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Discussion Starter #1
Just wondered if anyone else has heard this?

The woman I buy my Canidae from said that the distributor told her that Canidae is comming out with new flavors. I can't remember what all she said but I do remember she said a "Beef" formula and a Salmon and potato or sweet potato. At any rate a "grain free". Will be interesting to see if this is true.
 

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Sorry, I don't mean to hijack your post, but I have another canidae question...Does anyone know if the canned food will be changed?
 

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ok, everyone. i just got this mailing from canidae regarding their upcoming grain free formulas plus a new food w/ grain. unlike some, my girl has been doing fine on the canidae changes. im looking forward to a new grainfree choice and am hoping the prices wont be to the level of wellness core and orijen ($2+/pound), which i really like.

here is the grain free All Life Stages: this looks like the only other grainfree, other than orijen puppy large, that one could feed to a growing pup.

http://www.canidae.com/dogs/grain-free-als/dry.html

the grain free salmon:

http://www.canidae.com/dogs/grain-free-salmon/dry.html

the Beef and Ocean Fish:

http://www.canidae.com/dogs/beef-and-fish/dry.html

i like that they are keeping chicken completely out of the salmon formula and beef/ocean fish formula, unlike some others (who shall remain "before grain" nameless)...oops, did i say that?
 

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The protein/fat levels are very interesting. In the beef and fish (a weird formulation if you ask me) it's 24% protein and 12% fat...very low on both ends. And in the grain free salmon it's 40% protein and 20% fat. So your dog had better have a very demanding physical job to eat that food!
 

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The protein/fat levels in the ALS and Salmon grain free are pretty much in line with those found in other grain free foods (Orijen, Core, EVO, TOTW). A bit higher than found in some, lower than others. And in the new beef formula (which isn't grain free) they're pretty much in line with what is found in Canidae's other non-grain free formulas.

Will be interested in seeing what the price tag is on this when it hits the shelves. Will have to talk to our distributor to find out more. We've not been happy with the new formula change to the old Canidae ALS and for now have switched to TOTW. But would definitely be interested in giving the new Canidae grain free formulas a try.
 

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Originally Posted By: Chris Wild
Will be interested in seeing what the price tag is on this when it hits the shelves.
yes, that is going to be key for me. if its priced w/ orijen or core, then id rather just use those. however, i very much doubt if it will be priced as low as TOTW, since ive seen that priced even cheaper than the current canidae formulas.
 

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I only know the higher end foods these days and that is comparable to the protein levels. But most of the grain free foods are at 18% for fat. The reduced fat (Wellness) are at 9% and Orijen's senior is at 14%.

20% is a high, I think and people may see some weight gain and possible digestive issues with that. And 12% is very low fat so I'm surprised at that. I think 16-18% is optimal for a young, healthy dog.
 

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It looks interesting. I don't see were I could feed either one to puppies, as I can TOTW pacific stream. But might take a look at it, but again, I'm afraid of them doing the typical formula changes and either denying or stating after the fact (once there are complaints). I don't like surprises on my dogs.
 

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With regard to the formula changes, I think (hope!) they've learned from all the complaints about the change several years ago and have mended their ways. This newest formula chage was widely publicized in pamphlets and on their website before it happened. Of course, they're trying to spin the change into a good thing and IMO it's not, but at least they didn't keep quiet about it and let people know well ahead of time it would be happening.
 

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Originally Posted By: Angela_W I don't see were I could feed either one to puppies, as I can TOTW pacific stream.
i meant in regard to the calcium/phosphorous levels in the grain free all life stages being at/below 1.5%. unless a puppy had problems with the protein sources, then it seems a grainfree that a large breed puppy could use.

regarding TOTW: ive had many people who know much more about dog nutrition than me warn me against any foods with more than 1.5% calcium for a large breed puppy. the calcium level in TOTW Pacific Stream is almost 2%. i subsequently found a fair amount of research backing this up. IMO, is irresponsible of TOTW to call their food all life stages.

Taste of the wild /calcium 2.1 ph 1.4

Pacific stream/ calcium 1.9 ph 1.1

wetlands/ calcium 2.1 ph 1.4
 

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odd, i've had one pup whose hips looked excellent at 10 months old. I'll know on Grace soon when I do her OFA next Feb. She's been on Pacific Stream since it came out last year. Before that she was raw. Her brother's xrays looked awesome.


To each their own and what works for them.
 

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Angela To each their own and what works for them. [/quote said:
its about more than just HD. higher calcium amounts fed to large breed pups are linked to a range of bone abnormalities including hypertrophic osteodystrophy (HOD), osteochondritis dissecans (OCD) and hip dysplasia.

avoiding a higher calcium diet is just one of several precautions against these problems that many of us prefer to take. im glad your dog didnt have problems with this diet.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
But if you look at the detailed nutrient analysis, the calcium on an "as fed" basis is 2% on the new ALS grain free.

Of course the calicium on the "regular" ALS is 1.8% "as fed".

So which one do you go by? The "minimum", or the "as fed"?
 

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I did not know about the change in the food until I had an opened bag of it at home.

I am pretty nutty about everything dog, but I do not hang out on the Canidae website looking for possible changes in my dog food.

I am a member of their breeder program. It would have been nice if they would have sent me a pamphlet marking the possible change so I could have stored up some food in case of a pregnant bitch, or a bitch with pups that I did not want to switch suddenly.

Oh well.

This new formula looks like what I need for Dubya and Cujo/Pip. If it is not an arm and a leg, I will try it.
 

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Originally Posted By: BlackGSDBut if you look at the detailed nutrient analysis, the calcium on an "as fed" basis is 2% on the new ALS grain free.

Of course the calicium on the "regular" ALS is 1.8% "as fed".

So which one do you go by? The "minimum", or the "as fed"?
hmm? good question. i wonder if the old als was as high "as fed" as the new als. if the "as fed" calcium levels are the truer number, then i woul not want to feed any of their formulas to a large breed pup, grain or not.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Yes, BOTH ALS formulas were/are the same as far as Cal/phos, calories, fat, and I imagine a lot of others.
 

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I know people who swear by giving their dogs a tums each day for calcium. Some people I know also supplement extra Vit C for skeletal issues.

There are so many theories out there regarding HD that all one can do is their own research and make their own decision. Will everyone agree? No. And that was my point earlier.
 

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Originally Posted By: BlackGSDYes, BOTH ALS formulas were/are the same as far as Cal/phos, calories, fat, and I imagine a lot of others.
i know the GA was the same, but i dont recall the NA of the old als formula.
 

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a little off the topic, but i must rant. look at this page from the Taste of The Wild website:

http://www.tasteofthewildpetfood.com/pet_care/puppies/medical/17/

" Another key factor is the calcium level in the food. Calcium in large breed puppy diets should be between 0.7% and 1.5% on an as fed basis. (Small Animal Clinical Nutrition, 4th Edition) More calcium than this is too much for a large breed puppy."

here is an exerpt from the faq section of the same website:(keeping in mind that their email to me clearly indicates their formulas right at about 2% calcium)

Can I feed this food to my large breed puppy?

Yes. All of the Taste of the Wild formulas meet the nutritional needs for growing puppies. Large breed puppies should be fed a little differently than small or medium breed puppies in order to control their growth rate. Overfeeding calories can lead to rapid growth, which puts stress on the developing bones and joints. It is important to keep your large breed puppy in lean body condition.


huh!? maybe they figure know one will notice what the actual levels are since they are not displayed anywhere on the website or (if i recall) the bags. im not singling them out. many of the companies only display the GA showing the min levels of calcium. it would be nice if they had to display the min and max levels of certain things. rant over.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Originally Posted By: roxy84
Originally Posted By: BlackGSDYes, BOTH ALS formulas were/are the same as far as Cal/phos, calories, fat, and I imagine a lot of others.
i know the GA was the same, but i dont recall the NA of the old als formula.
Since I feed it I looked at it (the NA) way before it was removed. I also compared it to the new formula when they were BOTH still listed ont the website.

At least they HAVE the info on their site. Some (like Merrick) don't list the cal/phos on their site at all. You have to call them. But they have the info redily available because when I called and asked, she had the info right there. I don't know why they just don't list it on the site in the first pace
 
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