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The breeder of Winnal's dog is NOT the sort you'd want as a mentor. There are some very good working line dogs in the pedigree, though, starting with the grandfather of his dog.

Thanks, Winnal! That one's going to take you awhile to read... :D Coat colour genetics are complicated, and I don't pretend to completely understand them myself. I've given you some good resources for them, though.
 

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You want to feel like your dog is from 'champion lines' and quality for breeding, would you be able to accept if she weren't? Plenty of us here do not have breeding worthy dogs, there's many here who don't even have purebred dogs but GSD mixes, it doesn't define how we feel about our dogs.

People here just want you to be smart about this. You have to realize that with your current knowledge and the inexperienced questions you've been asking, you're still years from being ready to be a reputable breeder, you likely won't even be ready until after your bitches breeding years.
 

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I was thinking about titling a dog, and how I had no idea, when I got Carly, how long it could take. I know the OP isn't going to do AKC conformation, but it took us a solid year from winning that first point to getting a championship on Carly, who is a nice bitch. I couldn't afford to show every weekend, and even if I could've, it's just not that easy. I spent roughly $5000 showing her. She was 2 months shy of her 3rd birthday when I finished her. I have a mentor and my mentor's mentor, and I still know next to nothing, lol.

Winnal, it's a process. A long process. Enjoy your girl, and learn with her. What's her name btw?
 

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Discussion Starter #45 (Edited)
I mean like whatever you guys are saying is not even based on a concrete time in the first place. Unless you're saying it's gunna take me 5+ years to "learn and do" all the things I need to, then explain to me where you came up with such a number. Exactly, out of the blue. And if I do miss it, then so what? Let time decide that, not you assume it.

I have a SchH3 female who started greying at 1 1/2 yrs. old. The greying is a separate gene, as is masking. I also had a bi-colored czech import bitch, Bena od Volfu, who had no greying at 13 yrs.

The age limit on breeding a bitch has many factors involved. Condition, quality ( structural, pedigree, work ethic, titles), and mental age. Some dogs are aged at 6, some not until 12. Breeding an older bitch also depends on previous breeding. If the bitch is aged and maiden, I would not breed her. Many bitches have difficulty supporting a male, if not in top condition. My SchH3 bitch is almost 10 (Nov.13, 1999). She is presently bred, however, she is a bitch who has an outstanding pedigree, work ethic, hardness, trainability and has produced very well. She had no problem supporting a very large male. IMHO, for any bitch to be bred, they should have the abiltiy to better the breed. With every breeding, there is a calculated risk of the bitch not producing milk, puppies or the entire litter dying, the bitch killing the pups, the bitch dying, c-section, etc. Lots to think about, even breeding a bitch with everything picture perfect. Then there are the puppies to sell into the correct homes..................it never ends! It takes love, commitment, and dedication.

Debbie Wade
Just proves you're all trolling. I'm out for real this time.
 

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You wanted to know what it takes in our opinion to be a reputable breeder, you didn't like our opinions even with legitimate sources. You're forcing ignorance.

People can produce high quality dogs and still be unethical breeders, breeding a female dog over 8 seems very inhumane to me.

TBH your current level of maturity tells me it will be many years before you can take in new information like an adult, process it and apply it. Once you're matured it will also take a few more years of education and experience before being ready to actually purchase, raise and breed your own dogs. I'd be surprised if you will be ready to be a reputable breeder within a decade even. You might breed your dog soon, that wouldn't make you a REPUTABLE breeder.
 

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IF your dog has what it takes to title in one of the protection sports you are probably looking at 2.5-3 years at least to get her, for example, IPO1. If you paid attention to the one thread in the Schutzhund forum, most of us spend a lot of time training. Club time and personal time at least 5 days a week. Club days are literally that, DAYS, not a couple of hours. Tracking, unless you are lucky and have the land, can take a good 1-1.5 hours, depending on how close you are to tracking fields, 3-6 days a week. Obedience 10-15 minutes a day, sometimes twice a day, if you have experience. If not, you can expect to have to take classes (driving time, class time so probably 1-2 hours) at least once a week and then help at club (though most clubs do NOT teach on club day). Protection can be done once a week, but it will take far longer to achieve your goals. 2 days a week is minimum if you really want to make progress so, unless you have a flexible job, you will be gone all weekend or you will have one late night during the week (many clubs train on one weekend day and one week night).

Another option is sending your girl out to someone to title for you. I mostly don't recommend this because you have no idea how your dog will be treated. It is also very expensive and you will learn nothing yourself about your dog. This could shorten the time frame a bit since you would be removing your own inexperience from the picture (I am assuming you have never trained and titled a dog).

If you really want to become a breeder, you could find a good mentor that is familiar with buying already titled adult females, have her bred, whelp the litter and start fresh with one of her puppies. You could even work the female herself after her litter to gain more experience. This isn't a cheap way to go, but could move things along for you.

Hopefully this was more helpful.
 

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I mean like whatever you guys are saying is not even based on a concrete time in the first place. Unless you're saying it's gunna take me 5+ years to "learn and do" all the things I need to, then explain to me where you came up with such a number. Exactly, out of the blue. And if I do miss it, then so what? Let time decide that, not you assume it.

Just proves you're all trolling. I'm out for real this time.
Time from the time I started learning and researching until I bred my first litter, 13 years. And I still don't know even close to all that I need to know about everything. It's best to breed females before they get too old. You're looking at probably 3-4 years minimum to get even basic titles on her, depending on how many trials you enter and how often you go to training. Maybe even longer.


And, in the end, with this female, given her color, you won't find any responsible owners of titled proven males who would allow you to breed to their dogs. They are not going to be willing to have their name associated with anything so far out of standard.
 

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Questions

That logic doesn't hold up at all. How can you say I'm trying to breed already when I'm trying to learn how first and start doing the things I need to determine if I should first? I think it's just personal vendetta. It's always the same people saying no to me over and over, including you (some have backed off because at least now they understand I'm not breeding for the wrong reason).

It's more like, they don't want my list complete, because they don't want me to ever get to the actual breeding part. No worries, I'll do it myself.

Based on your statement, "they don't want you to try breeding until your list is complete". First of all, you say, "try breeding", which is false, because I'm not going to try until I determine if I should and do the things necessary to decide, secondly, if they don't want me to "try breeding" until my list is complete, then why not try and complete the list so I can try breeding. That doesn't add up at all.

Once again, the notion of, "you don't even know how to do it yet, so don't even try, or don't ask us."

Or, "you don't even know how to do it yet, so we're not going to tell you how until you figure it out yourself." (lol)

And you claim, the dog probably won't be ready in time, then give specifics like, the estimated amount of time it takes to do all these things, and I'm guessing you have no numbers, because it's completely based on the person and how fast they learn, their resources, training, management, ability, knowledge and experience (presuming I have none of these at all). So, I am going to pass on your 'probability' without any statistics backing it up.

Have a nice day. :)
Knowledge is power, the only dumb questionis those not asked and only ill responsible breeders don’t ask questions. Don’tstop asking because for every one person who won’t answer there are 3 thatwill-you can even ask breeders in other countries like Germany and Britain=theylove people with interests and questions.
 

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Experienced breeders and handlers have answered your questions, some with great detail. I don’t understand why you think people are telling you not to even try.
 
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