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hi every1, im new and this is my first post.

ive dont lots of research on the german shepherd and ive been wanting for quite a while to buy a puppy. ive been searching on the internet for good breeders in Greece (because i live in Greece, lol). i have found two kennels, one i bought a puppy couple months ago, but long story short, he sold me a problematic puppy, and overpriced it too, so i gave him back the puppy and i got my money back.

then about 2-3 weeks ago i was looking around pedigree database and found a kennel (far from were i live) that had a litter born on December 22 2007 with 3 males, now i think 2 are left. their website is http://www.shepherdland.gr (this site works with internet explorer not firefox). do you think they are good? should i proceed with a purchase?

if not, please give me some information were to find good respectable breeders.

PS: Im interested in a male, black and red german shepherd, i am planning on doing schutzhund and i dont want him spayed/neutered (because of hormone problems). Also, dont mention rescue, because here in Greece the only dogs that this type of organizations have is stray dogs, and its just to give them shots and neuter them.
 

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I know nothing about breeding so I will not pretend. I did spend 8 mnths researching and finding my breeder so I do know that frustration.

So sorry about your first experience. That must have been really difficult.

Hope this next pup is a positive experience.
 

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I've looking in the dam's pedigrees and they look pretty good, but this breeders don't title their own dogs. If you are looking for a SchH prospect I would recommend to start looking in SchH clubs.

May I ask what happened with the first pup?... just out of curiosity, maybe other people that are now looking for breeders can learn from your experience.
 

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i doubt their are any schutzhund clubs here in greece. i found a SchH greek website, but it is under construction. lol

with the first pup, a month after i got it, i took it to the vet for his shot, and for a check up, the vet saw that he was an anorchid an that he was now to old for his balls to drop (4-4.5 months, not sure). because of this, he would have to have surgery to remove the balls, if their were their in the first place. anyways, this would of caused high risk of cancer, and also not be able to have sex, so he would get angry at males (not dogs but humans too) and i cant be responsible for that, because i have an 8 year old brother and their are many stray dogs in my hood.

btw, LicanAntai. i private msged them on pedigree database and they say it costs 700Euro a puppy. what do u mean they dont title their dogs? im interested in schutzhund, but not as a serious thing, just to have fun with my dog. but most of all i want a healthy good looking smart dog that will protect me.
 

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I think you and I are very much in the same path
Wanting to do the sport but with no Club to do so. The nearest club around here is 1.100 km away.

What I mean is that the ancestors of the dams in the website you posted have titled dogs (at least in SchH, that you mencionated) but the breeders themselves only do show, but if what you want is a good looking pet but with the basis for trainability I think they are Ok.
 

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Just to let you know that anorchid male can still do what you wanted and yes it does require a minor surgery to remove the 2nd testical that is in his belly, You were going to neuter him anyway. I understand that you wanted a pup with no defects. Good luck with your search and there are many members here that will be able to steer you in the direction that is needed
 

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Discussion Starter #7
hi Chuck, you got me wrong their, i don't want him neutered, i just think that the whole idea of neutering is wrong (its a personal opinion, much like the dilemma of if the death penalty is right or wrong) but thanks for the good luck. lol

lol about the SchH LicanAntai, i guess ill just get an arm biting thing and train in the local park, lol, imagine the attraction we would make. haha.
but if u think the dam is good background, and that the pup will look good, i think i should take this litter seriously. If u noticed the sires face, i think he looks good (with the awkward coloring) so i guess so will the pup.

Thank you LicanAntai for looking into this.

Ps: Im still open for other replys and other thoughts on this, or if anyone has a better kennel in mind. Plus, when i get the pup, i think ill be visiting more often, lol
 

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Sorry I thought you were going to neuter him. My mistake good luck with your search. But if you are going to schutzhund you need to tell so called breeder that this is what you plan on doing so that he/her can match you up with the right pup.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
oh, i see. all right. i found the dam that LicanAntai was talking about, i saw her previous birth on pedigree database, will u please check out the picture and tell me why the ear is like that? is it ok? or is it like that for allways? because most her pups in that birth have that, except for the one they picked to keep.

http://www.pedigreedatabase.com/gsd/pedigree/517562.html here is an example
 

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Could be many reasons, it ccould be a lazy ear or maybe they had the ear tatooed. But you said all the pups have ears like this except for the one they picked. Is there any other pictures of these pups. It real hard to determine the problem with out seeing said dog first
 

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Discussion Starter #12
thnk you everybody for being helpful!

I have one last question. How do i know the dogs that the breeder shows me as parents really are the true parents, or if the pedigree is fake?
 

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Originally Posted By: Epsilonthnk you everybody for being helpful!

I have one last question. How do i know the dogs that the breeder shows me as parents really are the true parents, or if the pedigree is fake?
Well, the dam of the litter is pretty obvious as she's the one who will be pregnant and later in the whelping box nursing them. I suppose there is no way to be 100% sure of the sire unless you witnessed the mating. Though if in doubt, DNA testing can be used to verify parentage.

As far as knowing the dogs are who the breeder claims the dogs to be in terms of pedigree, if they are permanently identified with tattoo or microchip you can check the tattoo or chip of the dogs and verify their identity that way.

But really, if dealing with a reputable breeder this isn't an issue. If you can't trust a breeder enough about pedigree and parentage, and if they don't have a good reputation for being honest, I wouldn't trust them enough to get a puppy from them.
 

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What other "problems" did your pup had besides undescented testicles? Maybe it would benefit to discuss those "problems" and how they can be avoided before you get another pup (who might exhibit the same "problems").

To believe that neutered dogs become- or are more aggressive towards male dogs & people is absolutely
 

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Discussion Starter #15
well, my dog looked maybe older (comparing to pix on the net) than the age (months) that the breeder said. his ears were not up, one stood sometimes, but that is no biggy, im sure they would go up.

but that is just details, the testicle problem was the main one, because the vet i took him too was a good woman that is well known in my neighborhood, and she was nice, i took him their for a shot, she refused to do it saying i should take him back, i dont think she was lying about the future problems because it was like she was losing a customer since i took him back. (like a gas station telling you that cars are bad.. hehe)

but anyways, Argo was a really smart puppy, i was very sad when i gave him back, i felt like i was a sell out to him. i know this has nothing to do with the thread, but i really feel like
.

here is a pic of him, on the side of my bed:
 
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