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Discussion Starter · #22 ·
Again, the point here is, if you're paying money to add another layer of protection the companies should at least advise you that they have built in limitations!

tattoos -- well, there is no centralization for tatoos either, and they sometimes wear, not everyone looks for them. Sometimes in the ear, sometimes on the thigh. At best, not a sure thing.

Tattoos are good if you have several dogs and need a way to identify them to an AKC inspector. They are good if you want to identify your own dog. I certainly would not trust a shelter to do anything with a tattoo.

Collars are ok if your dog wears them 24/7 and they do not break away. Of course, they can kill the dog too. Not a sure thing either.

Chips are only as good as the ability of the scanners and the willingness of the people to scan them. Certainly not a sure thing either.

Of course ANY time your dog is loose and not under control, they may be run over or shot or taken or attacked. So the best thing to do is to protect your dog by keeping them safe.
 

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So the next problem, some of the chip manufacturers in the U.S. also have proprietary databases, so if your dog's chip is scanned (which is not a guarantee) you still may not be able to find the company with which the chip is registered.

In my research I found that dogs which had been micro chipped had been euthanized at shelters because of this.

I gather that there are some efforts to centralize all of this, but some manufacturers are really dragging their feet (don't want to loose their market share, it's o.k. if a few dogs die....I guess...:crazy: )
Bandit has 24 hour pet watch for a chip. They register any brand of micro chip. The problem lie with this though which I found out from the company is..... exactly what is state above! If they are micro chipped with lets say for example a home again chip and you register it with 24 hour pet watch unless your pet is wearing a tag that says his chip is registered with 24 hour pet watch who ever found your pet will not be able to reach you through your dogs micro chip. I was very upset to find this out!! Because I almost registered Morgen like this. I got Bandits chip at a animal society event, however there are none going on at this time in my area or surrounding areas so I called the animal clinic to ask if they had 24 hour pet watch micro chips because I like there profile they give you for your pet and the free registry. But they didn't have their chips they had a different brand. I called 24 hour pet watch and got more information on registering a micro chip through them that wasn't there and they told me what was stated above!!:mad: What is really upsetting is one of there advertising benefits is you can register any microchip for free through them! Yet if you didn't know any better and your pet wasn't wearing one of their tags their your dogs micro chip is no good. Not to mention if a scanner doesn't pick it up! We get these chips to bring our pets home safely... An they are expensive you think they would set up a better system. :mad:
 

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I have 2 dogs from Europe with the European ISO chips. My vet has a homeagain reader and it registers that the dogs have a microchip, just that it's from another company. Someplace I read that all new scanners are supposed to at least have this ability,but I can't recall where I read that.

There isn't a central database, but the scanner will identify the database and you contact the appropriate company. I also have my microchip numbers registered with the AKC pet retrieval database.

I just found this online, but I never heard of it before.

"As of September 2009, there are two Internet-based search engines that allow users to enter a microchip code. The American Animal Hospital Association's Universal Pet Microchip Lookup Tool (www.petmicrochiplookup.org) provides a listing of the manufacturer with which the microchip's code is associated as well as if the chip information is found in participating registries. Chloe Standard's database (www.checkthechip.com) displays the manufacturer of that microchip. Neither database provides owner information for the microchip – the user must then contact the manufacturer/database associated with that microchip."
 

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I see it a bit differently. I believe that it is my job, as the consumer, to research the limitations of safety equipment. When I got Rayden chipped, I checked with my vet as to which chip they recommended as well as with the local AC/Humane Societies to see which scanners they had.
The chip manufacturers exist to sell their product.
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
Maybe I missed something but what dogs got put down b/c of their chips?

WebCite query result

Of course it would be impossible to quantify exactly how many dogs have been needlessly euthanised, the animals owners couldn't be found, the dog was a stray....and that's the end of it.

Yet deductively I think we can all agree that A) it has happened, b)the lack of standardization will allow it to continue to happen and C)that the number of pets euthanised specifically because of a chip/scanner incompatibility doesn't have to be very high to be unacceptable.
 

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Discussion Starter · #27 ·
The chip manufacterers exist to save pets or make money? It so happens that two can be and have been mutually exclusive.


I see it a bit differently. I believe that it is my job, as the consumer, to research the limitations of safety equipment. When I got Rayden chipped, I checked with my vet as to which chip they recommended as well as with the local AC/Humane Societies to see which scanners they had.
The chip manufacturers exist to sell their product.
 

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I'm with Dainerra. I have chipped 8 pets in the past 8 years and have never felt the chip company would be legally responsible for me losing my pet and it being euthanized. I looked into the chip options and went with the one that all our area shelters use and all the shelters and vets can scan for. Our shelters are required to hold stray/lost animals for 10 days. The one time I had a pet lost we were calling and visiting all area shelters daily. There's no way my animal would be euthanized even without a microchip. In the end the tag on her collar got her back to me safe and sound.
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
I have 2 dogs from Europe with the European ISO chips. My vet has a homeagain reader and it registers that the dogs have a microchip, just that it's from another company. Someplace I read that all new scanners are supposed to at least have this ability,but I can't recall where I read that.

There isn't a central database, but the scanner will identify the database and you contact the appropriate company. I also have my microchip numbers registered with the AKC pet retrieval database.

I just found this online, but I never heard of it before.

"As of September 2009, there are two Internet-based search engines that allow users to enter a microchip code. The American Animal Hospital Association's Universal Pet Microchip Lookup Tool (www.petmicrochiplookup.org) provides a listing of the manufacturer with which the microchip's code is associated as well as if the chip information is found in participating registries. Chloe Standard's database (www.checkthechip.com) displays the manufacturer of that microchip. Neither database provides owner information for the microchip – the user must then contact the manufacturer/database associated with that microchip."
That's another thing, you buy a dog from Europe and there is no verifed way of transferring owner of record on the chip from the breeder/owner in Europe to the customer in the states.

New scanners are getting better but there are still some proprietary baloney going on.

My vet had AVID and it didn't read the chip, we tried several times, banfield confirmed the chip worked and was accurate. The chip came up with the phone number of the company which made the scanner, petlink. Petlink seems to have a more open format and cross referencing.

Chloes did not find my dogs registered chip tho...

Also, check out petmaxx.com for online look ups...
 

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I think that with a chip, if you find your stolen dog yourself -- don't expect the police to be too fussed about your missing dog -- and you claim that the dog is yours, a microchip might be a good way to prove that the dog is yours.

Other than that, it qualifies as permanent identification for OFA ratings. That is why they are in my dogs. To protect them in the event that they are lost and then found, well, that would be a bonus if it happened and worked.
 

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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
I'm not into law suits, but if it could be verified my dog was euthanised due to a scanner/chip proprietary issue I'd go to town.

It's like buying extra insurance only to not have the insurance be there when you need it.

The story I posted, the dog slipped it's collar. We try to be careful but things happens, that's what microchips are there for, the 'what if' moment that can happen to any of us.


I'm with Dainerra. I have chipped 8 pets in the past 8 years and have never felt the chip company would be legally responsible for me losing my pet and it being euthanized. I looked into the chip options and went with the one that all our area shelters use and all the shelters and vets can scan for. Our shelters are required to hold stray/lost animals for 10 days. The one time I had a pet lost we were calling and visiting all area shelters daily. There's no way my animal would be euthanized even without a microchip. In the end the tag on her collar got her back to me safe and sound.
 

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there are a million different ways that the chip might not be picked up by the scanner. It could be as simple as the chip had migrated or that the person who was supposed to scan the dog when it came in didn't do their job. Or maybe did it half-heartedly. The majority of readers will at least tell you that a chip is there, even if propitiatory rights mean that it can't read the info
 

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Discussion Starter · #33 ·
In red, below, here's the irony, that bonus is less expensive in EU countries with far higher chances of actually working!


I think that with a chip, if you find your stolen dog yourself -- don't expect the police to be too fussed about your missing dog -- and you claim that the dog is yours, a microchip might be a good way to prove that the dog is yours.

Other than that, it qualifies as permanent identification for OFA ratings. That is why they are in my dogs. To protect them in the event that they are lost and then found, well, that would be a bonus if it happened and worked.
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
That's why I use the words proprietary and scanner/chip compatibility.

Understand here that some companies have even intentionally ENCRYPTED their chips.

there are a million different ways that the chip might not be picked up by the scanner. It could be as simple as the chip had migrated or that the person who was supposed to scan the dog when it came in didn't do their job. Or maybe did it half-heartedly. The majority of readers will at least tell you that a chip is there, even if propitiatory rights mean that it can't read the info
 

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The one time I had a pet lost we were calling and visiting all area shelters daily. There's no way my animal would be euthanized even without a microchip.
Unfortunately, that's not always enough. Sorry, this is a convoluted story, I know someone (a member of this board in fact) who had a family member lose a dog recently. The dog was found by someone else and brought to a local shelter. There was a microchip but the dog was adopted from a shelter out of the area with the microchip already in place, and there was a mixup in transferring the microchip to the new owner. Instead, they were listed as secondary contacts, and the prior owner as primary. When the shelter contacted the prior owner she said she hadn't had the dog for 9 years, which was true, and that was as far as it went.

When the owner went by the shelter he was told that his dog was not there, and he was allowed to look in the public areas to confirm this, but was not allowed access to the areas that were not open to the public. He had pictures, they looked at the pictures and claimed that she was not there. They originally said that the person who had found her and brought her in had left with her, but they either didn't have a record of that person or would not give it to him to followup on.

When his wife went by the shelter a few days later to check again she was told that the dog had been there when her husband went by :angryfire: but had been since euthanized. They were devastated.
 

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Why don't we sue vets, rescues, and shelters because they don't have the right scanners? Actually, many of them do. Our shelter has multiple scanners so they can read any chip. A friend of mine has a dog with the European ISO chip and when we enter dog shows and Schutzhund trials since her dog is not tattoo'd it has to be checked for the chip and the owner must provide the scanner. Our shelter lets her borrow one of their European frequency scanners for these events (she writes them a check and then they void it when she returns the scanner).
 

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Discussion Starter · #40 ·
No don't sue the shelters, that would be silly. They did not create the problem and those law suits would probably kicked out of the court.

The problem lies with the design and manufacture of the chips, therefore the logical parties to sue would be said manufacturers.





Why don't we sue vets, rescues, and shelters because they don't have the right scanners? Actually, many of them do. Our shelter has multiple scanners so they can read any chip. A friend of mine has a dog with the European ISO chip and when we enter dog shows and Schutzhund trials since her dog is not tattoo'd it has to be checked for the chip and the owner must provide the scanner. Our shelter lets her borrow one of their European frequency scanners for these events (she writes them a check and then they void it when she returns the scanner).
 
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