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All 3 worked for me. Thanks for sharing. It's cool to see what the experienced are doing with their dogs and it's fun to see the dogs working and loving it. Maybe someday I'll get there. I have to figure out how to use this dang leash first! ?
 

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Discussion Starter #4
They didn't seem to embed right. They work if you click in the top right corner to be sent to view it in youtube itself.
 

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Such great control in that 3rd video! At the 2:45 part, did he get the guys hand???

Thanks for sharing!
 

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Discussion Starter #7 (Edited)
Such great control in that 3rd video! At the 2:45 part, did he get the guys hand???
He just had him by the wrist which is protected by the suit, although not all that well. If he got him by the hand the video would have ended a lot sooner. Some of those moves are the decoy trying to bait him into chasing an arm and overshooting so that the decoy can try to steal the object. The dog has already been trained not to chase upper body and to go for center mass instead. The bite around 2:45 was interesting in that he chose to push the arm up in an upwardly direction. Looked almost like a wrestling move. He has the spirit of the exercise where he is really trying to keep the decoy away from his object. You can tell in the way he uses his paws to possess the object. I don't really see that that often.
 

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Such great control in that 3rd video! At the 2:45 part, did he get the guys hand???
He just had him by the wrist which is protected by the suit, although not all that well. If he got him by the hand the video would have ended a lot sooner. Some of those moves are the decoy trying to bait him into chasing an arm and overshooting so that the decoy can try to steal the object. The dog has already been trained not to chase upper body and to go for center mass instead. The bite around 2:45 was interesting in that he chose to push the arm up in an upwardly direction. Looked almost like a wrestling move. He has the spirit of the exercise where he is really trying to keep the decoy away from his object. You can tell in the way he uses his paws to possess the object. I don't really see that that often.
Really impressive Baillif! That was really close to a hand bite lol. That's a bad day.

It's really apparent that he understands the exercise. Great training. He's super quick. There's a reason all the SF handlers are running small dogs. With the right temperament, they are a handful.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Teaching dogs to go after wrists in certain pictures has a way of discouraging other decoys from trying to push a dog off the object with "hover hands"

I like the size. I think 10 more pounds would be more ideal for the sport, but the upside to that size is he is very quick and the endurance is high even though he has a tendency to run hot.
 

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Teaching dogs to go after wrists in certain pictures has a way of discouraging other decoys from trying to push a dog off the object with "hover hands"

I like the size. I think 10 more pounds would be more ideal for the sport, but the upside to that size is he is very quick and the endurance is high even though he has a tendency to run hot.
The same holds true doing detection. The smaller dogs can run longer but you have to watch their temp.

I've always been intrigued by the complexity of the object guard. This brings another complexity to the exercise I hadn't previously considered... Decoy games.
 

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Generally in the United States I have noticed many of the decoys don't know dogs well enough to actually steal the object being guarded unless the dog has really bad holes. Most of the time a decoy tries to steal the dog from the object as that is generally easier.

One of the best ways to do that is to get the dog turned around. In the video you'll see a few times when the decoy caught the dog and had himself between the dog and the object. Under his ROE he is able to walk directly away from the object and thus directly into the dog and try to get the dog to become confused. Often a dog will get lost or go into an escort. That is probably the most common way I see dogs fail on that exercise. The other possibility is the dog doesn't feel the decoy pulling away from the dog which is often the only signal to let go and return to object the dog is taught. The dog will just stay on the bite in those cases and get pushed away from the object and the dog fails that way.

The other way is to bleed a bunch of points out of a dog getting them to bite too soon at too great a distance. A decoy can sit outside of the 2 meter and just stay out there for a minute or two and see if he can get the dog to become impatient and strike from too far out and lose points that way.

Very few can read the dog and cause other problems like trying to get the dog to strike too high and chase arms while the decoy steals the object with a quick move. Some will use an approach which is confusing or disarming and will walk right in and either weird the dog out, scare him off, or just make the dog think he isn't even a decoy in play.

The object guard is pretty much a super complicated and nearly completely impractical exercise, but it sure is impressive when it is done right. I think it is just a clever way of keeping high level decoys employed.
 

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Generally in the United States I have noticed many of the decoys don't know dogs well enough to actually steal the object being guarded unless the dog has really bad holes. Most of the time a decoy tries to steal the dog from the object as that is generally easier.

One of the best ways to do that is to get the dog turned around. In the video you'll see a few times when the decoy caught the dog and had himself between the dog and the object. Under his ROE he is able to walk directly away from the object and thus directly into the dog and try to get the dog to become confused. Often a dog will get lost or go into an escort. That is probably the most common way I see dogs fail on that exercise. The other possibility is the dog doesn't feel the decoy pulling away from the dog which is often the only signal to let go and return to object the dog is taught. The dog will just stay on the bite in those cases and get pushed away from the object and the dog fails that way.

The other way is to bleed a bunch of points out of a dog getting them to bite too soon at too great a distance. A decoy can sit outside of the 2 meter and just stay out there for a minute or two and see if he can get the dog to become impatient and strike from too far out and lose points that way.

Very few can read the dog and cause other problems like trying to get the dog to strike too high and chase arms while the decoy steals the object with a quick move. Some will use an approach which is confusing or disarming and will walk right in and either weird the dog out, scare him off, or just make the dog think he isn't even a decoy in play.

The object guard is pretty much a super complicated and nearly completely impractical exercise, but it sure is impressive when it is done right. I think it is just a clever way of keeping high level decoys employed.
Have you worked with Wade Morrell?
 

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Thanks for sharing! Crank, what a great name :grin2:

He looked awesome in the object guard.

Does he usually go for legs on takedowns? And it that something that tends to happen with Mondio training, your influence, his personality, etc?
 

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Discussion Starter #14 (Edited)
Have you worked with Wade Morrell?
Nope. I've heard of him, but have never met him. The decoy in those videos is Francois Massart who I've done 95% of Cranks work with. Super clean and clear pictures. He is a beast with the stick and fast too. He placed third in the selection in France last year. Surprised he hasn't won it yet. IMO one of if not the best FR training decoy in the world.

That was at a world championship a few years back. Brutal with that stick.

Crank is primarily a leg dog. He was intentionally trained that way. I don't like dogs targeting high especially when they are small. A 60 pound dog can be dodged and deflected or scooped when they leave their feet pretty easily. If he needs to go high he will typically ignore forearms (the preferred target of most dogs) and go for shoulders chest or stomach. It is much harder to deflect or dodge dogs that go for the center of the body. Crank is also trained to see the easy targets that are initially presented as possible and even probable feints. He will target what you cannot take away from him, not what is immediately available. He will read body language, headfakes, balance changes and make his targeting decisions based on that. Highly highly technical training. Mondio typically doesn't have esquives but at the world level you're starting to see a lot more of it as time goes on.
 

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Nope. I've heard of him, but have never met him. The decoy in those videos is Francois Massart who I've done 95% of Cranks work with. Super clean and clear pictures. He is a beast with the stick and fast too. He placed third in the selection in France last year. Surprised he hasn't won it yet. IMO one of if not the best FR training decoy in the world.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XhRozAJc8Ls&feature=youtu.be

The dog in that video won the east FR region at level 3. Held for 6 seconds on a face attack. Not many decoys can do that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4BVOODh0EU
That was at a world championship a few years back. Brutal with that stick.

Crank is primarily a leg dog. He was intentionally trained that way. I don't like dogs targeting high especially when they are small. A 60 pound dog can be dodged and deflected or scooped when they leave their feet pretty easily. If he needs to go high he will typically ignore forearms (the preferred target of most dogs) and go for shoulders chest or stomach. It is much harder to deflect or dodge dogs that go for the center of the body. Crank is also trained to see the easy targets that are initially presented as possible and even probable feints. He will target what you cannot take away from him, not what is immediately available. He will read body language, headfakes, balance changes and make his targeting decisions based on that. Highly highly technical training. Mondio typically doesn't have esquives but at the world level you're starting to see a lot more of it as time goes on.
Hadn't considered that makes perfect sense though.

Lol, no kidding! Fascinating stuff, thanks for responding!
 
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