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Discussion Starter #1
Lil is estimated to be 4 yrs old.
She may (or may not) have been raised in a shelter
She has no training, no manners, not housebroken


I started slow and calm, she went in on own, laid in it. Didn't close door
Next time lured her in closed it and hung around, did dishes, made dinner etc. No issue
Next time I lured her in, spent 15 mins of so doing stuff, going in and out of kitchen (where crate is)...then I went out for 2 hrs. Came home all was calm
Next time same routine....went out for 5 hrs. Signs she had some issues...crate was moved 6" and pulled table runner and pushed chair that was near
Next time got harder to get her in...but did, except home, mowed lawn, made dinner, ate in other room while she was in crate. No sounds
Two of the times I left she shredded bedding.
Bought her kong treat dispenser


Then this past Friday, started new job. I woke to her honking kinda cough...I am in panic. I also step in pee, so my morning is mess...Friend was coming at 1pm to walk her and spend time with. She came for 930 am.
Lil would not go near her all day (no more coughing)
Sunday, work....had to force her into crate. No choice, wouldn't fall for treats. Friend was coming for 1pm. Got here. Lil had unlatched the top (not bottom), bent the frame a bit and squeezed out.
She was on the sofa when friend arrived.


She now has separation anxiety, and crate trauma.
I have to work today.


She is being kenneled at the vet for the day. Vet called this morning and offered an adapto (sp.?) collar...if they have in stock that will go on her. If not, tomorrow.


I am off next two days, then work Fri, Sat, Sun,...will be gone 9 hrs each day


I need to make the most of next two days....HELP!!!!
(note: I also bought lavender spray - from a lavender farm, not some commercial product...and I am going to start Ashwagandha)
 

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Can you put her in a sturdy outdoor kennel with shelter while you work? That would allow you to start over with crate training and housebreaking and not have to crate her longer than she could tolerate to start?
 

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Do you feed her in the crate? I leave the crate door open for them to eat, always. It's where good stuff happens.

When dogs bust out of wire crates, we shift to airline crates. If they shred bedding, they lose the bedding. Simply diffusing some calming EO (like Aura Cacia's Mellow Mix) helps some dogs.

How did she do on the couch, when she busted out and was alone? Maybe she'd do okay if confined to the kitchen or some area with tile in case she goes potty?
 

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you mentioned this before and I would recommend this .

Ashwagandha

An adaptogen -- but so much more - which will benefit this stressed dog , who is stressed in all ways possible , body, healing crisis and emotional .

Ashwagandha will increase immune function enabling removal of bacteria and co-infectious material which I would not discount .

The tick is NOT the only vector for lyme and bartonella and babesiosis and other co infections.

the longer the immune system has been in poor shape the more open it is to infection !

Ashwagandha is also an anti oxidant , anti inflammatory and important for an animal in major detox , a support for liver.

Ashwagandha can help increase oxygen carrying red blood cells -- aid in digestion --- calm down that adrenalized state which keeps the animal in a high-alert , immune fatiguing condition.

Benefiting stressed and anxious animals , slightly sedative ,

st. Francis herb has a good tincture . Organic Traditions has a powdered version . Both are available at your local
health food store (or on-line)
 

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Anti-inflammatory + oxygenator sounds really good for a dog with HW disease. The lungs and pulmonary blood vessels often have an major inflammatory response to the worms and the bacteria they carry.
 

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yes, the worms and the bacteria they carry -- metabolites (waste products of the same)

schizandra is outstanding for respiratory and is also anti anxiety , balancing the central nervous system, like ashwagandha slightly sedative , and has some anti microbial actions in being a "blood cleaner".

you can get tincture -- or I have both whole berry and powder in my collection

I also have ashwagandha powder -- and astragulus (brew an asian broth with mushrooms).

western medicine is so lacking -- integrative is the best of all worlds.

basically the dog needs to be addressed as restoring proper function to 3 body systems (excluding nervous which will adjust )

these are the 3 under siege at this moment

circulatory
digestive
and lymphatic - that care for liver and spleen !
 

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Discussion Starter #8 (Edited)
Anti-inflammatory + oxygenator sounds really good for a dog with HW disease. The lungs and pulmonary blood vessels often have an major inflammatory response to the worms and the bacteria they carry.

Yes! And that is why I ordered Carmen's products and I am making a new bone stock right now....she has been getting for 12 days + had her 16 days. The Feed-sentials mix is ant-inflamm and an oxygenator...I used burdock root (in FS) along with red clover, and is known as a blood purifier...
 

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Discussion Starter #9
yes, the worms and the bacteria they carry -- metabolites (waste products of the same)

schizandra is outstanding for respiratory and is also anti anxiety , balancing the central nervous system, like ashwagandha slightly sedative , and has some anti microbial actions in being a "blood cleaner".

you can get tincture -- or I have both whole berry and powder in my collection

I also have ashwagandha powder -- and astragulus (brew an asian broth with mushrooms).

western medicine is so lacking -- integrative is the best of all worlds.

basically the dog needs to be addressed as restoring proper function to 3 body systems (excluding nervous which will adjust )

these are the 3 under siege at this moment

circulatory
digestive
and lymphatic - that care for liver and spleen !

I have used Ash and astragalus both from the (uh hem..cleat throat), holistic vet...G started raw and that (ash came later, whole long story of that was helpful)...But after 6 months he looked gorgeous. slim, shed 15-20 lbs......AND I have St. Francis, AND she will be started on it tonight with her night snack, Bison canned tripe, feed-sentials and her crap kibble (she LOVES kibble)
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Starting tomorrow morning...

How do I start crate training over.


Tonight she gets Ash, she has the adapto collar on, I have lavender spray and rose geranium for crate (or bandana...got her really cool one, pink with flowers and skulls (lol) (conventional vet suggested latter for calming, I was impressed! I had bought it for ticks)


I start my day at 6-630am work or not...I get coffee, and go on deck with pooch.
Go get ready, we go for fair to good walk depending, she loves walks...she may or may not poop...I have stuff to do that requires I leave and she is crated..


Where do I go from there, starting our day...To make this a positive..games? Feeding in crate her snack tonight BTW (Thanks Magwart)...I fed her last night on deck while I tried to mow lawn...she watched, she ate...she is afraid of lawnmowers if people start near her. First I had her watch me go get it...I sat with her on deck. Then leashed her and had do lap around house and sniff to our back yard, the mower. Sat with her and tethered her on deck, to be safe and mowed part of lawn away from her...


So with that in mind...I can take my time with...but have to go out..2 days to get my stuff done and hers!
 

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Crate training a dog like this can take several weeks if you want to do it right. The steps you described in the first thread are way too fast and it will take extra time to get the progress you are working for. I understand your situation but your dog doesn't.
How about a dog sitter staying with her while working with her crate training?
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Can you put her in a sturdy outdoor kennel with shelter while you work? That would allow you to start over with crate training and housebreaking and not have to crate her longer than she could tolerate to start?

My yard is not fully fenced, I have full sun from 7am to 4pm. She now has separation anxiety. That isn't going to change because she is in or out. Plus I don't have a spare $500 to buy one, nor would I trust leaving her outside to possibly escape.

You are not going to fix this inew 2 days...no way, no how

Oh I know that, what I was looking for was advice on a do over. She started off fine with crate, as she has bonded to me, the SA developed and the crate became a barrier to me. Then, the very very bad morning on my first day of work. She has HW and I woke to her greeting me with this awful honking/coughing noise while laying on her side. My plan was to leave her for about 4 hrs to which my friend would come and spend rest of day with her...she wanted to come first thing. I said no, she has to learn....well, friend had to come out almost immediately so I could go to new job. I left at 8am, she was here by 930am...Lil would not go near her all day, wouldn't let her put leash on. This should have been her saviour...My friend is the softest most gentle person in the world. She came out one day prior when Lil had only been here 4 days (she met her once before, the day I contemplated adopting or returning)....So I could go out and get things done. She came, we spent an hr chatting, I left, she hooked Lil up 4x and went for walks...no problem. She even sat on floor with her and Lil rolled over and she gave her belly rubs for 15 mins.


Last Friday, Lil won't go near.
Sunday she came again, but back to original plan...about 1-130. That's when she showed and found Lil on sofa. Lil still wouldn't go near her rest of day.


Susan Garrett's Crate Games DVD

I googled, watched a Youtube example. But was an example of a 3m old puppy with no trauma.


While this might be helpful...In the interim, I need to make crating her over next 2 days viable so that I can get things done.


So how do I do that?


I thought by putting her in and being present, going out for short spells, keeping calm and not fussing were the right ways to do???
The destructiveness came as she became more and more comfortable with her new life.
The trauma was because she wouldn't be bribed to go in, and I had to force...That was same day she escaped
 

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Discussion Starter #14
Crate training a dog like this can take several weeks if you want to do it right. The steps you described in the first thread are way too fast and it will take extra time to get the progress you are working for. I understand your situation but your dog doesn't.
How about a dog sitter staying with her while working with her crate training?

The steps were too fast? How do people who get a dog on Friday and go to work Monday do it?


I left the crate open with double sided towel for 2 days. I threw treats in, she went in ate and left...day 3 she crated herself. I did stuff in kitchen and she watched me, started falling asleep.
Next time I crated her I had to shower. No whining, nothing. I left her in there and proceeded to do dishes and other stuff and ignore. She just lounged.
I crated her next to shower. Then decided to use this space to BBQ, have dinner, do dishes. eat in other room. She was fine.
I crated her, I went out for 2-3 hrs. Did shopping and laundry. I returned home, brought all my stuff in, she was sleeping, I thought she was dead because she didn't stir even though I dropped something and made big crash...I was like...ok, this will work.


Then starting going downhill...She is feeling better (was very sick), getting stronger, more comfortable.
She is afraid of everything. People, dogs, automatic doors...not thunder though (bonus!)


Boarding her at vet - She wouldn't take treats, kept her eyes on everything going on. Didn't claw or paw at crate. She did o.k
 

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The steps were too fast? How do people who get a dog on Friday and go to work Monday do it?
A dog will tell you what works. It doesn't mean that other people have success with this. It also depends on the dog. When I worked in ,a shelter a Pit was returned because she had ripped up the bathroom floor when they left for work. Same situation: adopted on Friday, left alone on Monday; no time for adjustment.
A dog needs time, some more than others, and they don't care if you need to go to work or not. These are way too high expectations for a dog. You just have to make the best of it.
 

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Discussion Starter #16 (Edited)
A dog will tell you what works. It doesn't mean that other people have success with this. It also depends on the dog. When I worked in ,a shelter a Pit was returned because she had ripped up the bathroom floor when they left for work. Same situation: adopted on Friday, left alone on Monday; no time for adjustment.
A dog needs time, some more than others, and they don't care if you need to go to work or not. These are way too high expectations for a dog. You just have to make the best of it.

Except I didn't get a dog Friday and stick it in crate Monday.


In bold HOW???...that is the reason for this thread


This was done over a 2 week period. I don't feel the steps were too fast.


It was her change as she adapted to having a home, and food, and love and walks.


She came from a no-kill shelter in Louisiana that was broke and the dogs were crammed 10-15 a kennel with no food, the dogs were starving and the shelter was so broke they couldn't afford to euth them.
Some of these dogs had been in for months and yrs. She, based on her lack of knowing anything, may have been one that was in for yrs. (may be why she was estimated at 4 yrs old)...She has evidence of 2 puncture scars (nominal) on her legs.


I have to go out...No Choice


Do I stuff her in and let her ride it out?
 

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Get the plastic crate. Walmart. Lol.

Yes put her in and let her deal. In between do the in and out I told you about. Feed in crate. And use that Kong treat ball.
 

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Plastic because she will injure herself on wire. Walmart because they are molded so no side grates to pull out.
This is going to slow it down because you have to work. So be it. Just means you need to counter with much positive in between.
Remember the 15 minutes coming and going. Vital for dogs with sa.
 

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Once a dog escapes from a wire crate, it's game over. They will keep trying, and trying. And the worst part is they may hurt themselves in the process, either break their teeth, or get caught ore even impaled on the wire.

So, agree with Sabis's advice. At the moment, the best thing you can do is get a sturdy plastic crate, and let her ride it out. If you have a friend who can give her a break, GREAT! She will likely warm up to your friend in time.

If she didn't have heartworm, I might suggest a doggie daycare, but since she's contagious, that's not a viable option. :(
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Get the plastic crate. Walmart. Lol.

Yes put her in and let her deal. In between do the in and out I told you about. Feed in crate. And use that Kong treat ball.

I looked at one at Pet Valu.
I don't see how a plastic one is any better. The one I looked at uses a flush bolt kinda mechanism at top and bottom. if she pushes down on latch it will unfasten at top and she could get hurt trying to squeeze out.


I fed her last night and this morning in crate.


The kong is now evil
 
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