An alpha roll is a forced activity. If he's happily rolling over and you're not forcing him there and to stay there physically, then there's nothing wrong and it's not an alpha roll.
That sounds right to me. When Niko and Rosa play, they often get each other on their backs. They don't usually give raspberries though...An alpha roll is a forced activity. If he's happily rolling over and you're not forcing him there and to stay there physically, then there's nothing wrong and it's not an alpha roll.
Alpha rolls are not really dangerous if done properly. Lately there’s been a fascist campaign by a bunch of snobs that don’t know much about canines that claim that Alpha rolls are inherently dangerous. Anyone that has any significant knowledge of canines know that alpha rolls are part of normal healthy pack hierarchy (whether it be dogs at the dog park or wolves in the wild). Alpha rolls is one of the main things that keeps peace within the pack. If you have a pack of dogs and if they don’t exhibit proper social behavior like Alpha rolls then you probably have a very dangerous situation ( like sitting on a keg of dynamite). Alpha rolls done properly do no physical or mental harm; it’s a way of establishing rank without becoming violent. Alpha roll is an alpha roll whether it be voluntary or by force. I’ve been raising GSD for 40 years and have observed wolves and coyotes in the wild for 40 years and can tell you for a fact that alpha rolls are natural and part of healthy socialization.I just read something that makes me wonder.... but I was reading leerburg's site and it appears I've been engaging in a very dangerous alpha roll. It's hard to think of it as being dangerous, however, since he seems to love it.
This is true; you can't believe everything someone spouts out and must use your own common sense to weed through other's verbal nonsense.People should know they can’t believe everything they read (whether it be in a book or on the Internet)
You’re in denial. If you don’t salute properly people can get injured also. If you snap to salute and you’re not a proper distance away from someone you could poke the person you are saluting in the eye or yourself in the eye. But that doesn’t mean that saluting is inherently dangerous.So should we believe you doggone?
I don't believe an alpha roll is the same as saluting.
Many people who do this may be in the fit of anger ~ then it is in a harmful way or for the wrong reason. Especially if you have a dog with an unsteady temperament and doesn't recover from things easily, it can do much damage to a dog with no confidence that is reacting out of fear(then gets alpha-rolled).
As you wrote, bullies ~ those are the ones that maybe people are saying it IS harmful.
There may be times and places for it(though I don't know when), but just to do it to show who's boss is not fair to the dog.
So it really isn't urban legend if some of the ones doing it are harming their dogs, mentally.
My pack is fine without me showing them who is the boss by alpha rolling them regulary to keep the structure.
That’s one of the more important times to use a alpha roll. There are always some risks and dangers. Sure there is a remote possibility you might get injured or the dog might get injured doing an alpha roll; however I think it’s more dangerous to allow a dog to be excessively aggressive or dominant. There are always some exceptions to the rule; you probably don’t want to alpha roll a senior or injured dog. A dog that is fearful and/or insecure it best to do it in a gentle but secure fashion.I think when the alpha roll is considered dangerous is when you are trying to force it on an aggressive or dominant dog.
Do you have a link to the article? It sounds a little exaggerated. Leaning over a dog is considered an act of trying to dominate but with most pets, it isn't a reason to be concerned. I would never do it to a strange dog that you do not know but is certainly ok with Lycan who you know accepts it and doesn't see it as a challenge.I was concerned because it was sounding as if any time you were leaning over your dog it could be considered an alpha roll and trigger an attack.
I can literally lay on top of my 7 yr old dog while she is on her back with her legs in the air. Often, if I am laying on the floor, she will let me lay my head on her chest and rub her belly. I don't look at it as me trying to dominate her, I see it as she trusts me and knows nothing bad is going to happen to her if she is in that position.Thanks for the feedback. I was concerned because it was sounding as if any time you were leaning over your dog it could be considered an alpha roll and trigger an attack. It didn't SEEM like that would be an issue-Lycan is such a clown, he flops over like a sack of potatos at the drop of a hat and he loves to be played with. Um...(scuff scuff) I know the blowing raspberries on his tummy sounds silly but he really loves it.
:rofl:The alpha in a wolf pack hardly ever resorts to putting shock collars on his pack. Oh sure maybe he'll think about buying a shock collar while he's at the wolf supply house, but then he remembers he doesn't have thumbs so signing the credit card bill becomes an issue. He must alas, resort to the alpha roll. No prongs, no leash pops, no shock collars....go figure.
Ok, here I am at work, being a little sneaky and reading through this thread and then....BAM! I bust out laughing out loud and blow my entire cover.... :spittingcoffee:....
The alpha in a wolf pack hardly ever resorts to putting shock collars on his pack. Oh sure maybe he'll think about buying a shock collar while he's at the wolf supply house, but then he remembers he doesn't have thumbs so signing the credit card bill becomes an issue. He must alas, resort to the alpha roll. No prongs, no leash pops, no shock collars....go figure.
the OP was talking about blowing rasberries on the pups belly.You’re in denial. If you don’t salute properly people can get injured also. If you snap to salute and you’re not a proper distance away from someone you could poke the person you are saluting in the eye or yourself in the eye. But that doesn’t mean that saluting is inherently dangerous.
I think things need to be kept in perspective and that all angles should be taken into consideration. Analogy. Regulators think that requiring airliners and airline passengers to keep babies in safety seats increases safety. In shallow analysis of the statistics when you’re in an airplane crash the survival rate is better with the safety seat. However with deeper analysis requiring airliners and airline passengers to keep babies in safety seats would actually likely increase the number of injuries and deaths. You have to analyze and consider all of the causes and effects. The increased costs to airline passengers they would have to pay for extra seats for their infants would be cost prohibitive for many people; so many parents would end up traveling in a less safe method; such as by automobile, bus or train; where injury and fatality is more likely. So legislation that is under the guise of improving safety; is likely to decrease public safety.
I’ve heard many people claim that they don’t need to Alpha roll their dog. However the vast majority of them are unruly and unsafe and dangerous. Not all dogs are the same so not all dogs require the same type of training and discipline. I think you are likely to be like many others and are simply in denial.
I’ve had many idiots in denial, lecture me about using alpha rolls, and the use of shock collars. Yet my dog is relatively obedient, intelligent, mentally stable, friendly, and brave; yet their dogs are food/water/toy aggressive, run away, disobedient, fearful, dominant, runs out in traffic, chases traffic and pedestrians, chases animals without permission, etc…. Yet almost every time their dog is getting into trouble they blame someone else instead of their dog and themselves. These idiots like to make up stupid rules; like balls and Frisbees shouldn’t be at the dog park; dogs shouldn’t run, bark and wrestle at a dog park. They insist that no other dogs go near their dog when their dog is drinking; because they allow their dog to be water aggressive; since they are denial they tried to shift the blame onto other people so it’s your fault if their dog becomes water aggressive. These types of people are nurturing bad behavior and are enabling dangerous situations.