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"All carnivorous animals need meatless days each week, four days or less on meat, and one day on fluids only.

No wild dog would be able to kill prey every day of every week. Appreciating this fact, most zoos fast their animals - lions, tigers, wolves - one day per week"

as said by Juliette de Bairachli Levi, in The Complete Herbal Handbook for Farm and Stable


Anyone have a thought on this?

Must say, that I agree, but I don't care to implement. I feel as though morning and evening meals are important to allow the dog to feel rewarded for doing what we do.
 

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I fast one or two days a week. I also fast on show/training/trial mornings.

If I'm actively doing ob or tracking a dog, no breakfast - they eat during training
 

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Interesting

My Father raised GSD's when I was very young, and as far as the adults were concerned he believed that they should not eat on a regular schedule, and he would not feed one day of the week. Now before you folks start to hammer my late Father and hero, remember this was back in the 1960's and I am still amazed at the level of loyalty and training he achieved with his GSDs. I don't remember where he learned this, but it was based on the same theory you mention. "If a dog knows it's going to be fed, and knows when, it lowers their situational awareness." I remember him saying that.

Please keep in mind this man was my hero, a highly decorated Soldier and I really don't care if you think he was something else.
 

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My Father raised GSD's when I was very young, and as far as the adults were concerned he believed that they should not eat on a regular schedule, and he would not feed one day of the week.
I have heard of GSD people doing this, as well.

I also see lots of dogs on the streets being walked that could benefit from this. Lots of obese canines out there!
 

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I know that. I was wondering if there were any other reason. :)
 

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I apoligize

I apoligize for being defensive inmy previous post. I am sure folks disagree with my Fathers's methods, and that is fine, I just wanted to avoid any name calling.

I overreacted. I have never been treated badly hear, don't know why I thought otherwise.
 

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Because a hungry dog works harder.
:thumbup:
Dogs are too lazy after a meal - physiology kicks into parasympathetic mode, gut mobilizes, shut down sympathetic drives (what I want for training), and focuses the body's energy on digesting/rebuilding. Health also - don't want to stress a dog with a gut full of food to go out and work physically. Drives are generally low after a full meal.

Fasting on show/trial/training days:
I absolutely despite it when dogs poop during shows or trials. It's a simple matter that you can take care of easily prior to show time - of course some of it is inevitable (nervous eliminator or travel diarrhea), but there is really no reason for the amount of ring elimination that goes on. Annoys me to no end and my dog is not going to be in that position if I can help it!

Don't want them getting into the habit of pooping during training either - it can cost points later on during the real thing. Training is time for work, not to relax or rest or eliminate. Also, I travel long distances for training so by the time I get back home on weekends, it's usually 24h since the last feeding so some fasting is unintentional.

I also don't follow any set mealtimes - generally just sometime in the evening or night - I've fed at 3PM to as late as 2AM depending on when I get the time. I don't like the gut expecting food and I find it annoying when dogs are throwing a tantrum for food based on mealtimes.

My dogs know food is coming when I start rattling the food pans and start sounding my show whistle - otherwise, they don't go by time or when their stomachs start to anticipate food (had a couple come to me with morning bile vomiting - once I got rid of the schedule, no empty stomach vomiting).

I keep my dogs very thin and ribby so I will fast when I see one getting a little "fluffy"
 

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Thanks gbchottu. Always enjoy your indepth posts. :)
 

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I also don't follow any set mealtimes - generally just sometime in the evening or night - I've fed at 3PM to as late as 2AM depending on when I get the time. I don't like the gut expecting food and I find it annoying when dogs are throwing a tantrum for food based on mealtimes.

My dogs know food is coming when I start rattling the food pans and start sounding my show whistle - otherwise, they don't go by time or when their stomachs start to anticipate food (had a couple come to me with morning bile vomiting - once I got rid of the schedule, no empty stomach vomiting).
I am so doing this. :wild:

I will report back. Thank you! I, too, look forward to what you have to say.
 

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No prob!

Yes - the morning bile is a big reason why I hate keeping a schedule. Some dogs get this problem because they have true gut issues and have sensitives that cause them to expel bile. But the ones I've encountered have had more to do with anticipation bile rather than true GI distress.

You will notice it with your own body as well - if you eat lunch daily at 12PM, over time you notice that about half hour before mealtime: your stomach growling, the sting of acidity, rumbling as the gut starts to mobilize and churn in preparation for food, digestion enzymes already being released into the gut - same for dogs imo. If they get used to eating at the same time all the time, the gut preps for the food prior to actually seeing/smelling food based on peaks and valleys in the hormones that regulate hunger/digestion. There are some nice studies done on this for humans - studies will show that insulin and food regulation hormones Ghrelin/Leptin will have anticipatory peaks based on ingrained mealtimes. I never eat on a schedule and don't experience any gastritis commonly associated with anticipatory hunger - figured I'd do the same for my dogs. Found it worked better in all aspects.

Let me know how it goes Violet!
 

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Fasting is also used to allow the kidneys to rest from processing wastes from protein
 

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In a hurry so I am just going to go through this study I quickly found:
Spontaneous 24-h ghrelin secretion pattern in fasting subjects: maintenance of a meal-related pattern

"[Ghrelin] causes increased appetite and weight gain through increased food intake and reduced fat utilization" *so it is a hormone associated with stimulating appetite and has a correction to mealtimes*

"Interestingly, the 24-h ghrelin secretion pattern in our six fasting subjects demonstrated a similar course, with an increase at customary mealtimes and a spontaneous decrease after approximately 2 h without food consumption"

Take a look at this graph:

Spontaneous 24-h ghrelin secretion pattern in fasting subjects: maintenance of a meal-related pattern


Spontaneous 24-h ghrelin secretion pattern in fasting subjects: maintenance of a meal-related pattern
*dark line is the average - extremes shown above and below*

Notice when peak Ghrelin levels occur: 8AM (breakfast time), Noon (lunch), around 7PM (dinner). Hormones are long term regulators and do form schedules - especially for meal times. This helps the gut anticipate when food will arrive - of course far more complex, but a simple way to see this in action.
 

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Fasting is also used to allow the kidneys to rest from processing wastes from protein
Kidney is not going to shut down after one 24hr period of fasting - there is still enough being metabolized as glycogen stores are tapped into and energy stores mobilized. Filtration, resabsorption, and secretion continue to occur as the kidney acts as an important homeostatic regulator. Dog will still produce urine and kidneys continue to operate as per usual - perhaps there will be a slight changes to uric acid and creatinine levels as glomerular filtration rate drops due to fasting, but I would think this more for long term - not for single day fast for a carnivore with continued access to water.

Fasting is beneficial, but not a magical cure all as some promote.
 

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I would feel guilty eating and making Fiona fast. She is free fed while she is on kibble. She goes raw soon. Freezer being delivered today.


Sent from Petguide.com Free App
 

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My basis for feeding comes from raising horses. Some research shows that horses get stressed when they don't eat regularly and stress can cause colic. One of my big concerns is bloat in my large breed dogs. What if the stress of missing meals causes bloat. There is no research to that end (that I know of) but what if? What if hunger causes the dog to bolt its next meal? What if that causes bloat? I've read the research that wolves miss several days of food between gorging episodes. But wolves don't have a long life expectancy so they aren't the perfect model for our canines.
 

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fasting works for some dogs..if your dog has just been switched to
raw recently dont do fasting...let your dog get used to it as mentioned
by some one it can cause bloat...

so becareful make sure your dog has been atleast over a year on raw
to be able to fast....
 

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Please show evidence that fasting and bloat are correlated - this is a weighty assertion. Even after all the effort and resources poured into bloat research, we still do not know the definitive cause. Hearsay is not fact.

And btw, I would much more readily compare wolf to dog before I compare horse to dog.
 
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