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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
A while back my currently 7month old dog used to bark at other dogs. Then after some effort of training him to focus on me, he eventually started ignoring other dogs, or at most after a bark or two, he would leave it. I thought it was going well. He even started ignoring other dogs more than 10ft away.

Then suddenly between yesterday and today he has started barking / lunging at other dogs in my neighbourhood - no snarling, growling or baring of teeth. Just barking.
I purchased Turid Rugaas Barking book, and it seems to me it is excitement barking, because he so rarely gets to meet other dogs, and doesn’t get to actually play with any anymore.

I took him outside my neighbourhood to a different neighbourhood, where there were lots of street dogs (packs). He ignored most of them, despite persistent threatening and aggressive behavior on their part. He neither paid attention to them, nor did he back away. He tried to defuse by sniffing etc, and once it started getting old, he gave not more than two barks - and the packs would go away. No excessive barking or lunging by him, and no instructions by me. All him, behaving in a calm and well behaved manner, despite threatening behavior by street dogs. He was incredible.
But then there were some on leash pet dogs walking by, and he barked at them, even though they did nothing. Nothing excessive - just two barks, and he went back to sniffing.

So this seems to have something to do with leashes. I purchased “Feisty Fido” by Patricia McConnell, and although have not finished it yet, in the early pages she describes something similar to this. She also says there is a high rate of success in training away this behavior.

I believe it, simply because my dog did not react to the street dogs. He was calm, cool and collected, and deliberately defused situations, and when the other dogs carried on, with just a couple of barks, he told them in a calm manner to go away. (They did). No aggressive behavior.

but, I don’t live in other neighbourhoods. I live in my neighbourhood. In my neighbourhood he is barking and lunging at every opportunity. What can I do in the short term to get him to be calm?

- Why has my dog suddenly regressed? Till two days ago he was showing constant improvement. Was it just a bad day? Are bad days real or just an excuse by owners who have no other excuse?

I know many owners face this situation. Both books talk about this. So I believe eventually we will overcome this, just like we have overcome every previous challenge, through patience and consistency, and eventually applying the correct method.

but, as a human being, I am feeling stressed out, exactly like how both authors describe how owners feel. I know this is also not uncommon - since both owners are describing my feelings.

so my two questions are:
- How to get my puppy through the time between now, and him relearning how to focus on me instead of other dogs? So he does not stress out everyone in the vicinity.

- How not to get stressed or feel bad about this situation? Since it’s written about as a common problem, I should not feel demoralised, but honestly I do.


At home and in other places my dog is fantastic. It’s only in my neighbourhood he acts like this. He is getting enough exercise - if I dont force mandatory breaks while chasing balls, he would suddenly have to lie down and rest. So I carefully monitor his breathing / panting/ amount of tongue sticking out, as well as how fast he is chasing. We play a lot also. He is sleeping and eating properly. He is affectionate and obedient with regard to everything else.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Pups backslide and go backwards in their training all of the time. You had success before right? Just do the same thing that you did before.
Yes, I genuinely believed we were constantly improving, or at least moving forward.
this time I am worried because he’s barking with a lot more energy, as well as lunging with more energy. I have no idea what has triggered this.
earlier People would just dismiss his barking as annoying and carry on. Now his volume and intensity of barking is so much more it has moved from annoying, to concern.
I don’t think anyone believes he is aggressive - but he creates a bit of a spectacle, since he’s so loud. if I try to preempt as before, he acts as if I’m interfering in his fun and then tried play biting me to beg to be allowed - this doesn’t hurt or anything and I can very easily remove him from the area, but I don’t think he will learn anything.
It’s a vicious cycle and counter productive and ironic. If he would just not bark, he would get to meet the dogs in question, as well as play with them. But because he is barking, he is not getting to meet, so he is barking even louder, so not getting to meet…so barking even louder…
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
We spent a lot of time on impulse control. I could stop him on verbal command the instant he is about to stick his mouth in his food, and he would be willing to wait however long I tell him. Likewise during play. We spent a lot of time modifying his behavior by counter conditioning. I don’t understand why he has regressed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
I also don’t understand - how can he change so quickly. What is all this time spent training. A few weeks of slow forward progress, then suddenly overnight a leap backwards. I don’t understand what he is gaining from this behavior. It can’t be he is doing it to intimidate other dogs, because he left the street dogs alone.
It can’t be impulse control, because he controlled himself with the street dogs.
It is happening only with leashed dogs. But why he is doing it is a mystery. I can’t think of any reward for barking only at leashed dogs - can’t think of any error to encourage this behavior.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
I know it's not your style, but it sounds like your pup needs a correction.

BTW, sometimes dogs find behaviours like barking and lunging to be self satisfying....the act can be its own reward.
😭…. I can’t…. not disagreeing or anything… just not able to at this time…. what I have done is reached out to multiple persons who are fond of my dog….and who have adult dogs that are stable… and am going to try the approaches in these books…. I am also going to cut out the busiest walk of the day for now to minimise reinforcing bad behavior…. and instead need to replace the activity or location… to make up for his energy management…. 👍…. I will try taking him somewhere else… which is more interesting….
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Also he seems to have started something else…. Barking when I’m not in the room….. earlier he did not use to do this…he was always just quiet…... Now he does this just once…a few minutes after I leave the room…. a different kind of series of barks…..then he stops….
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I have also found a third well wisher with a stable dog…. My dog is normally quiet around him once they meet…. Need to somehow coordinate all three…. So I can use all three to mentor him…. I know my dog can learn fast as he is willing to please…. Just need to come up with the right plan… to make best use of the time of these three well wishers… so puppy learns fast…. then use the improvement to get his to learn how to chill when other strange dogs are around…..so that before the well wishers are no longer free…. he has formed a new better habit… and need to consistently reinforce that habit… whatever it is… hoping I can finish reading the feisty fido book tomorrow morning… brain is too slow….
 

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A while back my currently 7month old dog used to bark at other dogs. Then after some effort of training him to focus on me, he eventually started ignoring other dogs, or at most after a bark or two, he would leave it. I thought it was going well. He even started ignoring other dogs more than 10ft away.

Then suddenly between yesterday and today he has started barking / lunging at other dogs in my neighbourhood - no snarling, growling or baring of teeth. Just barking.
I purchased Turid Rugaas Barking book, and it seems to me it is excitement barking, because he so rarely gets to meet other dogs, and doesn’t get to actually play with any anymore.

I took him outside my neighbourhood to a different neighbourhood, where there were lots of street dogs (packs). He ignored most of them, despite persistent threatening and aggressive behavior on their part. He neither paid attention to them, nor did he back away. He tried to defuse by sniffing etc, and once it started getting old, he gave not more than two barks - and the packs would go away. No excessive barking or lunging by him, and no instructions by me. All him, behaving in a calm and well behaved manner, despite threatening behavior by street dogs. He was incredible.
Packs of street dogs. Where are you?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Puppy is training me… to be better at training him….😑….at home he is becoming more affectionate and obedient…. and even better behaved when other dogs are not around… leave it etc is really good now…he’s understanding more and more things…I know he just really wants to meet other dogs… so I must find good, stable dogs for him to meet… and need to figure out the right plan…. Will try to reach out to some other trainers in the US… online… I think two were recommended earlier… I will execute whatever plan asap… and nip this in the bud…. But need to figure out the plan…. asap…👍…. wish I could speak to Stonnie…. But not much $ now…..will figure it out somehow…. When walking in some other neighbourhoods…. Even dogs indoors are barky…. My puppy remains quiet there…. and calm…. Nothing stopping him from barking there…. So something I need to figure out…why he doesn’t bark there… but barks only in my neighbourhood….
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Packs of street dogs. Where are you?
North India… but pretty much whole of India is like this… 😱…. lots of people feed street dogs….. but do not train them….or necessarily vaccinate or sterilise them….. So almost every street has a local pack… which will probably not harm people… but will descend upon any dog not part of its pack….so people taking their dog for a walk in most neighbourhoods need sticks… or need to be familiar with these dogs… I made friends with the street dogs outside my building…. But they try to attack my dog whenever they see him… haven’t yet figured out how to make them friends…
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 · (Edited)
His behavior is getting even stranger… when we are outdoors, he is suddenly jumping up and play biting me again. This is something that stopped a few weeks ago, and I used to stop just by saying a simple no, or shoo when I noticed him getting started. Nothing like this for weeks. So I’m wondering

  • is this just adolescence?
  • is this because of some sound or other trigger only in my neighbourhood that triggers him? Maybe a dog whistle? I don’t see other dogs reacting…
  • is it possible that there is some medical problem that my vet has been unable to see?

My vet says he is perfectly fine, and they don’t even muzzle him because they think he’s a sweet dog. Another friend who has had German shepherds throughout his life says he has a great temperament, and he sees lots of GSDs because his family member is a breeder.

It is unusual, because after a couple of minutes of this, he suddenly stops and we resume our walk like nothing happened. He even obeys all commands and is well behaved.

This thing has never happened at home, or in locations outside our neighbourhood. At home his obedience is so good now, that if he brings a toy to play and I say wait. He just puts it down and waits. Doesn’t shove it in my face anymore.

edit - I can’t figure out why it’s happening only in my neighbourhood.

  • if it was a behavior issue, should happen in other locations also
  • likewise if it is a health issue
  • Also - not sure of what conditions to create to reproduce this behavior. If I could do that, then I could figure out the issue.
  • Edit : he’s also started barking at inanimate objects - like a new see-saw was installed in the playground. All of a sudden he starts barking. I take him up to it, and tap on it, and he stops barking. Smells it. Then ignores it. I know this kind of thing is normal. But, it’s odd that all these things are all happening at the same time, and all of a sudden…
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Anyway, here is my plan (for science)

  • I have read “barking” by Turid rugaas
  • feisty fido by Patricia McConnell

I will execute the plans described in those books.
If you guys don’t hear back from me …. just wait longer…. 😑…. 👍
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
I didn't know you were in India, I thought England for some reason until I read about the street dog packs. If you're attempting purely positive training, I think you're in for a long and winding (and not entirely successful) road.
Yes, it’s challenging - street dogs are a bit unpredictable … some actually are chilled out and are very polite…, others that have been in fights are aggressive.. and then there are some that don’t know what to do because they’ve not met any pet dogs that are calm are relaxed and stand their ground… most street dogs are used to chasing other street dogs away.. so when my dog is calm and just sniffs the ground they’re like confused.. not sure what to do..just keep barking… and leave… my pup is surprisingly calm.. he is much more polite on the streets than he is in my neighbourhood… I think because he is used to my neighbourhood dogs he barks.. because there is some kind of reaction… like maybe the walker reacts or the other dog gets nervous…
So I started working on watch me, and u turn.. I had already taught watch me a while ago… but did not use it often… so I guess it was not well done… already it’s easier to navigate him away if I see a dog far ahead… but not yet confident of close proximity yet.. so my strategy is to do one walk near the vet… and wait for dogs at a distance… and practice desensitising there… and then go closer… found some dog parks… but haven’t been there yet… but will try parking far away… and desensitising there as wel…
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
Agree...I would ask myself, what would, Ivan, Bart, Stonnie, Michael do? There are others of course, but that would be a good start...
Haha I’ve been watching a lot of Stonnie Dennis videos since I heard about him in this forum… Michael Ellis also on leerburg… so glad people keep bringing them up…have not watched much of Ivan or bart yet…..within ny neighbourhood there are too many surprises.. suddenly there is a dog a few feet away around a corner… so I am targeting timings when no one is around… or paths where I can see far ahead… so time to use watch me or u turn… meanwhile I will work on desensitising by visiting places outside my neighbourhood where I can watch dogs from far…I’m working on both - the feisty fido book has some good ideas on how to gradually improve difficulty…
The street dogs.. … one of my neighbours regularly takes his dogs outside the neighbourhood to all kinds of places where street dogs prey… so I asked if I could join him… so I could get more experience.. seeing what he does… his dog is older and a friend of my dog.. his dog grew up in the hills so has a lot of experience dealing with street dogs… I figure a good mentor… for street dogs I think my dog is behaving well… he defuses the situation using behaviors I read about in the Turid Rugaas calming methods book…he doesn’t bark despite their behavior… but at the same time he is not afraid…I try and just wait to see what the street dogs do and what he does….so far all but one pack eventually quit and left when we didn’t budge… the one that didn’t quit was a lone stray… that I think didn’t know what to do… because it was probably used to other dogs running away… and maybe didn’t know running was an option.. so that time we calmly walked away while keeping an eye on him.. in case he became bold enough to attack…but I am thinking the dogs that have fighting experience may be more likely to attack… but the ones that don’t are used to people / dogs running / walking away… I guess there are no rules… since it depends how big the pack is… and the individual dogs in the pack… since some have been in fights… and others are just bullies that aren’t actually brave… but I’m also thinking as long as we are calm.. and don’t give reason to attack.. eventually they will quit or back off or do nothing… because maybe they are not practising impulse control… but we are… so maybe when they don’t get the pay off… us running away… and at the same time.. us being calm and cool… no reason to attack… they leave…
i am also experimenting with the tossing food option… I have not tried it yet… but I am going to practice that with a few street dogs I have already made friends with first…
Also have the option of shooing the street dogs away… but keeping that as a last resort..
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
Stonnie said in one of his videos that a dog should have experiences that build character.. experience in making good choices when there is some danger.. I guess the context is different… he was talking about if dogs are too safe they may not learn how to make good choices or something.. so I figure I will try to have more experiences.. to give him confidence.. but keep him safe also…
 

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I don't envy you having to raise your dog with rising street dogs. It will be tough since even with calm packs, the chance to play with them is more exciting than playing with you. You will have to be fair but firm. Trying to be more interesting than a pack of other dogs will be very difficult, even if you act like a clown or very a roasted chicken for reward treats.
 
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