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Just curious what a bi-color pup looks like as opposed to a sable or black and tan.
 

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Angela... wouldn't you say the first one is a blk-tan also??? It has some brown on the face and as far as I understand, a true bi-color only has brown on their legs/feet, nowhere else?
 

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i think your right paivi
 

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Bi-Color puppies usually have just the slightest bit of tan on their toes when they are born. The black usually extends down their legs and gives them tar-heels.

Black and Tans show more tan than bi-colors, but how much usually depends on the extent of their saddle and mask. (Are they going to be a blanket back Black and Tan? Or a small saddle?)

Sable puppies are the easiest to identify because they don't look really black on their backs...they look kind of gray or tan. The black on a sable starts to really come in when they get their adult coats.

I only have pictures of my sable puppy. You can really see, that while he has the black mask, the sides and back don't really look black.
At 5 weeks


And at 9 weeks.
 

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Her sire is a bicolor, Hardy. They can have black on the face and chest.

With the pics of the blanket black and tans, their tan extends further up the arm.

Blanket bl/tan from same litter as the 2 bl/tan pups above at 2 yrs of age:


Sire of Gala at 5 months:




My sch3 female before she died was a bicolor. She had tan on the chest as well:
 

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I think the line between a dark black and tan and a bi-color can very thin and the 2 are easy to mistake. This site does a good job of explaining the differences and giving illustrations.

http://www.shawlein.com/The_Standard/07_Colour_&_Pigment/Colour_&_Pigment.html

"Very dark B&Ts are often advertised as bicolours, and can have heads, necks and bodies that are nearly solid black. However, they usually show some tan shading about the base of the ears, and have few or no black hairs down the pasterns, or on the toes or hocks.

Typically, the bicolour is a black dog with tan points much the same as a doberman. It is in fact the same gene. A very dark one with a strong black mask and much extension of the black may appear to be solid black, with a black undercoat and only some tan shading on the feet."
 

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Here is a puppy picture of Ivy's sister Izzie. She is a bi-color:




Then here is a picture of another one of Ivy's sisters. Her name is Ivanna and she is a sable. It is hard to tell in this picture but she is. She looks like her mom-Zada:




Momma Zada:



This is a bi-color pup as well (this one isn't related to Ivy):



Sorry the pics are so large
 

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Originally Posted By: SuperpupAngela... wouldn't you say the first one is a blk-tan also??? It has some brown on the face and as far as I understand, a true bi-color only has brown on their legs/feet, nowhere else?
Nope. Bi-colors can have some small tan markings on the chest and face, not just the legs.
 

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From same site:
3. Rich Bicolour, Melanistic Bicolour, faded bicolour.
Typically, the bicolour is a black dog with tan points much the same as a doberman. It is in fact the same gene. A very dark one with a strong black mask and much extension of the black may appear to be solid black, with a black undercoat and only some tan shading on the feet. Theoretically, bicolours always show tan around the vent, but I have seen a virtually black dog with just enough tan around the vent (and between the toes) to suspect that it was a bicolour, but not enough to be sure. However, a pale bicolour can look strikingly like a black sable, showing much black over a light grey undercoat, with tan or grey over the nape of the neck and along the harness lines, and black markings on the legs and feet. These dogs have the genetics for fading of the black mantle, and while they can still appear dark to the eye, will produce colour fading.

the "rich" bicolor shown is what most people consider a bicolor and not a bl/tan.

Pups with saddles will get them as the get older as the color will fade into a saddle if thats what they genetically were born with. You would need to know the parents and what was behind them.

Sables can get darker or lighter. Depends.
 

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Originally Posted By: mjb03You do not know you have a saddle pup until adult? Also sables get darker as they get older?
I think you can pretty much guess the patterning on your dog based on the parents and genetics, (obviously a puppy already showing a lot of tan and saddle won't grow up to be a blanket back) but yes, I don't think you can tell the full extent of the change in a puppy's coat until it's done growing.

And yes, traditionally sables darken up as they get older. I have seen some who fade on the face, but the body does seem to darken up, I think most noticeably from puppy to young adult.
 
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