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Actually, assuming she's still going into heat, that's nature saying "breed me." If the dog didn't want to be bred, she wouldn't go into heat.

You seem to know a lot about how this dog feels without actually meeting her.
You really gave me a good laugh. Lol. She wouldn't go into heat if she didn't want to have puppies? That's like saying a female wouldn't get her period if she didn't want to get pregnant. Lol. It's basic biology. Female animals/ species don't really have a choice on coming into heat/periods/ whatever else you call it for other animals. Unless there is some odd and rare species I don't know about that can choose to come into heat? Lol this was a good read though. Thanks :)
 

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You really gave me a good laugh. Lol. She wouldn't go into heat if she didn't want to have puppies? That's like saying a female wouldn't get her period if she didn't want to get pregnant. Lol. It's basic biology. Female animals/ species don't really have a choice on coming into heat/periods/ whatever else you call it for other animals. Unless there is some odd and rare species I don't know about that can choose to come into heat? Lol this was a good read though. Thanks :)

I agree that the dog should not be bred at this age.

But I disagree in regards to what I quoted. Humans go through menopause. It's the bodies way of telling us no more kids.

Now that dogs are living longer, I have seen many that stop having heat cycles. Same thing. While the person/dog is not in control of there fertility, the body does know.
 

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You know what... I was just thinking about what martemchik said and... I mean, can bitches really choose to come into heat if they want to get pregnant that bad? Lol... I might be really ignorant on this. Maybe this is why I feel so against this/ breeding because I always thought, dogs don't necessarily want this, it's just what humans want, BUT!!! if a dog CHOOSES to go into heat because she really wants to be pregnant then shoot! I STAND corrected! I will apologize to everyone supporting breeders and go on about my merry way and just focus on other threads. I just sincerely, honestly, have NeVER heard of this phenomena !?,I didn't know bitches could choose this. That's kind of amazing! Haha! You learn something new everyday! Female humans got the short end of the stick :-(
 

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I agree that the dog should not be bred at this age.

But I disagree in regards to what I quoted. Humans go through menopause. It's the bodies way of telling us no more kids.

Now that dogs are living longer, I have seen many that stop having heat cycles. Same thing. While the person/dog is not in control of there fertility, the body does know.
I agree that our err biological clock does know. However, menopause is something human females can't control. We will go through menopause at some point and we don't really have a choice. I mean we could take hormones and stuff to stay young, hot, and fresh and keep dippin' it and doin' it lol, but eventually we will all go through it. I'm not sure if it is the same for dogs?
 

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Having puppies is natural. Bitches will breed to dogs given the opportunity and get pregnant on every heat cycle, if they are healthy and not restrained.

Their reproductive cycle goes through the same process whether they get pregnant or not, which is not quite the same for humans. The progesterone hits their parts and does a number on them whether or not they are bred. Sometimes false pregnancies are so like to the real thing that the bitch has milk and goes into a false labor.

With excellent nutrition and good longevity in the lines, a bitch can be quite young at eight, while another is losing a step at five or six. It depends on the bitch.

Really the whelping process is hard. It is the only discomfort the bitch goes through. And by the next day, she is generally back to herself. Once the puppy is out, you wouldn't know she was in any pain at all, save occasional tearing up of papers. Whelping can be dangerous. But most bitches make it through whelping fine, even the older bitches.

With a c-section, there is pain from the surgery, and the puppies will be right down there digging where the stitches are. That is tougher on a bitch than natural birth.
 

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Against breeding? Then why do you have a purebred dog?
Because I rescued him?. Or I guess I could have just left him wasting away, starving, in someone's backyard the rest of his life? I think not... I have rescued other dog breeds... This dog is a gsd. And what? If there were no more gsd's in the world, I would move on to the next breed of dog that needs help. There will always be dogs that need help. Good question though!! Thanks sunflower :)
 

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Having puppies is natural. Bitches will breed to dogs given the opportunity and get pregnant on every heat cycle, if they are healthy and not restrained.

Their reproductive cycle goes through the same process whether they get pregnant or not, which is not quite the same for humans. The progesterone hits their parts and does a number on them whether or not they are bred. Sometimes false pregnancies are so like to the real thing that the bitch has milk and goes into a false labor.

With excellent nutrition and good longevity in the lines, a bitch can be quite young at eight, while another is losing a step at five or six. It depends on the bitch.

Really the whelping process is hard. It is the only discomfort the bitch goes through. And by the next day, she is generally back to herself. Once the puppy is out, you wouldn't know she was in any pain at all, save occasional tearing up of papers. Whelping can be dangerous. But most bitches make it through whelping fine, even the older bitches.

With a c-section, there is pain from the surgery, and the puppies will be right down there digging where the stitches are. That is tougher on a bitch than natural birth.
Thank you for the explanation. What I really want to know is, do bitches choose to go into heat because they like/want to be pregnant? And by the same token, can they choose to not go into heat if they don't like being pregnant? That statement martemchik posted really was so thought provoking!! I never even knew it was a possibility for females of any species to choose to go into heat? I think people have sort of answered this? But it just didn't seem like a direct/ literal yes or no answer so Im still unsure?
 

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Thank you for the explanation. What I really want to know is, do bitches choose to go into heat because they like/want to be pregnant? And by the same token, can they choose to not go into heat if they don't like being pregnant? That statement martemchik posted really was so thought provoking!! I never even knew it was a possibility for females of any species to choose to go into heat? I think people have sort of answered this? But it just didn't seem like a direct/ literal yes or no answer so Im still unsure?
If a bitch is healthy, she will go into heat. I have not known any to not go into heat due to age, but I believe that could be a possibility. If she is healthy and is bred when in standing heat she will probably become pregnant.

A bitch's instinct is to breed when she is in standing heat. I do not know how she can possibly connect that to the whelping process or having puppies. But her instinct will also drive her to clean and care for her puppies, some are much better than others.

Some bitches can be excellent dams, but will be ready for their pups to go home at eight weeks. Others take motherhood to a whole other level. They play with their puppies and they enjoy their company, long after the eight weeks. This is not just instincts, but preference. Dogs are complex critters with instincts, preferences, who can create and maintain strong bonds with creatures of other species. They can be trained, and trained to disobey if it is unsafe (seeing eye dogs). They have both choices and instinct, preference and instinct, training and instinct. The great lie is that bitches suffer through motherhood, and are forced to be bred, forced to have puppies, forced to raise puppies as though it is some terrible, awful ordeal. There are many things we subject dogs to that are far more irritating, frustrating, stressful than having a litter of pups. Like cramping them into a crate all day, or taking some dogs to the vet. I have never had a bitch loose a tooth over having a litter of puppies, but I have had a bitch break a tooth trying to get out of a crate.

I don't believe bitches need to be bred to be complete. But breeding bitches is not some evil thing, not to the bitch herself. It could be bad for the breed, if you are breeding poor temperament or health, and it may be bad for pet population. But it is not bad for the bitch. That is simply a lie.
 

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BARBIElovesSAILOR: you may think your outrage and vitriol is helping to deter people from breeding older females, but really your fear mongering only does a disservice because people get fed up with the righteous spiel and go on to do their own thing. By spreading myth and using scare tactics, you do the opposite of what you wish to do.

If this bitch has been bred before and whelped well, if she comes from a dam line that is known to have healthy litters at older ages, if OP has the experience and foresight to prepare for a riskier pregnancy, if this is a planned breeding with a goal in mind, then it is not for us to say what age is too old.

Take a look at Palme Wildsteigerland - this female has had about 12 litters, worked the farm when she was over 10, and lived a long healthy life.
V Palme vom Wildsteiger Land

On the other hand, there are 3 year old females that have wonky heats, can't breed naturally, and need artificial help every step of the way. In no way is a younger female better able to handle a pregnancy than an older one just based on age.

It depends on the female ultimately.

This female was recently bred to Drago v Patriot - she will be 10 this fall. Her last litter with Drago was when she was 8, and she produced a healthy litter of 12 pups.
Bonny von der Hagenmühle ? working-dog

I'm not entirely sure what gives you the experience and expertise to make such sweeping judgements on which females are allowed to be bred.
 

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Because I rescued him?. Or I guess I could have just left him wasting away, starving, in someone's backyard the rest of his life? I think not... I have rescued other dog breeds... This dog is a gsd. And what? If there were no more gsd's in the world, I would move on to the next breed of dog that needs help. There will always be dogs that need help. Good question though!! Thanks sunflower :)
Interesting.
Because Sailor was a GSD, then you chose to get another GSD.

Both purebred, products of breeding with human intervention.


You say you are against breeding, yet benefit from it.
 

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"Actually, assuming she's still going into heat, that's nature saying "breed me." If the dog didn't want to be bred, she wouldn't go into heat".

I'm sorry, I can't stop laughing...last week there was some dialogue on an episode of "Girls" that I'd never heard before and I can't get it out of my head, it seems to apply here...

"Bitches be cray"...

thinking of a bitch having a heat because she "wants" to be bred is close to the most hysterical thing I've ever heard. The rest of the discussion...not gonna touch it with a 10 foot pole except to say that the only people who should be breeding a senior bitch (or breeding any bitch actually), are those who would not have to ask any questions on a message board about if it's okay.

ps...and I wanna say I'm havin' some trouble finding BarbieLoves' "outrage and vitrol". Seems more like just a differing opinion that, considering the OP's apparent inexperience, might be based in reality??? But I confess to reading the thread quickly, so maybe I just missed the o&v.
 

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The OP may be more experienced with breeding than with message boards. If he were more experienced with message boards, he would have created a thread asking breeders when they retire their dams and sires and for what reasons.

But, we don't know the OP at all. In general on this site, we want more information about everything except anything to do with breeding. If you are here at all, for whatever reason, you probably aren't a good candidate to breed dogs, but you are better than anyone else out there for everything else.
 

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This is super ridiculous, I mean... OP why? Like why do you want to breed an 8 year old dog? What is your purpose? What is it like is it the money? Is it because she is some super spectacular show or protection sport champion that you feel the need to pass down her genes? Everyone else, can shut it. I don't want anyone else's responses, I just want to hear from the OP. That's all. OP: Dogs shouldn't have to go through all of this for our pleasure or our finances. Dogs never asked to be forced to be bred at 8 years old. I doubt she wants this. How about just love her and care for her in her old age and let her be. Darnn!
You know what... I was just thinking about what martemchik said and... I mean, can bitches really choose to come into heat if they want to get pregnant that bad? Lol... I might be really ignorant on this. Maybe this is why I feel so against this/ breeding because I always thought, dogs don't necessarily want this, it's just what humans want, BUT!!! if a dog CHOOSES to go into heat because she really wants to be pregnant then shoot! I STAND corrected! I will apologize to everyone supporting breeders and go on about my merry way and just focus on other threads. I just sincerely, honestly, have NeVER heard of this phenomena !?,I didn't know bitches could choose this. That's kind of amazing! Haha! You learn something new everyday! Female humans got the short end of the stick :-(
ps...and I wanna say I'm havin' some trouble finding BarbieLoves' "outrage and vitrol". Seems more like just a differing opinion that, considering the OP's apparent inexperience, might be based in reality??? But I confess to reading the thread quickly, so maybe I just missed the o&v.
Perhaps slow down and read the thread to understand the nuances? :)

Do people with simple differing opinions curse, make sweeping statements, attack others, and dictate who may or may not post on the thread? Forgive me if I'm mistaken ;)
 

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okee-dokee, I just read every word you quoted, and read it slowly and carefully, and I don't see the curse, the sweeping statements (except where somebody else makes the comment about breeding relative to her (BarbieLoves), falling in love with the breed), or any "dictating" who "may or may not" post in the thread, I see where BarbieLoves is "not interested" in hearing from others but from the OP relative to their reasoning, which falls under the category of personal interest not dictating, which truthfully, I was kind of wondering about too, although I would not have chosen the phrase "everyone else can shut it", which is the strongest outrage and vitrol I see in her posts. Oh, okay, the stuff about bitches "choosing"...I read as kinda tongue in cheek, but truthfully...in a way I thought the same thing. And Sue, come ON, nobody with any kind of breeding experience is gonna ASK these kinds of questions. Seriously?

Carry on...
 

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There you have it. But you are against breeding.
Thank you for the opportunity sunflowers. I will explain myself for the last time about my feelings for the breed. I love gsd's . But if no one ever bred them? Where would I be, what would. I do? I would be just fine. Probably rescuing some other breed or any other mix-mutt. And I would most likely be on a forum for this breeds or mixes. So? I love german shepherds, but the world would still go round if they ep ever existed. I'm not for breeding them , but all for rescuing, though I will say breeding dogs is legal in this country! Just like carrying firearms, eating animals, freedom of speech. Etc... Many other topics. While some people may not agree with certain laws in the country, if they are legal there is not a darn thing we can do about it until laws change. So will there be breeders? Heck yea! There are some breeders who care about the dog or what they are doing. There are some breeders that don't give a lick and just want to make money. Both are legal. I have more respect for someone who is responsibly breeding, but for me, if responsible breeders and irresponsible breeders of gsd never existed and there were no gsd's I would be just dandy, and find some other cause to help with. The end. Hope that answers your Q?
 
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