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Discussion Starter #1
We have a young female and a 7 month old male puppy, Working Line GSDs. Both sleep uncrated in our bedroom.

The male wakes up first and gets restless. This is not a middle-of-the-night thing, typically, more like 5:45-6:30 AM. It doesn't get first light here until after 7 now, and with COVID, honestly, I go in a little later and my wife works from home. So she only has to get out of bed, get some coffee, and sign on in the guest bedroom/office. We work longish hours, eat relatively late, and except on days with meetings or personal appearances scheduled early, we don't roll out of bed at 5:45 AM. Or even 6:30.

The male is more inclined than the female to simply hop on the bed and snuggle for a while if we don't get up right away.

Trouble is, he weighs well over 70 lbs. And while he is not clumsy in general, when he lies down to sleep, he drops like a big puppy wherever he feels like it.
So he might jump up and lie right across either me or my wife for a little bit, then move to another spot.

Usually it wakes me up, because the sensation is a little like a sack of cement just got tossed on the bed.
But I'm a little concerned he could jump up, lie across one of us in a manner that cuts off breathing, and . . . yikes.

Maybe a king-sized bed would give him a bigger landing pad.

We did crate them at first, but our female sleeps through the night nicely outside the crate. And, we'd need an upstairs and downstairs crate, because the crate big enough for him to sleep in has to be partially disassembled and folded up to get through the door.

Anyone heard any horror stories about people being accidentally smothered in their sleep by their large dog? I'm seriously a little concerned.
Or is it safe to assume one would wake up and start flailing away? We have had 130-160 lb. Newfoundlands in the past, but they did not have the hops this 7 month old possesses, and preferred sleeping on the floor.
 

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Unless you are heavily medicated, I can't believe that you wouldn't wake up in a situation where you can't breathe. When CO2 builds up in your bloodstream, your body goes in to an extreme panic, such as drowning. This isn't something that one can possibly sleep through.

That's why carbon monoxide is so dangerous. It doesn't elicit the same panic response as carbon dioxide.
 

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I know you're not joking but seriously?
"But I'm a little concerned he could jump up, lie across one of us in a manner that cuts off breathing, and . . . yikes."

There is less than a zero percent chance of this.

We also have 2 uncrated GSD that sleep in our bedroom but neither are allowed on the bed (older one pops his paws up in the morning for pets). When and why did you allow it to first happen and why don't you correct the action so at least that part is not an issue? My dogs will stay almost comatose from 11:00 pm to 7:00 am and won't even play with each other unless I'm up. The young one (9 months now) has tried to put his head and bump my feet a few times but I corrected that and now he waits like the 6 year old. He then tried lying down on his bead beside mine but HARD against the bed to knock it by "mistake". I have also been awake but not moving and caught him quietly mumbling to try and wake me up - their deviously smart lol
 

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Impossible. But if you are so concerned, crate the dog.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
When did I allow this? First, the dogs are NOT playing with each other in the room all night or any of the night, that is nowhere described above, because it doesn't happen. Second, surprise of surprises, his ability to jump higher and higher has coincided with him reaching a substantially heavier weight. Go figure. He wakes up, his stomach clock tells him it is time to eat, and maybe poop, but not so critically so that he won't accept a little snuggle time with two sleeping humans. He probably does paw my wife's side of the bed first, and if she doesn't answer, up he jumps.

For the record, they get corrected when they do something my wife and I don't want them to do. But, at the risk of being gross here, in my experience if a puppy really, really needs to go out in the morning, or ****-fire, even in the dead of fricking night, I don't want any puppy or dog for that matter to be comatose or uncommunicative, and then slink off and :poop: the rug because, well, they didn't want to wake me up. I would approximately 10,000,000 x prefer to get up and lose a little sleep rather than have to clean up a mess. That's just me, but I outright own that part of me beyond any debate, argument, correction, advice rr deference to any dog trainers, from Ivan Balabanov back to the original owner of the first Rin Tin Tin. SOOOOO, I prefer not to ignore the puppy, then have to clean up puppy s*@t, and that has not happened for a really GOOD long time.

Now, only very recently, he has morphed from nosing or pawing to hauling off and jumping on the bed.

Easy, peasy: he's big, he's agile, and prone to splay out across your body when asleep in ways other dogs dating back through 31 years of marriage have not. As to them getting on the bed, my wife and I have been sleeping with a Cocker, a Golden,and a previous GSD. Most jumped down of their own accord when some transferred human body heat made the sleeping spot uncomfortable. None actually laid across you. Some professions-- actuary comes to mind, though I am not one--tend to think up things that can happen and ponder whether one should worry about them. From the consensus of soothsayers here, I gather this is a really stupid question. But other stupid questions have likely been asked from time to time. Hey Col. Custer, should we take those Gatling guns along even though they are heavy and a PITA to transport? Nah, stupid question, Mr. Quartermaster, but be sure to pack all the single shot rifles you can find. Hey Forest Service, should we maybe trim out some of this underbrush? Nah, don't worry about it. It sets off those taller Ponderosa pines nicely. Do we really need to sit on the runway twiddling our thumbs while they de-ice the wings on these planes? And so on. That's me, I think up and ask stupid questions sometimes.;)
 

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Discussion Starter #6


Not sure if the link took, but if a housecat wakes you up, I'm guessing a dog would. But I'm also guessing if the pressure of a cat draped across your neck could make you feel you were suffocating , then a dog around 80##. . .
 

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When did I allow this? ;)

Hey Squid, this is where you allowed it.
"The male is more inclined than the female to simply hop on the bed and snuggle for a while if we don't get up right away."

I wasn't suggesting that your dogs are playing just making a comment that mine don't. They've been taught that my sleeping time is their sleeping time. You can see from my example that my 10 month old occasionally will test that unyielding boundary. Like yours, he drops like a 100 lb sack of cement (hey he actually is 100 lbs:rolleyes: ) and I can't imagine that on my bed in the middle of the night.

And no one is suggesting that you should let your dog poop in the house if you don't feel like getting up.

Yes, the idea of being suffocated by your dog seems a little silly but no need to make up sarcastic events to make a point. People who ask for opinions and not being able to provide all possible details need to grow a tiny layer of thicker skins when the returning opinions are provided without all the prior aforementioned details.

I personally, would correct the dog from jumping on the bed and direct it to its own bed where you'll all be more comfortable but that's just me and you evidently have other ideas of what's acceptable. Yes they'll occasionally lay right against you, over you, bump against you, make you hot, sometimes dirty or smelly, occasionally a flea or a tick.....but won't smother you in your sleep.
 

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When did I allow this? First, the dogs are NOT playing with each other in the room all night or any of the night, that is nowhere described above, because it doesn't happen. Second, surprise of surprises, his ability to jump higher and higher has coincided with him reaching a substantially heavier weight. Go figure. He wakes up, his stomach clock tells him it is time to eat, and maybe poop, but not so critically so that he won't accept a little snuggle time with two sleeping humans. He probably does paw my wife's side of the bed first, and if she doesn't answer, up he jumps.

For the record, they get corrected when they do something my wife and I don't want them to do. But, at the risk of being gross here, in my experience if a puppy really, really needs to go out in the morning, or ***-fire, even in the dead of fricking night, I don't want any puppy or dog for that matter to be comatose or uncommunicative, and then slink off and :poop: the rug because, well, they didn't want to wake me up. I would approximately 10,000,000 x prefer to get up and lose a little sleep rather than have to clean up a mess. That's just me, but I outright own that part of me beyond any debate, argument, correction, advice rr deference to any dog trainers, from Ivan Balabanov back to the original owner of the first Rin Tin Tin. SOOOOO, I prefer not to ignore the puppy, then have to clean up puppy s@t, and that has not happened for a really GOOD long time.

Now, only very recently, he has morphed from nosing or pawing to hauling off and jumping on the bed.

Easy, peasy: he's big, he's agile, and prone to splay out across your body when asleep in ways other dogs dating back through 31 years of marriage have not. As to them getting on the bed, my wife and I have been sleeping with a Cocker, a Golden,and a previous GSD. Most jumped down of their own accord when some transferred human body heat made the sleeping spot uncomfortable. None actually laid across you. Some professions-- actuary comes to mind, though I am not one--tend to think up things that can happen and ponder whether one should worry about them. From the consensus of soothsayers here, I gather this is a really stupid question. But other stupid questions have likely been asked from time to time. Hey Col. Custer, should we take those Gatling guns along even though they are heavy and a PITA to transport? Nah, stupid question, Mr. Quartermaster, but be sure to pack all the single shot rifles you can find. Hey Forest Service, should we maybe trim out some of this underbrush? Nah, don't worry about it. It sets off those taller Ponderosa pines nicely. Do we really need to sit on the runway twiddling our thumbs while they de-ice the wings on these planes? And so on. That's me, I think up and ask stupid questions sometimes.;)
Wow
 

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Wow, indeed. I'm not particularly thin skinned. I'd quit my day job if I were. But after the second or third post came across suggesting I was some kind of nut to even ask this, well . . . I've seen plenty of more thin-skinned behavior among many, many posters on this forum. Indeed, I've seen those go on, and on, for pages on pages, to the point people get cautioned by the moderator, and the OP's original question gets lost.

Yeah, there is a chemical that acts on your brain and tends to wake you up if you too much CO2. And sometimes it does not work. By using the modifier "normally," the doctors in the study linked below imply, "not always." For people with sleep apnea or other sleep disorders, it apparently doesn't work. https://medicine.uiowa.edu/content/specific-neurons-trigger-waking-due-inhaled-co2

If some person with sleep apnea is inclined to sleep with their large dog or small cat, I'd maybe advise that they don't. Since I do not have sleep disorders, I'm fairly encouraged that I would wake up from some dream where I thought I was drowning, or some such thing.

He's a large dog. Not 100 lbs., but not 20 lbs. or 40 or 55 either. Certainly several times larger than the cat in the link above. I'm not talking about the dog bumping against me, laying against me, making me smelly, etc. I'm talking about if he (or just his front leg) draped across my trachea, or my wife's, with neither him nor us realizing it. Most dogs I've had who chose to sleep in the bed tend to react if you shift, or signal some discomfort, and most tend to get up against you rather than draped all over you. His behavior is qualitatively different than four previous dogs and the other GSD we currently have. Instead of balling himself up or seeping against your body, he just lies down wherever. And when he's asleep, he's good and asleep. That was what informed the question, but, enough already.

It’s called a crate, try it it just might work.
I was wondering what those three things were in my home.:D As WNGD picked up before we got on this thin-skinned stuff, they sleep outside the crate happily and peacefully. Put him in a crate, yeah, he'd tolerate it for hours, maybe 3/4 of the night, but at some point earlier than I'd like, he'd get too warm and cramped and whine to be let out. I could put a fan on him, but we already have the AC and the ceiling fan going, and my personal fan for white noise, and I don't want to subsidize the power company any more than that. No sarcasm there, just truth. Also not enough outlets to put a fan where the crate would need to go.

If I decide to correct him, I will. As a general rule, I don't get too wound up over the dogs getting on the bed. He's the largest dog I've had that actually would jump on the bed. Instead of making himself smaller, he stretches out all over the place and all over me and my wife if he so chooses. Maybe I'll change my policy.

Hey Squid, this is where you allowed it.
"The male is more inclined than the female to simply hop on the bed and snuggle for a while if we don't get up right away."
(emphasis added)

I saw what you did there, but that's OK. It's the internet. And really, I'm not thin-skinned. I am also not inclined to pop a wheely on a Hayabusa at 189 mph in a school zone, as some Squids are apt to do, according to the urban dictionary. I picked the name based on a Nickolodeon character my kids used to watch.

Yes, he does show an inclination, and I suppose when I don't sit bolt upright out of REM sleep or even early morning dozing and admonish him, or give him a collar pop, one could say I'm allowing it. But he does it early in the morning, when I'm still asleep. Usually the thud awakens me and I tend to go back to sleep. This is not a matter of him jumping up there when it is time to go to bed, and I'm still semi-alert and ready to dispense corrections. He doesn't do that, he starts out on the floor.

Sometimes, when the "recommended reading" directs you to older posts of interest, I see some names I don't recognize, sometimes with 1000s of posts and wonder where they went. Now, I kinda get it. Sometimes, I suppose, your dog dies and you move on. Other times, you just post a question, and yeah, wow.
 

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I was not being sarcastic though it seemed that way. What I don’t understand is you like the dog on the bed why complain about the dog on the bed then?
 

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Wow, indeed. I'm not particularly thin skinned. I'd quit my day job if I were. But after the second or third post came across suggesting I was some kind of nut to even ask this, well . . . I've seen plenty of more thin-skinned behavior among many, many posters on this forum. Indeed, I've seen those go on, and on, for pages on pages, to the point people get cautioned by the moderator, and the OP's original question gets lost.

Yeah, there is a chemical that acts on your brain and tends to wake you up if you too much CO2. And sometimes it does not work. By using the modifier "normally," the doctors in the study linked below imply, "not always." For people with sleep apnea or other sleep disorders, it apparently doesn't work. https://medicine.uiowa.edu/content/specific-neurons-trigger-waking-due-inhaled-co2

If some person with sleep apnea is inclined to sleep with their large dog or small cat, I'd maybe advise that they don't. Since I do not have sleep disorders, I'm fairly encouraged that I would wake up from some dream where I thought I was drowning, or some such thing.

He's a large dog. Not 100 lbs., but not 20 lbs. or 40 or 55 either. Certainly several times larger than the cat in the link above. I'm not talking about the dog bumping against me, laying against me, making me smelly, etc. I'm talking about if he (or just his front leg) draped across my trachea, or my wife's, with neither him nor us realizing it. Most dogs I've had who chose to sleep in the bed tend to react if you shift, or signal some discomfort, and most tend to get up against you rather than draped all over you. His behavior is qualitatively different than four previous dogs and the other GSD we currently have. Instead of balling himself up or seeping against your body, he just lies down wherever. And when he's asleep, he's good and asleep. That was what informed the question, but, enough already.


I was wondering what those three things were in my home.:D As WNGD picked up before we got on this thin-skinned stuff, they sleep outside the crate happily and peacefully. Put him in a crate, yeah, he'd tolerate it for hours, maybe 3/4 of the night, but at some point earlier than I'd like, he'd get too warm and cramped and whine to be let out. I could put a fan on him, but we already have the AC and the ceiling fan going, and my personal fan for white noise, and I don't want to subsidize the power company any more than that. No sarcasm there, just truth. Also not enough outlets to put a fan where the crate would need to go.

If I decide to correct him, I will. As a general rule, I don't get too wound up over the dogs getting on the bed. He's the largest dog I've had that actually would jump on the bed. Instead of making himself smaller, he stretches out all over the place and all over me and my wife if he so chooses. Maybe I'll change my policy.

(emphasis added)

I saw what you did there, but that's OK. It's the internet. And really, I'm not thin-skinned. I am also not inclined to pop a wheely on a Hayabusa at 189 mph in a school zone, as some Squids are apt to do, according to the urban dictionary. I picked the name based on a Nickolodeon character my kids used to watch.

Yes, he does show an inclination, and I suppose when I don't sit bolt upright out of REM sleep or even early morning dozing and admonish him, or give him a collar pop, one could say I'm allowing it. But he does it early in the morning, when I'm still asleep. Usually the thud awakens me and I tend to go back to sleep. This is not a matter of him jumping up there when it is time to go to bed, and I'm still semi-alert and ready to dispense corrections. He doesn't do that, he starts out on the floor.

Sometimes, when the "recommended reading" directs you to older posts of interest, I see some names I don't recognize, sometimes with 1000s of posts and wonder where they went. Now, I kinda get it. Sometimes, I suppose, your dog dies and you move on. Other times, you just post a question, and yeah, wow.
Or sometimes you get too busy to spend much time on the forum :)

In my experience, I have never heard of anyone suffocating because their dog was in their bed. It goes against my personal experience with oxygen deprivation. It seems you have done your research.

I apologize if my wow offended.
 
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Mine has woken me up in a sweat before when he decided it was a great night to lay all over me. he is a big dog. Unless it's freezing out you can get partially cooked under a 90lb wolf.

But I love him, he is the most physically affectionate dog I've ever had. I love snuggling with him.
 

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For most of my adult life I've lived with large dogs (ranging between 140 and 160 pds each). Guaranteed you'd wake up if/when one of these climbed or jumped on the bed, or rolled around and/or tried to hog the comforter. But, I've never heard of someone being smothered to death by a dog. I have heard several owners fantasize aloud about the reverse, however.

So, you don't like being awakened at o dark hundred? Teach him not to do it. First, teach him not to come on the bed without an explicit invitation from you/your wife. It's easy to do, it just requires utter consistency. Just remove him from the bed after each and every attempt he makes (e.g., "Nope! Off!! Bed!!"). No exceptions. Best if you can correct him before he jumps up, but even if it's after the fact, correct, remove and go back to sleep.

Try this for a couple of weeks and let us know how it's going. Once you've [g] mastered this issue, come back and get suggestions for teaching bed manners and crate training.
 

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Tough crowd, eh?

My Jupiter is my alarm clock. He's mellowed a bit, but he has woken me before 6 AM for nearly every day of the last two years. I sleep on a loft bed and I wake when he first puts his big mitt on the first stair (I'm a light sleeper).

I can find many instances of dogs killing their owners, but not by suffocation. I have never heard of such a thing, and neither has Mr. Google, although he has sadly heard of many dogs being suffocated by plastic bags and such.

It seems like you have two options.

1. Training
2. Management

My experience is #2 is far more realistic in nearly all behavior situations (boo, boo, boo!). In this case, that probably means crate. A doggie gate or little fence that partitions part of the room might send him the message: sometimes dogs honor barriers they can easily traverse.
 

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My calling you Squid had nothing to do with anything more than a nickname. But come to think of it, Sqidward is my favorite Sponge Bob character. Sometimes when you're looking to take offense, everything is offensive.

Anyway, I think we've established that it's highly unlikely to impossible for your dog to suffocate you in a dead sleep. See what I did there that time? I think we can move on from there.

hen my pup was young and first out of his crate, I wanted to keep him apart from my 5 year old GSD. A 2X8' piece of plywood separated the bedroom below the bed and worked like a charm. Maybe try that (higher?) to separate him from the ability to climb on the bed. Unless you're encouraging it then all bets are off....except whether you'll be smothered by dog flesh :)

Hey, post a pic of your dog(s) I bet he's a beauty.
 
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