German Shepherds Forum banner

1 - 20 of 53 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,675 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
People are lucky that I'm so nice and polite while handling stressful and pressure situations. If I told them what I was really thinking/feeling, I'd get into fistfights weekly. Haha. I'm always trying to "do it right" and follow the rules and obey the laws, and I know I'm not perfect either.

So I took Paw Paw on a bike ride last night, and he has to remain on lead 100% of the time due to zero recall. I took him to the cemetery that we always utilize for runs and bike rides. He got all ALERT and when I looked to my left, here comes a yellow lab off lead running up on us. I had to hop off my bike to ensure Paw Paw didn't drag me off. We use this cemetery a lot and rarely ever see someone else with a dog. Usually we're the only ones in there. Maybe once every 4 months do we see another dog, and it's normally on lead.

So I'm looking around for this dog's owner and I see a guy on a cell phone far away. He isn't even aware that his dog ran off. The dog slowly walks closer and closer. I get a good grip on Paw Paw and wait for this owner to come get his dog. From a distance, the guy shouts "it's OK, he's friendly!" Funny, because the dog is growling at us up close. (and I'm thinking "Well, that doesn't mean you should assume my dog is friendly!" for your own dog's sake) I know Paw Paw is a dominant alpha intact male, and doesn't do well with other male dogs his size or larger. Females and small dogs are fine, but not big males.

The dog gets in Paw Paw's face and his owner is still doing nothing other than chatting on his cell phone. Paw Paw let this dog know of his dominance by doing the head over the back thing. Finally the man sees the commotion and calls his dog back, and the dog runs off. Whew! Thank you for FINALLY doing something.

Well, the dog returns to its owner, and instead of him grabbing his dog and putting it back on lead, the dog bolts all the way back over to us, and again the owner does nothing. Now the dog is growling more and hackles up, so Paw Paw does the head over again, then mounts this neutered male dog. I get Paw Paw off of him and finally the guy is walking over saying "I hope everything is OK, he's never been in a dog fight." I told him that everything was OK and that I wouldn't let them fight. I also let him know that my dog doesn't do well with dogs his size or larger.

It's just so frustrating that I have to deal with this almost weekly. I don't always post about our "adventures" but sometimes it gets to me. Paw Paw is restrained on a lead and when an off-lead dog runs up on him, I can see how he might be alarmed knowing that he's restricted on lead and this other dog can freely attack him at will. If Paw Paw attacked first as a warning sign of premature self-defense, I think he would be justified. Nara and Paw Paw have been attacked so many times while on lead by off-lead dogs, so it's second nature to them now to get defensive even if the dog might be friendly. Either way, there are leash laws in this state, and people should follow them to avoid any potential attacks, and so I can exercise my dogs in peace. I couldn't believe this guy, and the fact that I have little time each day to exercise my pack, and this incident is depleting that time and closing our window of opportunity for Paw Paw. It isn't fair to him! ARGH!

I know when I run with Nara I'll sometimes let her off lead, but I'm always up ahead watching for people and dogs, and as soon as I see them, I turn around and put her back on lead, plus she has near perfect recall which this other dog did not because the guy kept calling him and he only returned back once. We usually run in places where we're the only ones, so I don't have to worry about it much, but I'm always watching to make sure I'm not doing to others what gets done to me.

RANT over. Sorry.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,782 Posts
Wow people are stupid. I'm sorry that has happened to you over and over again. Please don't take this the wrong way I'm only trying to help. I wouldn't let Paw Paw put his head over another dog like that. What if they got into a fight and you somehow couldn't break it up? again I'm not trying to be mean I'm only concerned for yours and paw paws safety. When I've been walking and have had a loose dog approach us I stand in front if my dog sometimes holding my dog behind me, I dont talk to the dog, but I five it eye contact and face the dog and get really big into a dominate stance and usually the dog stops and goes in the opposite direction. I also carry a good walking stick so I can use it to keep a dog at bay until the idiot owner comes and gets my dog, but usually just claiming my space works. I hope that your next walk/bike ride goes better than this one.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,219 Posts
Yes, when I walk into the dog park it's a free-for-all of dogs charging the newcomer (my dog). No wonder she's shy... this has been happening since she was little so we go very seldom and she did not overcome it until recently.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
682 Posts
I feel your pain as this happens to me as well. If anyone lives near Newton Ransom on here, go and walk your dog at the Clarks Summit elementary school. There is a lighted trail back there that would be nice if people knew how to walk a dog but usually I see people with their dogs off leash or on a 5,000ft expandable so their dog gets to you and then 30 min later the owner shows up lol. I love that comment too "oh don't worry he's friendly". Pftttttttt sometimes it's not easy being tolerant.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,675 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Wow people are stupid. I'm sorry that has happened to you over and over again. Please don't take this the wrong way I'm only trying to help. I wouldn't let Paw Paw put his head over another dog like that. What if they got into a fight and you somehow couldn't break it up? again I'm not trying to be mean I'm only concerned for yours and paw paws safety. When I've been walking and have had a loose dog approach us I stand in front if my dog sometimes holding my dog behind me, I dont talk to the dog, but I five it eye contact and face the dog and get really big into a dominate stance and usually the dog stops and goes in the opposite direction. I also carry a good walking stick so I can use it to keep a dog at bay until the idiot owner comes and gets my dog, but usually just claiming my space works. I hope that your next walk/bike ride goes better than this one.
I was hoping the dog really was friendly so Paw Paw could meet and greet and socialize. I let them sniff. I know I've posted on here before about dogs off lead and some people on this board got offensive that myself and others treat every off-lead dog like it's aggressive when they run up on us. So I tried something different. I let them meet, but as soon as I realized this dog wasn't friendly and Paw Paw wasn't going to get along with it, I moved Paw Paw away, but the dog kept running up on us.

I will always stand with my dog and ensure that he is facing the "aggressor" so he feels safe. I know some people pull their dog away and retreat, forcing your dog to have its back to the off lead dog. I don't want to freak him out and expose his unprotected backside to a potential threat. So we stand together and I'm ready to do whatever is necessary until the problem is handled. If I stood in front of him, he'd be going bonkers behind me trying to see where the dog is at, and it would put me in more danger than when I stand next to him. If they started running around my legs, I'd get all tangled up in his leash. I speak from experience! Haha. Like I said, this happens all of the time. Each situation is different based on time, place and circumstance.

The dog was obviously set on meeting Paw Paw, so it was going to go around me or through me to get to him. I don't want to automatically go into "kick or hit the other dog" mode before I see how it gets along with Paw Paw. If there isn't going to be a problem, then it's all water under the bridge. I just try to stand by my dogs until the other owner takes control over their dog. I've broken up many dog fights, none of which my pack start. Paw Paw has started trouble in dog parks when we first rescued him and were trying to socialize him, which is why we stopped going to dog parks. But while on walks/runs/bike rides, he's never started anything, and I'll always be the first to finish it if a dog does attack, which I've had to do many times already.

But I know where you're coming from! One day I had Nara out on a run and some GSD mix was barking from across a busy road. It charged us despite oncoming traffic, and I got between it and Nara and threw a karate kick (not that I know karate, but I have played soccer for 30 years) to its face to thwart it off. I didn't make contact because the dog was smart enough to turn around in the nick of time and run back into its yard. The owner came out and apologized, and instead of venting and going off about her and her dog, I'm always the nice guy and said "I just don't want to see your dog get hit by a car!" Why am I so nice all of the time? Ugh!!! I really need to speak my mind, but that would get me in trouble too often. Ha!

Thanks for the advice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,782 Posts
Lol ok sounds like you're doing a good job I don't want paw paw to get into another fight and ruin any chance you have with socializing him with other dogs :) I've had my fair share of off leash dogs running up to me and dodger even one on a freaking stretchy leash ran up and got in dodgers face!!

Sorry for the typos and weird grammar I'm on my phone haha
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
445 Posts
Wow, people are such dummies! I really know how frustrating that is. Every time I go home the neighbors let their dogs run around. One time I went walking and this dog came up and my old dog Marshall went after the other dog. The other dog wouldn't go away so I had to kick it. It finally left
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,667 Posts
Kudos for being the nice guy. I got frustrated/pissed off reading your adventures. I have had things like that happen NUMEROUS times as well. I have a leash reactive lab, who is leash reactive due to being attacked on lead - and people still assume he's friendly (lab duh) and yell "it's ok, he/she is friendly". Which annoys the crap out of me. No it's NOT ok, and I don't CARE if your dog is friendly - my dog feels attacked even when the other dog is just coming up to sniff. He's great off-lead but on-lead, everyone needs to leave us alone.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
386 Posts
this is why i carry a concealed gun... i wouldn't shoot the dog at all unless extreme (and i emphasize extreme)measures, but more-so it would DEFINATLY get the owners attention and maybe the dog won't go off leash ever again
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
490 Posts
this is why i carry a concealed gun... i wouldn't shoot the dog at all unless extreme (and i emphasize extreme)measures, but more-so it would DEFINATLY get the owners attention and maybe the dog won't go off leash ever again
Kinda worried here.. If concealed there should be no reason to remove your firearm unless you intend to shoot. Sounds like you mean wave it around like this is your warning type deal?

If so makes the rest of us gun lugging folk look bad...

Anywho, I'm the same. Though I think end of the day, I would just punch the dog In the face. If it had bit me, then it's done for. Bite my dog.. Umm depends.

Crazy how folks are though. Some people shouldn't have dogs!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
302 Posts
You're in Portland so I'm just going to say that this is going to be a regular occurrence. Every time I go to the park, I see dogs off lead. It was fine when Dutch was tiny and I could pick him up and diffuse the situation, but now he's a big boy and often times I have to get involved. The other day he was playing with a pitbull mix pup and the pit kept grabbing him by the neck. Finally we were able to grab the pit and toss it aside. The owner wasn't doing anything.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,002 Posts
All I have to say is kudos to you for keeping your temper. I think the second time the dog ran over I would have yelled some very colorful words to the owner (my husband does tell me I can swear like a sailor). It is one thing if the owner is trying and the dog broke loose but completely different when they are just plain stupid!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,675 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
You're in Portland...this is going to be a regular occurrence.
When we lived in VA, it would happen every now and then, and usually it was some little fluffball who ran under the backyard fence or bolted out the front door with the owner not paying attention. Now that we're in OR, it seems to happen daily! So you're right. I think with all of the "free spirits" out here, they want their dogs to live free and roam and run off lead and not be restricted by "the man" aka "the leash." Haha. I've never seen more off lead dogs in neighborhoods, etc. and the owners don't even realize that it's wrong and they're breaking the law, or maybe they just don't care because they're so free that laws are beneath them.

Either way, my dogs are leash reactive and don't like it when strange dogs run up on them unrestricted, while they are on lead and are restricted. I'll let my dogs defend themselves until the owner of the other dog does something about their dog, and if they don't do anything about it, I will before my dogs will!

Friendly or not, dogs belong on lead unless they are at an off lead dog park or have perfect recall and get recalled (and obey the command) the instant the owner sees another dog approaching. It's like that human that is so nice, they're overly nice, and they like to put their hands on you. As a stranger, you have no idea of this human's intentions. Friendly or not, it could be threatening, especially when we like our space and don't want strangers putting their hands on us. Later on you realize they were harmless and friendly and that's just how they greet and say HI, but before you realized their intentions, you were uncomfortable and deemed them a threat to your personal space. Off lead dogs are threats and make us uncomfortable, even if they're the friendliest dog on the planet. You never know that until it's too late, and if they aren't the harmless, innocent type, it could be too late for your dog or that dog if you let your guard down and a dog fight breaks out.

My guard is always up, and every off lead dog is a threat and deserves whatever happens to them, which is hopefully nothing. If the owner is making an attempt to recall their dog or discipline their dog, then I'll assist to protect my dog and their dog.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
27,460 Posts
I've owned dogs for most of my life and one thing I can ABSOLUTELY 100% assure you is.............

loose dogs are in the world and WILL continue to run up to me and my dogs.

This will happen. For sure.

So I can either get all angry and defensive and mad each and every time. At something I KNOW will happen.

Or I can better prepare myself and my dogs for these meetings.

I choose to prepare MY DOGS and have a plan. And after having dogs for many many many years and having many many many dogs run up to us, I've only had about 3 meetings that were a bit scary.......and even these resulted in no blood shed (BECAUSE I WAS PREPARED AND SO WERE MY DOGS). Not cause I had a gun either.

I train and socialize the heck out of my dogs. Really. On and off leash. Any and all dogs. In any and all situations. So MY dogs are calm. MY dogs don't over react. MY dogs know how to read an oncoming dogs body language and analyze it. MY dogs KNOW HOW TO CALM DOWN AN ONCOMING DOG!

Really! Our dogs can 'learn' to calm down dogs if we don't start mucking around with their learning and ability to 'throw' out their calming signals as well as reading the oncoming dogs.

And if MY dogs was

I know Paw Paw is a dominant alpha intact male, and doesn't do well with other male dogs his size or larger. Females and small dogs are fine, but not big males.
so I knew MY dog was likely to be the problem I wouldn't be yelling anything at the other owner but 'MY DOG IS VICIOUS YOU NEED TO GET YOUR DOG'. 'MY DOG WILL FIGHT YOU NEED TO GET YOUR DOG' !!!!!

Let's look at what really happened (not what we humans interject and fear). One dog ran up to greet you and your dog and then it seemed like ALL KINDS OF CRAZY WAS COMING FROM YOU AND YOUR DOG!

Do you really think your behavior adding to the calmness and control of the situation? Or did you add to the stress for BOTH dogs?

So while CLEARLY there are 'bad' dogs out there that will injure your dog. What I'm saying is the number of those dogs is infintesimal compared to just the rest of the other dogs who want to just say 'hello'. So for me to go into a complete freak out for the rest of my dogs life every time a dog runs up to say hey makes no sense when there's alot of OTHER things I can do to help my dog.

How I act it key to add to the problem or to the solution. DOG CLASSES are a controlled situation to have my dog learn they don't have to love all other dogs, or even like all other dogs, but they need to BEHAVE and listen to me.

The other thing is I learned to read dog's 'calming signals' from both my dogs and the oncoming ones. This is vital because we do not read 'dog' well at all. Get the DVD


Welcome to Dogwise.com
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
21,368 Posts
I am one that doesn't appreciate my dog getting charged by a loose dog when mine is on leash under control. However, as Maggie says, it's gonna happen at some point in life.

My dog doesn't appreciate it tho, so with that in mind, while I don't stress out over it (or try not to)..when someone yells to me that "My dog is friendly",,I will yell back, "Mine isn't and I'm not paying your vet bills if they connect"..
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,675 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
so I knew MY dog was likely to be the problem I wouldn't be yelling anything at the other owner but 'MY DOG IS VICIOUS YOU NEED TO GET YOUR DOG'. 'MY DOG WILL FIGHT YOU NEED TO GET YOUR DOG' !!!!!

Let's look at what really happened (not what we humans interject and fear). One dog ran up to greet you and your dog and then it seemed like ALL KINDS OF CRAZY WAS COMING FROM YOU AND YOUR DOG!

Do you really think your behavior adding to the calmness and control of the situation? Or did you add to the stress for BOTH dogs?.
I didn't freak out though. There was no "ALL KINDS OF CRAZY FROM ME AND MY DOG."

I hopped off my bike and restrained Paw Paw on lead to keep him from advancing, and waited for this owner to do something about his off lead dog. When all he did was shout "it's OK, he's friendly!" I shouted back "well, he's (Paw Paw) NOT!" and then we just stood there waiting for the owner to do something. Due to the fact that he was talking on his cell phone far off from where his dog was, he might not have even heard my response. And when he saw his dog run off after us, he did nothing. It was a while before he even tried to recall his dog because he was too busy on the phone.

I definitely was not stressing or freaking out. Paw Paw can handle himself. That dog should be able to read Paw Paw's body language and know that it's not wise to take another step closer. And I'm all for socializing and letting them meet IF THE DOG IS INDEED FRIENDLY because that's good for my dogs too. But the instant they growl or snarl or attack, the last thing Paw Paw needs to worry about is defending himself, because before he'd be able to get a bite in, I'd be all over that dog. I've done it before with a pitbull who attacked Nara and Paw Paw at the same time. This yellow lab approached and started growling. So much for "it's OK, he's friendly!" And we just stood there waiting and waiting and waiting.

I'm always going to stand my ground and face whatever dog is coming at us. I know we're doing nothing wrong, not breaking any laws, etc. so I'll wait and do my best to diffuse the situation until the irresponsible dog owner gets control over their off lead dog. I should've cursed out every single one of these owners every time this has happened to us, but not once have I ever lost control of my tongue and said anything like that. I'm always kind and polite and calm and IN CONTROL!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,675 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
I've owned dogs for most of my life and one thing I can ABSOLUTELY 100% assure you is.............

loose dogs are in the world and WILL continue to run up to me and my dogs.

This will happen. For sure.
...but you're certainly right about this! I don't know why I'm so shocked each time it happens. Probably because I don't allow my dogs to do it to other people's dogs, and in my ideal world (aka my bubble) other dog owners are equally responsible and would never let their dogs do it to us. Haha.

I can dream, can't I?!?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,782 Posts
Just want to point out one thing growling doesn't always mean the dog is aggressive. Dogs growl for many different reasons ie if they're unsure or nervous they'll growl. You have to look at their body language to interpret what thier growl actully means. Just thought I'd throw that out there :)

Sorry for the typos again I'm on my phone.....still lol
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,675 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
Just want to point out one thing growling doesn't always mean the dog is aggressive. Dogs growl for many different reasons ie if they're unsure or nervous they'll growl. You have to look at their body language to interpret what thier growl actully means. Just thought I'd throw that out there :)

Sorry for the typos again I'm on my phone.....still lol
He was growling, showing teeth, hackles up. Didn't look friendly at all, but he didn't attack, so he's lucky. As long as they don't attack, I'm not too worried and even if/when they attack I'm never worried because I know I can handle the situation (at least so far). I just don't like getting interrupted from my exercise session by an irresponsible dog owner and their off lead dog. A responsible dog owner would've hung up the phone and ran over to grab his dog, then apologize for what he allowed to happen. If Paw Paw was as aggressive as some of the dogs that have attacked us, this guy's dog would've been dead before the owner even took one step in our direction. It took him forever to come over and help, and he left me there by myself to monitor the situation and ensure nothing happened to either dog.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,921 Posts
People are lucky that I'm so nice and polite while handling stressful and pressure situations. If I told them what I was really thinking/feeling, I'd get into fistfights weekly. Haha. I'm always trying to "do it right" and follow the rules and obey the laws, and I know I'm not perfect either.

So I took Paw Paw on a bike ride last night, and he has to remain on lead 100% of the time due to zero recall. I took him to the cemetery that we always utilize for runs and bike rides. He got all ALERT and when I looked to my left, here comes a yellow lab off lead running up on us. I had to hop off my bike to ensure Paw Paw didn't drag me off. We use this cemetery a lot and rarely ever see someone else with a dog. Usually we're the only ones in there. Maybe once every 4 months do we see another dog, and it's normally on lead.

So I'm looking around for this dog's owner and I see a guy on a cell phone far away. He isn't even aware that his dog ran off. The dog slowly walks closer and closer. I get a good grip on Paw Paw and wait for this owner to come get his dog. From a distance, the guy shouts "it's OK, he's friendly!" Funny, because the dog is growling at us up close. (and I'm thinking "Well, that doesn't mean you should assume my dog is friendly!" for your own dog's sake) I know Paw Paw is a dominant alpha intact male, and doesn't do well with other male dogs his size or larger. Females and small dogs are fine, but not big males.

The dog gets in Paw Paw's face and his owner is still doing nothing other than chatting on his cell phone. Paw Paw let this dog know of his dominance by doing the head over the back thing. Finally the man sees the commotion and calls his dog back, and the dog runs off. Whew! Thank you for FINALLY doing something.

Well, the dog returns to its owner, and instead of him grabbing his dog and putting it back on lead, the dog bolts all the way back over to us, and again the owner does nothing. Now the dog is growling more and hackles up, so Paw Paw does the head over again, then mounts this neutered male dog. I get Paw Paw off of him and finally the guy is walking over saying "I hope everything is OK, he's never been in a dog fight." I told him that everything was OK and that I wouldn't let them fight. I also let him know that my dog doesn't do well with dogs his size or larger.

It's just so frustrating that I have to deal with this almost weekly. I don't always post about our "adventures" but sometimes it gets to me. Paw Paw is restrained on a lead and when an off-lead dog runs up on him, I can see how he might be alarmed knowing that he's restricted on lead and this other dog can freely attack him at will. If Paw Paw attacked first as a warning sign of premature self-defense, I think he would be justified. Nara and Paw Paw have been attacked so many times while on lead by off-lead dogs, so it's second nature to them now to get defensive even if the dog might be friendly. Either way, there are leash laws in this state, and people should follow them to avoid any potential attacks, and so I can exercise my dogs in peace. I couldn't believe this guy, and the fact that I have little time each day to exercise my pack, and this incident is depleting that time and closing our window of opportunity for Paw Paw. It isn't fair to him! ARGH!

I know when I run with Nara I'll sometimes let her off lead, but I'm always up ahead watching for people and dogs, and as soon as I see them, I turn around and put her back on lead, plus she has near perfect recall which this other dog did not because the guy kept calling him and he only returned back once. We usually run in places where we're the only ones, so I don't have to worry about it much, but I'm always watching to make sure I'm not doing to others what gets done to me.

RANT over. Sorry.
If your dog "attacks first", then he (and you) are the problem.

Second your other one has "near" perfect recall - what about the other times? Isn't that the same problem that you are ranting about other people about?

Sounds like maybe the hassles of other people's dogs off lead may be getting to you??????????????

Don't blame you for the rant!
 
1 - 20 of 53 Posts
Top