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So I am in tears right now, my 5.5 month old pup just bite me while I was handling her food... I have started with day one of her being home me handling her food, taking it away while she is eating give it right back, putting my hand in it, picking up kibble and feeding it too her from my hand ect.. all things that I did with my last dog to make sure she didnt become food aggressive, but my new pup is now showing obvious signs of food aggressiveness not only towards other dogs but just now to me as well...

I had just put her kibble in her dish and I bent down and I was petting her calmly then I put my hand in her dish and removed a few kibbles and as soon as I did she stopped eating then gave me the eye and bit me. It happened very fast, I dont know how to handle a FA dog, dont even know where to begin, I dont know if what I did would make things worse as I snap her collar and told her NO (knee-jerk reaction). So I just put her in her X-pen for now and I am going to contact a woman in my area who is suppose to be excellent in helping with bad behaviors, the only problem is that she takes the dog in her home for up to a month to work with it, and Im not sure that will help or not, and I dont want my pup to lose out on a whole month apart from me while she is still so young.

Another thing I would like to bring up is I really dont think we have bonded :( it breaks my heart, she is always so friendly with other people and never really with me... She does not sleep near me at all, she would rather sleep on the opposite side of the room, she doesnt come when called even though we have been training that since she came home, she barely shows any affection to me at all, doesnt like to cuddle or anything... I feel miserable right now... I put hours a day into her, playing with her outside, walking her for up to 2 hours a day, training her, giving her love and attention, I feed her the best food that I can give her ( GO! Sensativity + Shine Salmon formula), she has an abundance of toys and chews all over the place, and yet I still feel that she would rather have nothing to do with me :(

Can anyone offer some advice?
 

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I will go look for some links, but what you did is what people who I believe are in the know, will say is exactly the wrong thing to do. However this advice is still given all the time - to play in the food - and people do it.

It is interesting, I think Packen once mentioned that the dog loses respect for someone taking their food in that way because in a dog pack, the dog that leads the group is the one with the food, and it's the one that is not in charge that tries to come up and sneak food, toys, etc, usually getting corrected for doing so. Whether this theory is true or not, it is something to consider. I know here my oldest dog does not "allow" the others to take things from her, and I let her do it, because she does it appropriately (in dog) and they learn a lesson (kindly). If you look at the relationship with your dog, it is something to think about. She's very unsure of what her place is with you and would prefer if you were her leader, which would be more reassuring. Particularly because I believe she has some fear issues in the past?

Bottom line, I don't do it to my dogs or fosters, who come in often with food issues that do not get worse, and do get better and I would have slapped the hand of someone who had tried to get between me and the brownie I had yesterday! ;)

You can fix and undo it - it will probably improve your relationship at the same time - and you can do it at home with a good, POSITIVE behaviorist helping you there instead of sending her away for it.

Be back with some links to support and help.
 

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Well I am not sure about the FA part. However if you are having a bonding issue I would suggest NILIF. It would make her rely on you 100% for all her needs and help with bonding. I dont know if it would help with the FA though.
For the FA I might try to give high value items everytime my hand came near the bowl that way she associated my hand=high value food, like chicken or whatever she really likes. Becasue right now she might be associating your hand with "I gotta stop eating AGAIN cause mom is gonna mess with my food, she even takes a bit of my kibble away" I would be annoyed with someone messing with my food when I was just hungry and wanted to eat, but if they were putting something yummy on my plate then I would be very happy for them to mess with my food. Thats just MHO. Like you said you have a professional comming over so I am sure she knows way more than I do.
 

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What Jean said. honestly, put yourself in the pup's shoes. You sit down to your dinner and your spouse starts messing with your plate. Stirring it around with their fork. Picking up your plate and then putting it back. EtcEtc. How long would it take to tick you off?
 

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Where are you getting your information on how to train? I ask because it sounds like your training methods are creating problems, like the food aggression. I created a food aggression problem in one of my dogs because I didn't know any better and like you was taking the food away and then giving it back because I thought that's what you were supposed to do. What it actually does is teach the dog that you are not trustworthy or predictable, neither are which are traits a dog looks for in a leader.

Start over, very slowly. First just let her be while she's eating. Them, start tossing something really good into her bowl every so often while she's eating. As she learns that you are the source of good things you can get closer and continue to do this. Eventually you should be able to trade her the really good thing (I'm talking bits of cheese or cooked chicken, something irresistible) for her food. This could take a long time and for now I would just leave her alone, while you figure out what's going on in general.

What kind of training are you doing with her in general? How do you feel about her? IT sounds like she is getting some mixed signals from you. Maybe you need to start over with all of her training. HAve you ever tried a clicker?
 

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I have heard that you start with whatever the dogs comfort zone is. You give her food and then back WAY off and take one step at a time twards the dog and when you see the very slightest twinge that she is getting upset, tail down, a weary look, turning her back on you to guard her food, You stop! Take a big step back and mark that spot on the floor. From there you will take a few days of standing in that spot and tossing a high value yummy treat into her bowl. When she gets to the point that you come to that mark and she turns her head away expecting food, you move your mark one step forward, and continue this until you are at her bowl and able to put the high value item in her food bowl without her giving off any signs of being upset. If you move to fast you will know she will start giving signs and you have to move back a step.
I have heard that this works, I have never had a FA dog so I havent used it.
 

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Dainnera - ha! Yes!

I think you really, really need to leave her alone for a while. Really stressing that. Now is not the time to experiment or try things you read/see - other than letting her be - you need to interview trainers and behaviorists with the question - how do you work with food aggression? You are looking for the methods that we are talking about and a thorough knowledge and answer as to the amount of time it can take, the methods used, the reasons behind them, etc.

Some links - basic stuff:
Relationship Centered Training | Suzanne Clothier

Preventing Aggression over Food | The Bark
Like Ruth said - you need to give her space now for a few weeks, a month, whatever - time is not the same for them - just leave her alone and let her eat in peace and quiet. HUGELY IMPORTANT:
To begin, walk by your dog as he eats and toss a treat without stopping. Do this only 1-2 times during any feeding session and don’t do it every time your dog is eating. Overdoing it can cause a dog to feel irritable, the same way many people feel in a restaurant when a waiter refills the water glass after every sip.
Again, you don't want to start this yet. Give her some time to breathe and start to trust that you aren't messing with her.

Here is an article about guarding against other dogs, but I really like the first paragaph: How to React When Your Dog Begins Resource Guarding Against Other Dogs - Whole Dog Journal Article

Find a Clicker Trainer | Karen Pryor Clicker Training

It's usually clear once you really think about it - and I am sure your pup will enjoy NILIF greatly - that structure means a lot to them, and it is still something I do with my nervous dogs - make them do sits and touch and other little "tricks" to relax them on outings, because it helps - and they are seniors now (genetic temperament issues).
shy-k9s : shy-k9s great information there
 

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I dont think playing in her food is the best thing. Not sure how much that even helps food aggression. Feed her a few meals a week entirely by hand. But dont mess with her food while shes eating. Would you want someone doing that? I could stick my hand in Berlins bowl while hes eating and take it away etc, but why would I want to? I did NILIF with him and he has no food aggression whatsoever. When a dog is eating, just let it eat. Dont pet it, and mess with it. They say to children, never bother a dog while its sleeping or eating. I think the same goes to anyone of any age.

Not sure how to fix it, but its definitely fixable. Id just start with some NILIF (feeding one meal a day entirely from hand - make her work for it ie: sits, downs, etc) And the rest of her meals, let her eat them in peace.

As for the bonding, she is still young. My bond with Berlin didnt intensify until recently (hes 9 months old). Just work on some fun bonding activities with her...make time with you the funnest thing in the world. Training her (make sure its 100% fun and positive!) should help strengthen your bond. Dont worry, it will all work out. Good luck with everything.

EDIT: I have been able to take raw bones and what not away from Berlin. Through NILIF he has learned that everything I 'loan' him is mine. The toys, treats, food, its all MINE, that he is allowed to borrow. But it is not his. He knows great things come from me. Things such as tug- the tug is hidden most of the time, I take it out only when I want to initiate a tug sesh with him. Same with special high value treats. I choose when he gets them, and I make him to some work for them ALWAYS. I think NILIF is a great training tool, and if you havent tried it, I would begin to integrate it into every part of you and your girl's day.
 

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I had just put her kibble in her dish and I bent down and I was petting her calmly then I put my hand in her dish and removed a few kibbles and as soon as I did she stopped eating then gave me the eye and bit me.
I will go look for some links, but what you did is what people who I believe are in the know, will say is exactly the wrong thing to do. However this advice is still given all the time - to play in the food - and people do it.
We've had NUMEROUS threads here about resource guarding, both how to prevent it and what to do about it after it's already occurred. Over and over again people will promote and staunchly defend this method of messing with the dogs food, even though although it may have worked for them before with this particular dog or that particular dog, it's really not a good way to build trust. And what, after all, is resource guarding about? Trust. If your dog trusts you to be fair, to not just suddenly and randomly take valued things away from them for no apparent reason, there is no need to guard those things from you.

I never take food OUT of the bowl. I will "own" the bowl and hand feed from it, I will also put yummy stuff IN the bowl while my puppy is eating, but I don't take food out and I don't take the bowl away. Once I give it to them, it's theirs and they can eat in peace. I also train impulse control around food (Susan Garrett's "It's Yer Choice" game), I make them sit until released while I put the bowl down (after I've done any hand feeding from the bowl that I'm going to do), and I play lots and lots of trading games with the puppy's toys, bones, and balls, a few minutes at a time, several times a day. I teach them to bring me things for a treat reward, and then they get back whatever they gave me - bonus! What all this does is build trust, and make giving up things a fun game, so when it comes time that my puppy gets ahold of something they are not supposed to have and that I need to get away from him/her, it's not a problem. I've never been snapped at, growled at, or bitten.

This worked so well with Halo that she would look for things to bring me - glasses, TV remotes, potholders. She started bringing me her bones to hold for her while she chewed them. She likes to bring me balls so I can take them away and give them back a few times before going off to play with them. And when she stole a 12" long knife off the kitchen counter while I ran to the bathroom for a second, guess what she did with it? Yep, she brought it to me! :laugh:



Here's It's Yer Choice:

 

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We've had NUMEROUS threads here about resource guarding, both how to prevent it and what to do about it after it's already occurred. Over and over again people will promote and staunchly defend this method of messing with the dogs food, even though although it may have worked for them before with this particular dog or that particular dog, it's really not a good way to build trust. And what, after all, is resource guarding about? Trust. If your dog trusts you to be fair, to not just suddenly and randomly take valued things away from them for no apparent reason, there is no need to guard those things from you.

I never take food OUT of the bowl. I will "own" the bowl and hand feed from it, I will also put yummy stuff IN the bowl while my puppy is eating, but I don't take food out and I don't take the bowl away. Once I give it to them, it's theirs and they can eat in peace. I also train impulse control around food (Susan Garrett's "It's Yer Choice" game), I make them sit until released while I put the bowl down (after I've done any hand feeding from the bowl that I'm going to do), and I play lots and lots of trading games with the puppy's toys, bones, and balls, a few minutes at a time, several times a day. I teach them to bring me things for a treat reward, and then they get back whatever they gave me - bonus! What all this does is build trust, and make giving up things a fun game, so when it comes time that my puppy gets ahold of something they are not supposed to have and that I need to get away from him/her, it's not a problem. I've never been bitten, growled at, or bitten.

This worked so well with Halo that she would look for things to bring me - glasses, TV remotes, potholders. She started bringing me her bones to hold for her while she chewed them. She likes to bring me balls so I can take them away and give them back a few times before going off to play with them. And when she stole a 12" long knife off the kitchen counter while I ran to the bathroom for a second, guess what she did with it? Yep, she brought it to me! :laugh:

:rofl: my favorite picture of Halo. I 100% agree with this. I have done most of this with my dog (but he hasnt brought me a knife yet...:rolleyes:)

Trust is SO important in building a bond - and I think it has alot to do with why you two dont feel bonded. She thinks you are just out there to take her food at any time, to take her fun things, she doesnt trust that your not going to. So naturally, shes going to become protective of all her valuables.
 

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FA: call her name when she is eating and give her something way better than what is in her bowl, even when she is being aggressive to you. She needs to change the neg. assosiation from your presence near her bowl to a pos. one. Do this three time at each meal time.

During the rest of the day lots of good play, and gentle training so you two will bond and to mold her into the dog you were looking for.

WD was 6 months old when he folded his ear for the first time after I came home. He is 14 months and now really affectionate.
 

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Here's Halo at about 14 weeks old if I remember correctly - younger than your puppy, waiting to be released to eat, with her food bowl on the floor.



If she broke the sit, I picked the bowl back up and waited for her to sit again.

And ditto on what everyone else said about NILIF, I started incorporating it immediately, very easy at first and then increasing the difficulty based on the age and ability of the puppy. I made a sit with eye contact a requirement for everything.
 

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:rofl: my favorite picture of Halo. I 100% agree with this. I have done most of this with my dog (but he hasnt brought me a knife yet...:rolleyes:)
Well, I wouldn't exactly call the knife thing a success, lol! Great that she delivered it to me in the bathroom, but bad that she stole it in the first place. :wild:
 

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My advice, as far as the food guarding goes, is the same as everyone else's. But some other advice that might help (and I mean this in the kindest way, honestly) is to stop comparing Penny to Diesel. I know you love Diesel, and that will never go away. I still get teary-eyed when I think of my darlings that I've lost (and it's happening right now, too, go figure, lol) but the way you raise each one is totally dependent on the characters that they are. You know they each have different personalities, so you shouldn't think that what worked for one will automatically work for the other. Be more sensitive to Penny's needs and I think you'll see a big change in your relationship. Good luck :)
 

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Well, I wouldn't exactly call the knife thing a success, lol! Great that she delivered it to me in the bathroom, but bad that she stole it in the first place. :wild:
LOL. "look mom, i brought you your favorite knife!" :eek: Yeah - if I saw my dog with a knife that big in his mouth - i'd freak! (glad she grabbed the right end of it! ) Its hilarious you got it on camera though.
 

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Honestly, I think dogs should be able to eat in peace.

I only have one dog, he doesn't feel the need to protect his food from another & is relaxed when he eats. He eats in the kitchen & the family is in & out. I'm usually messing around in the kitchen & he's fine.

I have without thinking about it added something to his bowl while he was eating or changed his water, he just keeps eating.

But I don't stick my hands in his bowl or mess with his dish.

Some really good advice in this thread.

I would not be comfortable at all saying you have a aggressive dog...just one that got annoyed with you!

Bonding. Let her become part of your routine, bring her when you can to run errands, get the mail, take the trash down, laundry. I love to take walks/hike so me & my boy would explore together. Check out the knocked down tree, walk through a stream together, both getting wet:). Sit down under a tree & share an apple, invite him to lay with me while watching a movie, sharing a little popcorn...you get my point. This is not forced, casual. I also bonded when we started puppy classes. It happens over time.

Good luck & relax!
 

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That knife picture always kills me. Not because it's bad or dangerous, but because I'm so possessive with my Henckel chef's knife - not even DH is allowed to touch it, forget the dogs. Lol!
 

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My advice, as far as the food guarding goes, is the same as everyone else's. But some other advice that might help (and I mean this in the kindest way, honestly) is to stop comparing Penny to Diesel. I know you love Diesel, and that will never go away. I still get teary-eyed when I think of my darlings that I've lost (and it's happening right now, too, go figure, lol) but the way you raise each one is totally dependent on the characters that they are. You know they each have different personalities, so you shouldn't think that what worked for one will automatically work for the other. Be more sensitive to Penny's needs and I think you'll see a big change in your relationship. Good luck :)
:thumbup: This^ Great advice. I know how it is - when Akira passed, I felt so guilty because I constantly compared Berlin to her. But he is his own dog, his own personality. Yes they are alot alike, but they are not the same. (Mine even shared the same Sire - imagine how hard that was at first!) I was not bonded to Berlin at all at first. He was this whiney, furry, BOY! But, I knew I needed to stop comparing them, it wasnt fair to him. I wasnt giving him a chance. Once I did, and learned to love Berlin for his personality, and traits, our bond strengthened immensely. I know you miss Diesel, I still miss Akira EVERYDAY. But give Penny a chance, she needs your love and you need hers. I leaned on Berlin during a very hard time, and he gave me the love I needed, now I cannot picture my life without him..

Understand that Penny is a different puppy. She may not be as cuddly (Berlin wasnt and still isnt - he doesnt sleep in my bed, Akira used to sleep with me every single night), but she will love you just as much.
 

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I will go look for some links, but what you did is what people who I believe are in the know, will say is exactly the wrong thing to do. However this advice is still given all the time - to play in the food - and people do it.

It is interesting, I think Packen once mentioned that the dog loses respect for someone taking their food in that way because in a dog pack, the dog that leads the group is the one with the food, and it's the one that is not in charge that tries to come up and sneak food, toys, etc, usually getting corrected for doing so. Whether this theory is true or not, it is something to consider. I know here my oldest dog does not "allow" the others to take things from her, and I let her do it, because she does it appropriately (in dog) and they learn a lesson (kindly). If you look at the relationship with your dog, it is something to think about. She's very unsure of what her place is with you and would prefer if you were her leader, which would be more reassuring. Particularly because I believe she has some fear issues in the past?

Bottom line, I don't do it to my dogs or fosters, who come in often with food issues that do not get worse, and do get better and I would have slapped the hand of someone who had tried to get between me and the brownie I had yesterday! ;)

You can fix and undo it - it will probably improve your relationship at the same time - and you can do it at home with a good, POSITIVE behaviorist helping you there instead of sending her away for it.

Be back with some links to support and help.
Thank you!

And I only did this because I was advised to use this method by a trainer I used with Diesel, and I didnt have any issues with Diesel so never thought to read up on it or anything and just implemented with with Penny when I brought her home... I guess that makes me ignorant :( never thought I would be causing harm, if I had know I would have NEVER done this... And yes you are right, Penny had some fear issues with walking around our neighborhood when she was younger and with a lot of patience and training she has been excellent on walks for a while now, has shown no fear whatsoever to anything else. I appreciate you finding me some more information.
I just want a good, healthy, positive relationship with my dog and I really just want a strong bond with her like I had with Diesel
 
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