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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Looking at a pup breeder offering health guarantee of 2 yrs replacement. If said dog was to have bad hips.
breeder will replace pup
But new pup doesn’t come with any health guarantee. Is this a good or bad health guarantee
 

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Meh... mine ended up having terrible hips.
First of all, this is not a piece of furniture, so returning him for a replacement? I don’t think so.
Second of all, if a pup has bad hips, would you want to get another from the same breeder? In my case, no. So to me, the guarantee was worthless.
 

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Meh... mine ended up having terrible hips.
First of all, this is not a piece of furniture, so returning him for a replacement? I don’t think so.
Second of all, if a pup has bad hips, would you want to get another from the same breeder? In my case, no. So to me, the guarantee was worthless.
I think this is why a lot of breeders I've seen are starting to move away from those kinds of guarantees altogether. I've seen more and more offering just guarantees against genetic and congenital defects with a refund as the remedy, return of puppy not required but breeder will take pup back if its more than the owner can handle.

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Completely agree with @Sunflowers above. After 2 years of time and emotional investment with your companion, would you be willing to let him/her go because of bad hips? I guess an alternative would be a full refund, but even then what's the definition of bad hips? Small abnormality? Complete joint failure? Was it caused by genetics or could it be argued that you've pushed the pup so hard that you were the one creating the problem?
You're much better off researching the breeder and the parental lines of the pups, and making your own decision. And then, whatever the result, commit to your new friend.
 

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Our breeder had a one year guarantee, only because clients expected it. She actually told us that if a pup was seriously ill of course she would offer another pup. Sometimes a pup will not thrive. But she also said that she doesn't want to original pup back. Of course she would take it back and try to put it up for adoption, but she hoped folks would instead love and take care of the original pup as best they could. When breeding and raising live things, they do the best they can but there really is no guarantee.
 

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Guarantees aren't worth anything if the breeder isn't doing all they can to prevent issues. Look for a breeder who certifies their dogs under a Hip/Elbow system. Look at the pedigree of the dogs they are breeding and that ALL the dogs are also certified. If they use the SV system, what is the ZW # of their breeding dogs - if they use OFA, can you see other off-spring/siblings listed.
A guarantee (no matter how long it is) doesn't mean your dog will not be dysplastic - so IMO I'd rather buy from a breeder who does it right, than get a guarantee from one who doesn't.
 

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The standard hip and elbow guarantee is if they don’t pass OFA/SV at 24 months, a replacement puppy is offered in exchange for the first back. The replacement doesn’t come with any guarantee. Different breeders have different variations, but something to that effect is what you should expect.
 

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If health is that important to you, maybe you would be happier with a different breed not so prone to genetic faults? And you can always buy health insurance for health problems that do arise. Unfortunately, German shepherds are often affected by hip dysplasia, Degenerative Myelopathy, pannus and other genetic diseases. I do not think throwing them away because of something that isn't their fault is an option. Here is a very comprehensive article describing genetic diseases in German Shepherds: A review of hereditary diseases of the German shepherd dog
 

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I am not sure there is a breed without genetic faults With my last dog I asked the vet what a healthy breed was she smiled and said even mutts have health issues. A guarantee isn’t really important to me I would rather a breeder who cares about the dog empathizes and privies knowledge when needed. I think you can only find that out after the fact
 

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To the OP, how likely are you to return a dog you have loved for 2 years to get a replacement pup? For most people the answer is "not likely". That means, it doesn't matter if there isn't a guarantee on the new pup ... you're never going to need it.
 

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To your original question: those terms are pretty common.

In reality, contracts that include this are a warranty.... not a guarantee. There's no such thing as a guarantee on a living creature, but sellers can offer a warranty policy in the event of a problem or unfortunate outcome. Replacement, refund, etc.
 

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Find a breeder with active social media presence. That has owners of their dogs very active years after getting their dogs. They should be posting updates of their dogs and discussing issues and concerns.

Our breeder has such a page with many owners stopping by for play dates and litter reunions. You'll also see many who are or have gotten 2nd and 3rd dogs from them.

This kind presence will tell you a lot about the breeder and their dogs health and progress year after year.
 

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In addition to elbow/hip certifications, I would look for someone whose breeding pairs male/female are both DM negative for the gene (no carriers).
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Thank you this has been very interesting
I will keep looking and making sure breeder is doing health testing
 

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In addition to elbow/hip certifications, I would look for someone whose breeding pairs male/female are both DM negative for the gene (no carriers).
Absolutely nothing wrong with breeding a DM carrier as long as you breed to a clear. Nothing wrong with breeding an affected so long as you breed to a clear. Both of these will only produce carriers and carriers are not affected. To diminish the gene pool by that many great dogs is a disservice to the breed.
 

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No, nothing wrong and of course many breeders agree simply because it's inherent difficulty in finding and maintaining DM free breeding stock. However, for exceptional breeding practices, completely DM free should at least be the goal. Just ask a veterinarian geneticist if you have access to one. Very few around but all would agree.
 

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No, nothing wrong and of course many breeders agree simply because it's inherent difficulty in finding and maintaining DM free breeding stock. However, for exceptional breeding practices, completely DM free should at least be the goal. Just ask a veterinarian geneticist if you have access to one. Very few around but all would agree.
My foundation bitch was a carrier. She is also IPO 3 and has an OTCh in two countries. Temperament to die for, wonderful pedigree, CAER, OFA Cardio, PennHip and SV a-stamp.... throw her out of the gene pool because she is a carrier?? Ridiculous! Bred her to a clear, kept her daughter who is clear, bred her daughter to a carrier and kept a clear (never because they were clear - but because they were the best in the litter) - there is much more to breeding than just their DM status. It would be like throwing OFA Fair out of the gene pool. Breeding is a combination of more than just health.
 

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My foundation bitch was a carrier. She is also IPO 3 and has an OTCh in two countries. Temperament to die for, wonderful pedigree, CAER, OFA Cardio, PennHip and SV a-stamp.... throw her out of the gene pool because she is a carrier?? Ridiculous! Bred her to a clear, kept her daughter who is clear, bred her daughter to a carrier and kept a clear (never because they were clear - but because they were the best in the litter) - there is much more to breeding than just their DM status. It would be like throwing OFA Fair out of the gene pool. Breeding is a combination of more than just health.
Are you saying that the gene pool you or anyone similar, can never be DM clear on both parents? Not trying to challenge you, just curious.
 
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