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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
After having a pet with hyperthyroidism before, and worrying about my boy Frank's water intake and activity levels I made an appointment with the vet.

They ran all the blood panels which resulted in everything being perfect except for elevated phosphorus levels. They asked what food I have been feeding him and I replied BB Freedom LBP formula. She said since he was 9 months old we could/should switch him to an adult food.

Seeing as his last bag of BB was coming to an end and he started to become very disinterested with it, I thought it would be the perfect time to switch him to Fromms Heartland LBA and their 4star line. Although Fromm suggested keeping him on the puppy formula until 16-18 months, I went with my vet's advice and bought the adult formula.

Now after doing a little more research it appears that the Fromm Heartland and Gold LBP and LBA have significantly higher phosphorus levels than the BB Freedom LBP and LBA.

It seems Fromm is preferred over BB on this forum and I was very eager to switch even though he seems to be thriving on the BB other than the elevated phosphorus results.

However, if his levels were high with the BB it leads me to think the Fromm would raise it even more? Could it have just been a fluke test or maybe he was in a growth spurt? Everything else checked out fine.

For the record, he's a 9 month old Shepherd/Lab mix and 65lbs. I don't feel he's growing to fast compared to the size of other members dogs at this age, if anything he seems a little small. He's not fat (extra skin though), but he's by no means scrawny lol.

Should I stick with the new bag of Fromm Heartland LBA (even though it shows higher phosphorus), or exchange for the BB Freedom LBA? Fromm appears to have better/more protein ingredients, but the BB shows lower phosphorus and things like glucosamine and chondroitin for their joints?

On a side note, Fromm's website lists an "as is" and a "dry matter" basis. Which is the standard to follow?

Sorry for the long post, just worried about my growing boy.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
how high?
To be honest I'm not sure, I can find out Monday when they're open for business.

I had my hands full trying to pay, keep him calm, and take in all the info while in the lobby... He's not mean, but not very socialized around other dogs/people so he can tend to be a bit intimidating with his deep voice.

Just wasn't sure if there's a chance a growth spurt at that time would have shown elevated levels or if anything else could have given a false reading. Everything else including calcium was all in line with being normal.
 

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I always get copies. I would be surprised if a balanced commercial dog food would cause the phosphorus to be high. Just an fyi...Calcium binds to phosphorus and washes it out of the system. So it might not be as simple as lowering phosphorus. Or it could just be a funky day that showed high.
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
Forgot to mention at 8 weeks old he jumped off the couch before I could grab him and wound up hurting his front left leg. Poor little guy couldn't stand on it and practically had me in tears listening to him cry. I raced him to the vet (10 mins away) and had x-rays taken. No fractures or breaks and all the growth plates appeared fine. Fast forward to the 3 month marker and out of nowhere he started crying and couldn't put weight on it. After 10-15 mins of cuddling him up he was fine and hasn't had another episode since.

At the time he was eating BB Wilderness Puppy, as I wasn't aware of the LBP formula. A little after 3 months old and we switched him to the Freedom LBP because his stools were too inconsistent on the Wilderness.

Sorry if I'm rambling or if this actually has nothing to do with his high phosphorus levels, just trying to get any and all facts out there. Maybe an undetected injury from the fall is starting to show its head?

Thanks for the replies Jax.
 

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High phos levels are usually related to kidney problems since that's where excess phos gets filtered out. If you can find the results from all the labs that'll be more helpful
 

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High phos levels are usually related to kidney problems since that's where excess phos gets filtered out. If you can find the results from all the labs that'll be more helpful
I would think that the BUN and/or CREA would be high as well. At least in my experience, those level start creeping before the phosphorus. Is that always the case though??
 

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High phos levels are usually related to kidney problems since that's where excess phos gets filtered out. If you can find the results from all the labs that'll be more helpful
I would think that the BUN and/or CREA would be high as well. At least in my experience, those level start creeping before the phosphorus. Is that always the case though??
id be looking at the calcium level to see if it's low. if it was and there's an elevated bun that's a good indication that it's a renal problem. Basically good kidneys get rid of bun and bad kidneys don't so there's higher levels left in the blood. High calcium and high phos would point in some other directions and I'd want to know more about the diet and any supplements the dog may be on. Injury could cause elevated phos if the dog had rhabdo but that would take some serious trauma. Like being run over by a car.
 

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Discussion Starter #10 (Edited)
I got called in to work early and couldn't make it to the vet for copies of his results. Looks like Wednesday will be the earliest I can grab them. The vet didn't mention any other levels out of range though.

As far as his diet, it's only been BB Wilderness and BB Freedom. I should note he's food motivated so he gets his fair share of BB treats or fruit & veggies throughout the day for different training and whatnot. He occasionally gets some table scraps (steak, chicken, fish, etc), but not on a regular basis. And he loves bananas, carrots, green beans, apples, peanut butter kongs, etc. We use to use hotdogs to get his emotions in control and regain focus when he's overly excited, but not for a while as we figured there were better/healthier options.

He's now currently transitioning to Fromm's Heartland LBA and really loves it. He also gets the luxury of bottled water since I'm on a well and I notice the softener produces salty ice cubes from time to time.

No supplements at this point but would definitely consider if it's recommended to. When he's inside walking on the carpet you can hear small clicks (like tapping nails or cracking knuckles but much quieter). While it's frequent and consistent, it's not on every step (if that makes any sense) and the clicking is hard to pinpoint. It sounds like it comes from his wrists/ankles, both front and back as well as both sides. I know it's not his nails on the carpet but you can't hear it when he's on grass and the sound of his nails on the tile is louder than the clicking. I figured when he hits the 1yr marker I'd see about getting his hips and everything x-rayed. He doesn't limp or whine but the noises are still concerning.

Thanks for the replies and I'll be sure to follow up with whatever test results will help.
 

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Discussion Starter #12 (Edited)
You know about some BB recalls rights?
I think if you go to Food and Treat recalls subforum there is some info.
Was just on FB and a post came in about class action lawsuit due to lead in the product, incl. BB wilderness (but small dog)?


https://healthypets.mercola.com/sites/healthypets/archive/2017/10/30/high-lead-level-pet-foods.aspx
I did see a thread stating they're back in court for high lead levels and while it included BB Wilderness and Freedom, it said that it was for small breed. I tried looking up BB recalls but it's only showing the Rocky Mountain kibble and other forms of canned foods (no treats & even no reference on the Wilderness/Freedom).

Regardless I'm done with BB. Hopefully the high phosphorus levels were a fluke and nothing serious. I'll get copies on Wednesday.

Still concerned about the soft "clicking" when he's walking on carpet, but that's a whole different subject. The noise doesn't happen at the vet (no carpet) and I was told to hold off until around 10 months or later for x-rays which is also around when they said he could be neutered. However, if he does get neutered it won'tbe until he's at least 2yrs of age.

Not trying to spin off from the phosphorus subject, just putting all his health issues to see if anything correlates.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Got a copy of Frank's results.

Everything is normal except for the phosphorus. His calcium was on the high side but still in range. Phosphorus was a 7.2 and the normal range is 1.9 - 5.0. His BUN (18.8) and creatinine (.7) are in the middle of the scale so I'm assuming no kidney issues. He does still love his water though.

Hopefully the Fromm's LBA will do the trick of getting that number down. Perhaps BB's levels are higher than the "min" value suggests or it was just fluke test. He seems to be taking to the new food pretty well.
 
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