.

But he does seem to get bored very easily, I try to stay animated but he gets distracted so easily, gotta work on focus more that's for sure.

The sound is off on the video making it seem like I am not clicking or saying my cue word "YES" on time, but I am.. this I am sure... lol. I worked on this over and over and am pretty good at 'getting the click' when I need too.. lol. DARN CAMERA!

Like I mentioned, this is all new to me and I want to do the best I can. I would love to enter into a trial this year at some point when we are ready. I am always looking to learn. I have been working with an instructor but we are on hiadis until this week, so hopefully things will start to be on track again.

The camera.. ugh.. the vain of my exsistence.. it's a POC Camera (Piece of Crap). I am in the market for a new one.. lol..
 

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Yeah the timing is pretty messed up on the video so I was assuming that wasn't you


Have you tried
Wild Bites
(also thinking about some dried buffalo (lung maybe
) & some yucky stinky dried,smoked salmon skin; then there are the treats that you never expect will work & some dogs go nuts over them ...

I also think that if you have a dog that's not particularly food motivated, variety is important so he never knows what the next treat will be ...

It's hard to say if Stark needs more stimulation (mix it up with way more 'tricks' & different rewards) or less ie just work on building a truly fantastic focus & put everything else on much lower priority - this is definitely a question your trainer can help you with.
Also "borrow" one of those cameras from Costco etc & get a friend/sister to shoot you & Stark at class & outside so you can see what you're doing vs what Stark is doing etc
 

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I love perch work... what I would suggest first however, is to get him to move his rear while you are in front of him, luring him with treats, and not worrying so much about being in basic position yet. It's a lot of fun! Laos sees the perch in the middle of the floor before we start and he runs to it. This is Laos' first perch session. I throw food back and forth to get him moving then ask him to "place".

Laos' 1st Perch Work Session
 

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This is the result of about six weeks of stationary perch work. Just starting to put it in Laos' formal heel work. Don't rush it, and keep perch work and heel work separate for quite a while. I also would work on stationary attention before asking for any moving heel work.

 

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Originally Posted By: elisabeth_00117I find I loose focus because he is not super interested in the treats (not food motivated), if I have a tug in my hands.. watch out.. crazy puppers.
This is why it's really important to work on stationary attention first...and don't rush it. Stark should be able to maintain focus on you, in basic position while there are distractions before even considering him keeping focus while heeling.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Thanks so much Lynn!

I guess I am kinda jumping ahead of myself as far as this goes.

I will definitely take your advice and keep working on focus first then move on to the movement.

Thanks again!
 
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