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levi does this some thing. We use e-collars, so we sometimes use that so re-emphasize the command. He would also do that when he was hearding, and he needs a quick sit when hearding. In that case we don't have the collar on him, so I take a few steps toward him as if there will be consequences if he doesn't do the command. He usually sits pretty quick. I am sure that other people more knowledgeable than I will have different opinions on this, and I am interested to hear their ideas and opinions.

Tony
 

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I can think of about 3 things:

He isn't enthusiastic about training, and some style things could be altered to improve that, or

he's blowing you off a bit because you haven't established the right relationship yet, or

he has joint issues (hip or back) and there is some discomfort on the sit.
 

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Originally Posted By: LisaTI can think of about 3 things:

He isn't enthusiastic about training, and some style things could be altered to improve that, or

he's blowing you off a bit because you haven't established the right relationship yet, or

he has joint issues (hip or back) and there is some discomfort on the sit.
Pretty sure that's what he's asking. I doubt it's a relationship thing, and more of that the dog doesn't know that you want a faster sit.

Besides only praising and treating on a fast sit, I can't think of anything else.
 

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Originally Posted By: george1990Besides only praising and treating on a fast sit, I can't think of anything else.
I guess it depends.

General focus stuff can help to in all areas, does the dog actually have basics of the sit down, what are the handler's hands doing, how is the reward timed, is the dog working with the handler or intimidated by the handler, etc.
 

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I use "puppy push ups" with random rewards to help increase the speed with the sit and down. Of couse a lightning quick sit or down will earn the reward every time. I also use feeding time as a training opportunity with sits, downs, and stands and my dog has to earn their meal before being released to eat.
 

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some other things come to my mind:

- Lack of motivation: The dog complies because he "has to" not because he "wants to" you are not using rewards or the reward is inappropriate for that dog. Some dogs work better with toys, others with food, some want you to throw the toy, others prefer to tug it. Some dogs can sell their mother for a grain kibble, others don't accept anything less than cheddar cheese.

- You are not enthusiastic enough. Humans can see the command as a military order, but dogs don't. If you want a happy fast sit, the dog has to see the training itself, not only the reward at the end, as a game. If you are flat, the dog is flat too. I usually recommend to use food for teaching precision and game for speed. You play, play, play and when the dog is hyper, you give the command, and only then. If the dog is looking at the clouds and to the flies and you ask him to sit, it's a handler fault that the dog learn to sit slowly.

- You are too harsh. Moving slooooowly is a calming signal, if the dog is afraid to be punished for being wrong he will try to "calm you down" moving as slowly as possible. If you don't correct, but your body language is tense, the same.
 

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I too like the use of commands when the dog is high in drive to help promote faster responses - a quick sit gets the reward; a slow sit does not. Also making sure the reward is given in such a way that it is brought to the dog so that the dog does not have to lift up/move from his or her sitting position to get the reward.

Since the response to the sit command is very slow to even start, I would go back to basics and start from step 1 with bringing the dog into the sit position with bringing a treat to the nose and then up and back so the dog naturally tilts back and sits (aka what I call the treat-bum tilt method). I would first excite the dog with some yummy treats (get them into food drive) and then do as described. Make sure to only reward when the bum hits the ground completely.

Something else that comes to my mind in regards to slow sits is to not recall a dog out of a sit (not sure if you are doing this or not), as some dogs begin to really anticipate the recall and therefore do not concentrate on doing the actual sit quickly and/or all the way with their "butt down".

On that note, also waiting after the full sit is done for a *minimum* of a few seconds before breaking out of the sit command.

I am still working on "butt all the way to the ground" now - her sitz is much faster now but she still has the "1 inch hovering bum phenomenom" that we need to work towards fixing!


And definately consider hip/joint/spinal problems and look into this just in case.

Some thoughts
 

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Quote:- Lack of motivation: The dog complies because he "has to" not because he "wants to" you are not using rewards or the reward is inappropriate for that dog. Some dogs work better with toys, others with food, some want you to throw the toy, others prefer to tug it. Some dogs can sell their mother for a grain kibble, others don't accept anything less than cheddar cheese.

- You are not enthusiastic enough. Humans can see the command as a military order, but dogs don't. If you want a happy fast sit, the dog has to see the training itself, not only the reward at the end, as a game. If you are flat, the dog is flat too. I usually recommend to use food for teaching precision and game for speed. You play, play, play and when the dog is hyper, you give the command, and only then. If the dog is looking at the clouds and to the flies and you ask him to sit, it's a handler fault that the dog learn to sit slowly.

- You are too harsh. Moving slooooowly is a calming signal, if the dog is afraid to be punished for being wrong he will try to "calm you down" moving as slowly as possible. If you don't correct, but your body language is tense, the same.
I agree with LicanAntai's take on this. I've found all those impact my dog's to either slow them down or speed them up. The more fun fun fun they think training is (and that's MY job, to make it fun) the faster they do the behavior and less 'calming signal' I get thrown back at me. Specially when initially training I can't 'make' them do it. I have to teach and reward. Not correct and punish.

The thing about the 'reward' is what is a reward to my dog. It's all well and good that I get out a dog treat and think it's a reward. Or decide to praise and think that's enough to keep my dog interacting and involved. But I need to look at my dog.........

Cause they show me if the reward IS a reward by their behavior. And they show me if I'm worth staying with and learning something new by their behavior. So if my pup leaves me to go sniff or run off, then I need to figure out what can I do to make it more fun, better, rewarding to the pup so they WANT to stay, WANT to learn, and are throwing behaviors at me so fast I find it hard to reward........

Clicker training is a vast help with this cause it takes all the emotion of training out of the picture. There is zero personality in the click sound, not happy, not sad, not frustrated, not unsure, not angry. A click is a click is a click. Only means one thing, that was brilliant and here's the reward.

For my dogs it seems tons of teeny REAL treats work best with initially teaching something new. I liver, cheese, chicken, roast beef, pizza. Tons of rewards given constantly. Only once they have got that behavior, fun and fast, do I start randomly rewarding AND/or adding the real motivators for my dogs. A toy. So whether a ball or tug toy (tugging is best cause interactive with us and help with the bonding and leadership role) my dogs go nutso with the toy, and there's no chance of them being stressed and throwing out the slowing calming signals when they want to go go go!

Here's some videos:

http://clickertraining.tv/product.html?item=KPDLVDJOR-02

http://www.expertvillage.com/video/8810_dog-training-puppy-sit.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ESZozdpmQMs
 
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