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Discussion Starter #1
This question is a bit round-about but still is regarding puppy behaviour.

I'm concerned and not sure what to do. My brother visits perhaps once a month and has met Winter a few times. He is not an affectionate person and whilst he says he likes dogs, he shows not attention to Winter whatsoever. Never even acknowledged her presence. Anyhoo, last week he was sat on my sofa and Winter came over to sniff him (ahem... in a place that caused him embarrassment). He shoved her away aggressively and stared hard at her, poised ready for her to approach again. I KNEW he would get like this. I didn't say anything about it because he is one of those people who's only interested in his own opinion and doesn't grasp the concept that he is not always right. He thinks dogs need physical force to correct them. So basically, I don't want Winter around him. I won't tolerate it again, and I'm sorry to say but if it came to it I would choose my dog over my own brother and tell him to leave, and that would be the end of our relationship.

Should I crate Winter when my brother is visiting? Should I make her sit away from him next to me? That basically means she has to just sit still for a whole afternoon though. I'm concerned that if I crate her and she doesn't know him or see him, she could become fearful/protective when she does sees him?

I know you will tell me to get some balls and say something, but if I have to (and I will if there is another incident like this), as I say he won't come back again.
 

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I don't know how aggressive he shoved her, but if you're not comfortable with the way he pushed your dog away it is up to you to prevent it. I wouldn't have an issue if my dog was doing something that made someone uncomfortable and they pushed him away. As long as they don't hurt the dog its not a big deal. I know what my dog won't listen to anyone but me he really wants something, and he might even interpret pushing as a game.

You should've corrected your dog before your brother even had the chance to, so I wouldn't really be mad at him or upset at his reaction. I mean, did you expect him to pull a treat out of his pocket and redirect her?
 

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if you're not comfortable with his "attention" towards your dog or potential negative attention, crate her. She wont be harmed from being crated during your brothers visit. Also, make it clear to your brother you wont tolerate rough handling or any negative handling of your dog. Your dog, your rules. He cant follow them tough luck.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thank you, I will definitely crate her from now on. The issue is not so much one shove, it was the anger in his face and the clenched fist waiting for her to come back. (I'd grabbed her and crated her as soon as he shoved her). He was raised to believe beating dogs/children is the way to control them.

Martemchik, she is 4 months old. I'm not mad, I'm worried as I stated. I didn't have chance to redirect, it happened as soon as she got close to him and before I could open my mouth it was over. There is no need to be sarcastic, I'd expect someone who claims they like dogs not to shove my new puppy half way across the room and give her the look of death and a clenched fist. I dread the think what would have happened if she had playfully nipped him as she so often does.
 

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as I say he won't come back again.
And the problem with that is. . . . . . . ?

Seriously, if somebody slapped your kid, or talked about adult subjects around your kids, or just gave you a really creepy vibe about what they'd do to your kid when your back was turned, would you allow them in your house?

If I don't trust someone around my dogs, that person isn't welcome in my home. In my experience, the people I've asked not to come back because of this issue, have been no big loss in my life.


Somebody like that, I'd seriously be worried about what they'd do to your crated dog if you had to go to the bathroom or something.

In one way, the debt of protection we owe to our animals is more serious than the debt of protection we owe kids, to the extent that a dog can never tell you what someone did to them if you weren't there to see it. You can teach a young child how to react if an adult treats them inappropriately-- tell them to stop, run away, and tell an adult-- but a dog can never do that. They're utterly dependent on us.
 

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Thank you, I will definitely crate her from now on. The issue is not so much one shove, it was the anger in his face and the clenched fist waiting for her to come back. (I'd grabbed her and crated her as soon as he shoved her). He was raised to believe beating dogs/children is the way to control them.

Martemchik, she is 4 months old. I'm not mad, I'm worried as I stated. I didn't have chance to redirect, it happened as soon as she got close to him and before I could open my mouth it was over. There is no need to be sarcastic, I'd expect someone who claims they like dogs not to shove my new puppy half way across the room and give her the look of death and a clenched fist. I dread the think what would have happened if she had playfully nipped him as she so often does.

no offense intended but personally, if my brother were raised with those beliefs, I'd cut him out anyway. Thats not someone i'd want in my life. i would be concerned about the effect that kind of attitude would have on your puppy about guests....
 

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I didn't mean to be mean when I said that, a clenched fist over a 4 month old is a bit much, and he doesn't sound like a person I'd want to have around a puppy anyways, but I understand that its family so there's nothing you can really do. I hope he doesn't have kids if he really thinks beating them is ok, and hopefully he doesn't have dogs as that isn't right either. Crating her wouldn't be a bad idea, and she won't get protective like you are worried about. She might actually get defensive/aggressive later in life if he does manage to hurt her physically later on.

A better suggestion might be to tether her to yourself with a leash or something. That way she's still out and about, but you control what she does.
 

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And the problem with that is. . . . . . . ?

Seriously, if somebody slapped your kid, or talked about adult subjects around your kids, or just gave you a really creepy vibe about what they'd do to your kid when your back was turned, would you allow them in your house?

If I don't trust someone around my dogs, that person isn't welcome in my home. In my experience, the people I've asked not to come back because of this issue, have been no big loss in my life.

agree!!! agree on a very large scale!!
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Emoore I completely agree. However, I don't feel it fair at this point to cut him off just out of fear he MIGHT do something worse. What if I'm wrong and have completely misjudged him? But on the other hand, what if I'm right and my puppy suffers because I didn't cut him off?

I've only known him for 2 years. We share a father who beat my brother his whole life and made him so afraid that the boy never uttered a word until he was 9 years old, by which time he was only just being weaned from baby food and malnourished. I don't have experience of him beating kids or animals, but I know that's the way our father was and I could tell the way he shoved my dog with such arrogance and intent that he thought it was the right thing to do to teach her not to do it again. And I think he would have taken it further.

I really don't know what to do. Keep her in the crate every single time he is visiting because I can't trust HIM? He has learning difficulties which is on of the reasons I cannot speak to him about it, he won't understand that you shouldn't be forceful that way with a dog, especially one you don't know. If it was a friend I would ask them not to visit again, but this is my brother :(
 

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I would keep her crated with a tasty treat or tethered, at the very least have her drag a leash so you can always get her with a moments notice. You are in a rough spot, I'm sorry.
 

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What about meeting on neutral ground away from Winter?
That's what I would do...that way you still are spending time with your brother but it's not in your home and the dog isn't there so you don't have to worry about this happening again.
 

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Hey what about the idea of tethering her to you,short leash ? If your crating her give her something really yummy to chew on so she looks at it like a reward. Kind of when he comes I get a Kong w/ Peanut butter or what ever your lil girl likes. I understand we have some idiots in our family. My Dad once put a bone from a beef rib in his mouth and told our Daisy to get it. Yeah I told Daisy No and used colorful language to explain what I would do if Daisy nailed him b/c he teased her. My BIL is not good w/ dogs I try to get Daisy to stay away but she insists on coming up behind and giving him a wet willie in the ear and then she leaves him alone. He takes her dog chair. However neither of these guys would hurt my dogs knowingly maybe out of lack of knowledge. I would crate w/ the yummiest treat /chew you can think of.It sounds like your brother has some difficulties w/ things partly b/c of his past and his learning disabilities. Your in a tough spot.
 

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JoMichelle,
If I'm not mistaken, you feel an obligation to your brother because he is family. That's understandable and you shouldn't cut him off because of his way of thinking. He probably needs the relationship. However, it is your obligation to protect your puppy. Your brother does not have to be a part of her life; and if you are not comfortable with him interacting with your puppy, it doesn't have to be. There is absolutely nothing wrong with that. Your loyalty to your brother has nothing to do with your dog. If I couldn't talk to him about it (for whatever reason), I would crate her when he is around to avoid any unpleasant incidents.
 

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To be honest, this is your home, your dog, your rules and your brother. If your brother chooses to come into your home where he knows about your dog, then he needs to know what your rules are. Dogs, especially puppies are going to smell and give kisses, your brother(if he really likes dogs) should not get offended by this and if he does shame on him for not telling you about it. Since he is family and assuming you want a relationship with him then you need to talk to him. I would not crate my dog in my home for any reason other then I decide to. If he doesn't like your rules then you can always meet him somewhere else for lunch.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
Thanks guys.

I will try the crate when he's here. I was thinking about it last night and when he's been here a few more times and Winter's been in the crate each time, I might ask him one time if he minds if I let her out. If he says he doesn't, it'll be a good opportunity for me to say to him something along the lines of "Ok, but if she bothers you just tell me, don't react because she gets scared". If he says something like he will put her in her place if she does, which is what I think he would say, I will make an excuse for him to leave. And I will tell him when he asks to come around next time, that no, I don't trust him around the dog. I think that is fair, what do you guys think?
 

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you have guess and the dog is making them nervous. if they ask
you to crate the dog you wouldn't because they thought of the idea
and you didn't? my GF is a massage therapist and she has
clients that come to our house for treatments. some of the
clients don't mind the dog walking around, some of them
want the dog in a "stay" untill they enter the massage room and some
prefer him to be crated and have asked us to crate him. what's the big
deal? if someone is visiting us and they're uncomfortable
around the dog and they want him crated or put in another room
we do it. the dog isn't hurt or damaged in any way because
he's in another room or crated.

To be honest, this is your home, your dog, your rules and your brother. If your brother chooses to come into your home where he knows about your dog, then he needs to know what your rules are. Dogs, especially puppies are going to smell and give kisses, your brother(if he really likes dogs) should not get offended by this and if he does shame on him for not telling you about it. Since he is family and assuming you want a relationship with him then you need to talk to him.

>>> I would not crate my dog in my home for any reason other then I decide to.<<<<

If he doesn't like your rules then you can always meet him somewhere else for lunch.
 

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why go through all of that. why don't you keep her crated?

Thanks guys.

I will try the crate when he's here. I was thinking about it last night and when he's been here a few more times and Winter's been in the crate each time, I might ask him one time if he minds if I let her out. If he says he doesn't, it'll be a good opportunity for me to say to him something along the lines of "Ok, but if she bothers you just tell me, don't react because she gets scared". If he says something like he will put her in her place if she does, which is what I think he would say, I will make an excuse for him to leave. And I will tell him when he asks to come around next time, that no, I don't trust him around the dog. I think that is fair, what do you guys think?
 

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Discussion Starter #19
If my dog makes someone nervous, and she will, I respect that not everyone likes dogs (I am uncomfortable around dogs I don't know well), I would be happy to keep her away from them. It's only fair and I thought about this before I made the decision to get a dog.

I see what you are saying Doggiedad and I agree. It's difficult to explain the whole situation and make it clear. My brother thinks he likes dogs and I could tell he really didn't mind mine being around him. He wanted to enforce his authority with her. He does this with people too. What I'm not fine with is crating her for her own safety because someone in her house mistreats her.
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Because I need to know if I can trust my brother or not. Someone mentioned what if I had to leave the room where she is crated and he was in there and decided to impart his authority for some reason. I thought about this. I want to know if I'm misjudging him or if I'd rather him not be in my house. It is my dog's house too, not my brothers. Do you see what I mean?

why go through all of that. why don't you keep her crated?
 
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