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Discussion Starter #1
I say "rescue" because he wasn't pulled from an abuse situation, etc. More of a case of benign neglect. Purchased as a puppy for a child, child became disinterested, dog never got any real training, was not neutered and proceeded to take to wandering. We live in Vermont not terribly far from the Canadian border, and the previous owner lived close enough to the border that the dog managed to find his way across several times before AC picked him up too many times and the owner surrendered him. We got him directly from AC as I knew the officer that was involved in the surrender and she knew we were looking for our next GSD.

We had GSDs growing up and I've had a few as an adult and this particular dog is truly exemplary in both his conformation and his temperament (especially the latter). I really want to find out more about his breeding and bloodlines and hopefully locate the breeder but any papers he had were not surrendered with him. I do know he is CKC registered but of course they won't tell me anything about him without ownership being transferred which did not happen formally with the CKC.

I am hoping I might be able to locate the breeder and find out more info on this dog but I have no idea where to start. The previous owner lived near Cowansville, Quebec. We know the birth date of the dog but no other "identifying" information. We do have pictures of him as a puppy (he's almost 3 now) that the previous owner gave to AC.

Anyone have ties to breeders in Quebec who might be able to help? We adore this guy and would love to connect with his breeder - I'd take 10 more like him in a heartbeat.
 

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Good luck! I adopted a rescue that had an ear tattoo, and even with THAT information, got absolutely nowhere with trying to find her kennel of origin!

AC must obviously know the dog's original owner. Can't they contact them on your behalf? I understand the need to maintain confidentiality, but since the AC officer knows you, maybe he/she can get info from the original owner, and pass it on without disclosing the owner's
name.

Quebec is the puppy mill capital of Canada, which increases the chances of this dog having come from a breeder who is not responsible about keeping records or paperwork on their dogs.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I could ask the AC officer to reach out but it will likely be futile as she did try a couple times once we had the dog in our care to get him to surrender the registration but he never responded to her. He was the one who informed her that the dog was CKC registered but I have no way to actually verify this. The information he shared with her regarding what they paid for him as a puppy combined with his conformation and his disposition lead me to believe it's highly unlikely he's the result of a hobby breeder or happenstance breeding. He's too nice of a dog.

Can anyone confirm if in Canada it is required for dogs sold as purebreds to be microchipped and CKC registered? To my knowledge this dog was not microchipped before we got him, but I actually never thought to ask AC if they checked him/if he had one. He was microchipped when we had him neutered last December.
 

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You are assuming the dog came from a breeder local to the original owner. Do you know the original owner's name? You could go to the Facebook pages and ask breeders if they had litters from this DOB. Can you search the CKC site with the DOB criteria?
 

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Ask AC to provide you some document on their letterhead confirming the dog was surrendered by the original owner and ownership was transferred to you. The document should note something along the lines of this surrender and transfer of ownership occurred "pursuant to local law in our agency's jurisdiction." Our rescue has a "transfer of ownership" document that we have every shelter sign when releasing a dog to us -- that piece of paper has proven to be invaluable with microchip companies. I have sent copies of it occasionally to the AKC if I have the registration info in order to have them update the file and note that the dog has been speutered (so that our local shady BYBs can't keep on registering puppies sired by other unregistered dogs under that one's number...because that's apparently a thing where I live). The AKC is always confused about being contacted by rescue, but when I explain they're usually pretty accommodating after we send them the surrender/transfer of ownership paperwork. (I do think that they try contacting the prior owner to confirm, but silence is taken as confirmation I think). Maybe if you have that kind of document, the CKC would be similarly helpful.
 

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In Canada if the dog is CKC registered it must be tattooed or microchipped. We had a Samoyed wander into our place years ago...no collar, no tags..no chip. I put out the word that we had found a lost dog. Then one day I was patting her and she rolled over and she had a thigh tattoo. I wrote the letter/number combo down and contacted the CKC by e-mail. They gave me her registered name, and her breeders name ...and location. I live in Ontario...and the dog was from Edmonton area in Alberta. I contacted the breeder...breeder said they had lost contact with the owner of the pup they had sold to. I ended up keeping the Samoyed.

Look for a tattoo, or check again for another chip....you can get in touch with the CKC if you can get that information.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
I haven't noticed a tattoo on this dog and we are pretty well acquainted with him physically. I will have another look but I'm 99% sure there isn't. Unfortunately I think I'm operating under a bit of a handicap in terms of getting more information on him - where he was found wandering on the U.S side is A) very rural, and B) an area well known to be a dumping ground for animals as the population is largely comprised of recent prison releases and high drug activity, so the population is quite transient and animals are often found abandoned in apartments, etc. There is one AC for that town and she is volunteer, so how well records are kept is anyone's guess.

I will try and get in touch with her and see what else she can dig up for me. I realize I am somewhat banking on this dog having been purchased from a breeder relatively near where the original owner lived...which may or may not be the case. I do know the original owner's name, but I am not particularly comfortable contacting them to request further information.
 

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I do know the original owner's name, but I am not particularly comfortable contacting them to request further information.
You can still stalk their facebook and see if there is any mention of the dog's registered name ;) And you might have better luck contacting them directly than AC. Just tell them you are looking for registration records so you understand the dog's health background and possibly previous vet records. Even if they just take a picture or you go pick the papers up.
 

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I could ask the AC officer to reach out but it will likely be futile as she did try a couple times once we had the dog in our care to get him to surrender the registration but he never responded to her. He was the one who informed her that the dog was CKC registered but I have no way to actually verify this. The information he shared with her regarding what they paid for him as a puppy combined with his conformation and his disposition lead me to believe it's highly unlikely he's the result of a hobby breeder or happenstance breeding. He's too nice of a dog.

Can anyone confirm if in Canada it is required for dogs sold as purebreds to be microchipped and CKC registered? To my knowledge this dog was not microchipped before we got him, but I actually never thought to ask AC if they checked him/if he had one. He was microchipped when we had him neutered last December.
You can get some really nice dogs from very poor breeding, poor breeding just increases chances of getting temperament and health issues and dogs probably not 'show quality" but looking pretty doesn't equate to a good dog. If the dog is from a responsible breeder chances are he's WGSL, ASL, or working line as mixing lines it seems like is less common with reputable breeders so that gives you a direction to look for with breeders in the area. Find out who is breeding those types of dogs.

Also is it possible the dog is CKC registered but was bought in the US so it would be the continental kennel club instead of canadian kennel club almost guaranteeing puppy mill/backyard bred dog?

I've seen a lot of nice german shepherds that look pretty and sold for a lot but were not responsibly bred and nowadays the health and temperament issues are getting a lot worse in my area so getting a puppy from those litters is a roll of the dice. I'd imagine it's pretty similar in other places. Or well health issues have always been spotty but temperament issues are definitely picking up more.

As far as microchipping they can migrate and end up in unusual places so sometimes scanning the body of the entire dog is required. I've seen a case with an exotic animal where they had to x-ray it to locate the chip. Also depending on the vet some don't scan afterwards to make sure the chip is actually functional once it's in the dog and microchips just like with all things some are duds.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
I am going to venture a SWAG that the dog is not Continental Kennel Club registered - the reason (in part) that the dog was surrendered is because the previous own (per his story to AC) had a felony conviction in Canada and thus couldn't cross into the U.S to pick up the dog every time he went wandering, and so after 3-4 times of having to find a friend or family member to come get the dog, the guy decided it wasn't worth it anymore and gave him up. For that reason (and that's IF it's true) it's highly unlikely the dog was purchased within the U.S.

I have stalked the previous owner's FB page ;) He has two pages, it seems, one is older and had some pictures of the dog and links to the posts on FB of people who found him when he went wandering, the other is more recent and appears to be better updated. I might end up sucking it up and sending him a message but I am not entirely sure I want him to know who I am.

As previously stated, I am not at all familiar with the world of purebred dog breeding, even with GSDs despite the fact that we've had many. But for me, a "good" dog when it comes to a GSD is one that is conformationally sound (I like a straighter back with less slope to the haunch, flat wither, large and intelligent eyes/expression and a big, free gait. I am not a fan of some of the show-style GSDs I've seen in recent years with roach-y backs) as well as a balanced temperament. Our GSDs have ranged in temperaments from more stoic and protective to playful and a big sense of humor. This dog is more the latter, but what has struck me about him and what has made him different from all our others is how far reaching he is on the personality spectrum: he's incredible playful and super goofy but when you tell him it's time to go to work a switch flips and he is quite serious and very studied. He's in training with me as a psychiatric service dog and I've not found a single thing that bothers him, upsets him or gets him anxious. He loves children, other animals and made fast friends with our cat, who was four weeks old and very fragile when we got him this summer. They are now literally best friends and play together all the time. He loves other dogs, came to us extremely well socialized and although he's dominant he's not aggressive. He is protective but he's very measured about it - he started performing the "distancing" behavior before I even taught it to him (for PTSD service dogs, this involves teaching the dog to put himself between you and a chaotic situation or person and creating literal space between you and whatever is going on) and he RARELY barks (which I find absolutely unheard of in any dog!) but when he does he means business and it's usually in alarm or a warning. He went from being a free range, un-neutered 2yo to being the most loyal GSD I've had to date.

So with all that, I am thinking either he is very well bred or we literally hit the mother of all GSD jackpots. I'm honestly really hoping the former because then we might have a chance at another like him someday.
 

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If he came from a reputable breeder in Canada he has either a tattoo or a chip.
My dog Sabi was a byb dog and hands down the best dog I have ever owned. She was my trained for protection, narcotics detection, tracking, crowd control. She adored kids, was great with other animals, raised a crapload of orphaned baby critters of all descriptions and was my constant companion for nearly 13 years. She seemed, fit and healthy all her life. She had crappy hips that I would never have known about if I hadn't gotten x-rays. And she had DM.
Appearances can be deceiving.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Fair enough. I think I am just going to have to ask our vet to scan him when he goes in for his annual in February to see if there is a chip other than the one we had implanted. That is probably my best bet at this point.
 
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