[Konotashi]

I exercise her one hour per day and that is nowhere near enough. Moxie got into a tussle (fight) with the "new" owners other shepherd and that was it. sheesh. here's my question for all of you "experts" if you are in fact so good with shepherds then how do I get Moxie to stop being so incredibly dominant ???

No criticisms here, I'm looking for good advise and help on this to help Moxie.

I didn't read through the entire thread. I'm sorry it didn't work out for the new owners, but if they only gave her that long, then that obviously wasn't the best home for her.

The wording in this post wasn't exactly necessary, though. Why not just ask for help, rather than criticizing - which is what that is, despite saying you're not.

Survey people. Let them KNOW that she needs some training. Don't make it a secret or she'll more than likely be returned to you again. Make SURE that the people that she may be going to live with are willing to work with her.

 

[jenedge24]

After reading the responses on this post I have to say, I have a love hate relationship with this forum. People can be so kind and supportive and truly concerned and want to help or cheer on GSD owners, or they can just come on to critisize and belittle because someone may not be the "master" at training, breeding, etc. I'm sure I'm going to be targeted for saying this but really, they are dogs, they don't speak, and I don't care how good you are with a dog, they can't tell you everything they need. Trial and error! Crap, I'd hate to see what some of you say about my parenting skills!! fact is people like scotty and even myself put ourselves out here in a few paragraphs and let you into our world for a little advice or just knowing someone else out there loves there dog too. I seriously doubt anyone on this forum does things deliberatly to hurt others or their dogs. So instead of taking a few paragraphs of someones lives and beating them down with your snid comments maybe you should log off go take your dog out for a run then come back and give that person the benefit of the doubt that they want what's best for their dog and your ignorant comments leave them feeling really bad. This is a place where people should feel safe to ask for help and discuss issues related to their pets. When your rude and get on your K9 fever, to protect this species with every judgemental comment you have your not helping, your pushing people away from having a place to go to help BE BETTER PET OWNERS!!! Sorry Scotty and to everyone who is so great! I'm sorry for your situation with your dog, so sad and I'm sure you felt torn and horrible. I'm sure she will find a good home. I'd let her vet know your situation and maybe the police dept. A lot of police officers(or retired) obviously have worked with the breed and might be in a situation to take on a dog that needs the extra time!! GOOD LUCK, love her while you have her, which I'm sure you do!! again I am sorry for my 2 cents!

 

[Konotashi]

Jen, I have to say - this is one of the nicest places to come for advice. I know it can get harsh sometimes, but even the 'worst' threads I've seen on here are worlds better than some other forums.

I don't think this thread is as hard on the OP as others. Everyone is offering advice. If she takes it, great. If not, then that's up to her.

Everyone here is here for the dogs.

 

[codmaster]

Hey Scotty, a small suggestion perhaps it willhelp.
"here's my question for all of you "experts" if you are in fact so good with shepherds then how do I get Moxie to stop being so incredibly dominant ???"

The above approach will probably not really help people to want tohelp you too much, I would guess.

BTW, I suspect that the answer to Moxie's behavior will be more of a process rather than an event that will "fix her" overnight. But let the "experts" give you a more detailed answer. I would suggest working with a real dog professional.

 

[jenedge24]

Your right they are! I believe there are amazing people on this forum that have a lot to offer and I am not discounting them at all they have been real life savers and have great ideas!!! But... In some cases we need to remember there are people too not just dogs and making people feel bad does not make for a confident owner. before being so harsh in our replys we need to take a step back and either ask more questions to understand the situation better, or give more constructive critisism. What it comes down to is we're here to communicate and we all do it differently...but we shouldn't be unkind.

 

[KZoppa]

After reading the responses on this post I have to say, I have a love hate relationship with this forum. People can be so kind and supportive and truly concerned and want to help or cheer on GSD owners, or they can just come on to critisize and belittle because someone may not be the "master" at training, breeding, etc. I'm sure I'm going to be targeted for saying this but really, they are dogs, they don't speak, and I don't care how good you are with a dog, they can't tell you everything they need. Trial and error! Crap, I'd hate to see what some of you say about my parenting skills!! fact is people like scotty and even myself put ourselves out here in a few paragraphs and let you into our world for a little advice or just knowing someone else out there loves there dog too. I seriously doubt anyone on this forum does things deliberatly to hurt others or their dogs. So instead of taking a few paragraphs of someones lives and beating them down with your snid comments maybe you should log off go take your dog out for a run then come back and give that person the benefit of the doubt that they want what's best for their dog and your ignorant comments leave them feeling really bad. This is a place where people should feel safe to ask for help and discuss issues related to their pets. When your rude and get on your K9 fever, to protect this species with every judgemental comment you have your not helping, your pushing people away from having a place to go to help BE BETTER PET OWNERS!!! Sorry Scotty and to everyone who is so great! I'm sorry for your situation with your dog, so sad and I'm sure you felt torn and horrible. I'm sure she will find a good home. I'd let her vet know your situation and maybe the police dept. A lot of police officers(or retired) obviously have worked with the breed and might be in a situation to take on a dog that needs the extra time!! GOOD LUCK, love her while you have her, which I'm sure you do!! again I am sorry for my 2 cents!

dont apologize for your 2 cents. i'm probably one of those critical people your talking about. The point of this forum is to provide support but also be critical of some things. The OP said a few things that are a big no no to do without experience and even people with experience wouldnt push their luck being new to the breed and getting two so close. If they'd waited to get a second dog, Moxie might not be in the situation SHE'S in. She would have gotten necessary training and its very possible the OP would have realized how much work just Moxie would need and her temperment towards other dogs given it sounds like she has a dominant personality. But as i've stated without actually having met Moxie or seen the scuffle at her 24 hour home, there's really no way to really know if it was a dominance scuffle or an aggression scuffle. It sounds like the OP got in over his head with two GSDs and is rehoming the one that is more trouble. THATS why people are getting snappy. We see far too many animals on this board listed as urgent or in need of a home to get them out of the shelter because their owners ditched them because they were too much trouble. Nobody bothered training most of them and they ended up with an unruly dog they had no clue how to handle. Moxie got out because she wasnt getting what she needed and it NEVER should have gotten to the point of her getting out and causing trouble. If more people did the research on the breed and talked to owners FIRST and speaking to breeders about the different lines, they may have found a GSD that would be happy just being. Moxie wouldnt be in the situation she's in. Being passed to a new home even for 24 hours is scary and unnerving when a dog doesnt know or understand WHY they're suddenly away from everything they know and care about. I'd be a PITA too if i was in her position. She's being a dog. She's being the dog she was bred to be. They're working dogs and some need more work to do than others. We're supportive when necessary but many of us wont give someone the ammunition for the gun.

 

[middleofnowhere]

In all these five pages, I missed anyone suggesting that the OP might contact the original breeder of Moxie for help placing her.

I applaud the OP for recognizing that two were too many in their situation. Of course, hindsight is much better than foresight. Of course everyone wishes that would have been known ahead of time. Then, too, had the OP looked at the forum very closely, they would have recognized that posting such a message would get the snarling response that they did. This causes me to wonder if the OP is just naive or if the post is a plant. Since the forum is viewed by many people, I offer my 2 cents with the assumption that the poster neglected to explore the forum before posting.

Placing a dog is a challenging and imperfect task. Best of luck.

 

[jenedge24]

dont apologize for your 2 cents. i'm probably one of those critical people your talking about. The point of this forum is to provide support but also be critical of some things. The OP said a few things that are a big no no to do without experience and even people with experience wouldnt push their luck being new to the breed and getting two so close. If they'd waited to get a second dog, Moxie might not be in the situation SHE'S in. She would have gotten necessary training and its very possible the OP would have realized how much work just Moxie would need and her temperment towards other dogs given it sounds like she has a dominant personality. But as i've stated without actually having met Moxie or seen the scuffle at her 24 hour home, there's really no way to really know if it was a dominance scuffle or an aggression scuffle. It sounds like the OP got in over his head with two GSDs and is rehoming the one that is more trouble. THATS why people are getting snappy. We see far too many animals on this board listed as urgent or in need of a home to get them out of the shelter because their owners ditched them because they were too much trouble. Nobody bothered training most of them and they ended up with an unruly dog they had no clue how to handle. Moxie got out because she wasnt getting what she needed and it NEVER should have gotten to the point of her getting out and causing trouble. If more people did the research on the breed and talked to owners FIRST and speaking to breeders about the different lines, they may have found a GSD that would be happy just being. Moxie wouldnt be in the situation she's in. Being passed to a new home even for 24 hours is scary and unnerving when a dog doesnt know or understand WHY they're suddenly away from everything they know and care about. I'd be a PITA too if i was in her position. She's being a dog. She's being the dog she was bred to be. They're working dogs and some need more work to do than others. We're supportive when necessary but many of us wont give someone the ammunition for the gun.

I completely agree with everything above, ob brought it to the forum which leaves it open to be critizied, It's not rude when you back up your issues, which from the post I read you did. Sometimes it can be pretty harsh and it's not even over the situations like this which I concider REALLY BIG issues, especially when a dog has to go to a new home (again). sometimes people can be harsh right out of the gate over the little stuff. When someone is "giving it to you" no matter how right they are, human nature is defense, you don't really hear what they're saying because all you think is what a ...." Obviously OB got defensive the last reply so was the point taken? I don't know. I hope so for the dogs sake.

 

[KZoppa]

I completely agree with everything above, ob brought it to the forum which leaves it open to be critizied, It's not rude when you back up your issues, which from the post I read you did. Sometimes it can be pretty harsh and it's not even over the situations like this which I concider REALLY BIG issues, especially when a dog has to go to a new home (again). sometimes people can be harsh right out of the gate over the little stuff. When someone is "giving it to you" no matter how right they are, human nature is defense, you don't really hear what they're saying because all you think is what a ...." Obviously OB got defensive the last reply so was the point taken? I don't know. I hope so for the dogs sake.

i'm not going to lie. We got Shelby and fell in love with her. We wanted to breed her. People on this forum after hearing about her issues begged me not to. And after time of seeing qualities in her i wouldnt want in another dog, she's not going to bed bred. I like to think i'm pretty intelligent and knowledgable about the breed we all love so much and fight regularly to keep out of trouble so yeah, we get very upset when someone messes up and then passes the problem to someone else instead of sticking to the commitment they made to that animal. You dont ditch you kids off on someone else because they punched someone. You figure out how to work with them so they learn from mistakes and you do everything you can to get them on the right path. If you really considered that dog a member of your family, you do everything you can to keep them with you, even if it means some extra work. I'm a mother of two. My oldest JUST turned 3 Oct 23. I have 4 GSDs one of which being a 6 month old puppy and another being an 18 month old GSD who i'm working out her seperation issues and continuing the training she needs before she goes to my sister and her son who is normally fearful of ALL dogs but absolutely LOVES Shelby. our 6 year old male has other dog fear issues so he gets growly and barks at other dogs walking on the street when we're out. He was attacked repeatedly at a dog park on different days by a saint bernard when he was about 3 years old. When we adopted him at 6 months old, he was attacked by the great dane that lived down the hall from us when we lived in an apartment. Honestly, i dont blame him for being nervous around other dogs outside our home. We're working with him on it. Zena is an alpha personality female and she is same sex aggressive with other dogs. Its taken a few years to get her to realize she doesnt need to be a total brat and start fights. My husband is gone for days at a time because he's military and thats just the nature of his particular job. I also work around HIS schedule full time. The point i'm making is that no matter what you have going on, its possible to still work with a dog that has issues. Shelby is doing very well with her seperation issues. She's no longer distructive to herself or the house when we leave. Riley doesnt totally spazz every single time he see's another dog. Zena is currently living with my inlaws for her health. Shasta is the best behaved 6 month old puppy in the neighborhood. It is very possible to work with Moxie's issues and prevent her from escaping again but ONLY is the OP is willing to work with her. Its not only about time, its about the willingness to do so and honestly, without the willingness, whether you have the time or not doesnt matter.

 

[shannonrae]

Your right they are! I believe there are amazing people on this forum that have a lot to offer and I am not discounting them at all they have been real life savers and have great ideas!!! But... In some cases we need to remember there are people too not just dogs and making people feel bad does not make for a confident owner. before being so harsh in our replys we need to take a step back and either ask more questions to understand the situation better, or give more constructive critisism. What it comes down to is we're here to communicate and we all do it differently...but we shouldn't be unkind.

INDEED! :thumbup: I have a suspicion that some people come one here to criticizes others and make themselves feel better about their own "parenting" skills.
Not necessarily anyone on this particular thread.
But, there are some members who repeatedly make negative, condescending posts. No matter what the problem nobody knows more than they do! I have said it before and I will say it again, being rude gets you nowhere in educating other pet owners!

 

[Stogey]

INDEED! :thumbup: I have a suspicion that some people come one here to criticizes others and make themselves feel better about their own "parenting" skills.
Not necessarily anyone on this particular thread.
But, there are some members who repeatedly make negative, condescending posts. No matter what the problem nobody knows more than they do! I have said it before and I will say it again, being rude gets you nowhere in educating other pet owners!

I have to agree with Shannon ! I've seen the criticism by certain posters and I'm sure they meant well, actually looking out for the best interest of the animal, but again the condescending attitude is not needed. I have and will continue to report such "put down" posters to the moderators. Some people need to realize that not all of us are "expert" handlers and are here to learn and socialize with the folks who are ! So lighten up !

And that's just my Dos Centavos !

 

[GSDElsa]

I have to agree with Shannon ! I've seen the criticism by certain posters and I'm sure they meant well, actually looking out for the best interest of the animal, but again the condescending attitude is not needed. I have and will continue to report such "put down" posters to the moderators. Some people need to realize that not all of us are "expert" handlers and are here to learn and socialize with the folks who are ! So lighten up !

And that's just my Dos Centavos !

Why are you reporting those posts? They are not breaking any forum rules and you are just giving the mods more useless work. WHether you like the tone or not, a post isn't going to be removed if it is not violating any rules.

 

[LaRen616]

Why are you reporting those posts? They are not breaking any forum rules and you are just giving the mods more useless work. WHether you like the tone or not, a post isn't going to be removed if it is not violating any rules.

:thumbup:

 

[Scotty]

Thank you everyone, I felt very put down earlier in this thread by a certain truck driver / writer and that gives me a negative view of this mesageboard however that won't prevent me from doing the right thing for Moxie. I refuse to give her to anyone who won't take proper care of her and that's why I'm here. I appreciate the input I am getting here on her behalf. I think that a big part of being a responsible adult is admitting when you are overwhelmed and seeking help to correct it so that is what I am doing.

I have to add that my male shepherd is EXTREMELY ralaxed and seems to need nothing yet the polar opposite is Moxie who is very active and needs tons of attention that I am unable to give for her. I was really lucky that no one was hurt when they both got lose and I'm not going to risk it again. We'll see what happens but while I find a home for Moxie I will work on her behavior and dominance issues and maybe we can keep her !

 

[JeanKBBMMMAAN]

No, it's fine to report posts that people think are questionable. If there is a trend over time of the same person getting reported by different people, it may be time to look at that person who is always walking the line of acceptable posts.

The idea is that the moderators can't read all the posts, so there may be a hum-dinger of a poopstorm happening and we won't know it without the notifications.

 

[Stogey]

Why are you reporting those posts? They are not breaking any forum rules and you are just giving the mods more useless work. WHether you like the tone or not, a post isn't going to be removed if it is not violating any rules.

I'll just tell you as my Grandaddy used to tell me " If ya ain't got nothing good to say, keep your trap shut ... I will continue to report abusive posters whether it's in your mind a waste of micro-bits or not !!!

 

[lish91883]

I was amazed when I started reading the thread and so many people applauded this person’s decision and respected them for making such a “tough” decision. When I read Doggiedad’s post I wanted to stand up and cheer.
It would be one thing if the OP had said that they had tried everything, including training & even more exercise, but it was just not working. Then re-homing would be more understandable & probably wouldn’t have received the snarly responses that it did (and deserved). It doesn’t sound like the decision was too “tough”, but the easiest way out with the least amount of work.

 

[LaRen616]

I was amazed when I started reading the thread and so many people applauded this person’s decision and respected them for making such a “tough” decision. When I read Doggiedad’s post I wanted to stand up and cheer.
It would be one thing if the OP had said that they had tried everything, including training & even more exercise, but it was just not working. Then re-homing would be more understandable & probably wouldn’t have received the snarly responses that it did (and deserved). It doesn’t sound like the decision was too “tough”, but the easiest way out with the least amount of work.

I will stand up and cheer for you!

I agree :thumbup:

 

[Betty]

Thank you everyone, I felt very put down earlier in this thread by a certain truck driver / writer and that gives me a negative view of this mesageboard however that won't prevent me from doing the right thing for Moxie. I refuse to give her to anyone who won't take proper care of her and that's why I'm here. I appreciate the input I am getting here on her behalf. I think that a big part of being a responsible adult is admitting when you are overwhelmed and seeking help to correct it so that is what I am doing.

I have to add that my male shepherd is EXTREMELY ralaxed and seems to need nothing yet the polar opposite is Moxie who is very active and needs tons of attention that I am unable to give for her. I was really lucky that no one was hurt when they both got lose and I'm not going to risk it again. We'll see what happens but while I find a home for Moxie I will work on her behavior and dominance issues and maybe we can keep her !

If you are still looking to rehome her contact a rescue (there are plenty on this board) and ask for assistance in learning how to screen homes. Since she was returned in less then 24 hours I think it's obvious that you need help in this area.

When I place a pup or a dog, I look at it as I have one chance to do it right, and how well I do that job will make all the difference in the world to the dog in question. It can literally be the difference between life and death.

I have also found that dominance is often a mis-used term, kind of one of the internet training buzz words. What people often call dominance is often just a lack of training. I would strongly suggest that you look into a group ob class and even see about putting a CGC on her. It will help greatly in rehoming her.

Find out how your dogs escaped and fix it.

Most importantly put on your big boy pants, put your hurt feelings aside and put Moxie's well being first and tap into the resources available on this board.

And if someone wants to report this post, go for it. Just look at the rescue section first and try and figure out how many of those dogs ended up there because the original owner decided that they did not have the time for the dog.

I think it was asked but I don't recall seeing an answer, have you contacted her breeder?

 

[Jax08]

I think we need to put the violins away and get back to the issue at hand.

There is a dog that needs to be rehomed. Not everyone can handle more than one dog, a higher energy dog, a problem dog, etc. Some just don't have the skills and knowledge.

So...start by contacting rescues. At the very least, if there are no foster homes available, ask if they can do a courtesy post for you to get her on Petfinder. Second, offer to foster her until a new home can be found.

Third, do a very honest assessment of her. You know she is bossy towards other dogs. So she will either need to go to a home with a submissive MALE dog or a home without any other dogs. The new owners will need to be committed to training and working her. Screen these new homes very carefully. Do vet reference checks, training checks, personal reference checks and a home visit!

How about contacting local SchH clubs or obedience clubs? You might find knowledgeable people there that would be a fit for her.

At this point, as you want to rehome her and feel over your head, this is really about management for you. Jean gave you great advice. There was also a post about stimulating her mentally. You can do this in just every day tasks. Everything she does, ask her to do something. Spend 10-15 minutes teaching her a new trick. Find a more physically demanding exercise for the hour that you are exercising her. Can you take her swimming? Play frisbee?

Look up NILIF (Nothing In Life is Free) and practice it! It really sounds like she needs a job. You know how ppl get when they have to much time on their hands! Same philosophy here!