Is it cruel to make my dog stay for 5+ min - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #1 of 10 (permalink) Old 08-19-2018, 08:00 PM Thread Starter
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Is it cruel to make my dog stay for 5+ min

Is it cruel to make my dog stay for 5 sometimes 10 min (even more) for every single meal?
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post #2 of 10 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 05:04 PM
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Yes in my opinion it is too long. I think the same results can be achieved in a much shorter time frame. My Baron also has to lie down before I put his food on the floor for him to eat. Long down stays can be practiced outside of meal time.
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post #3 of 10 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 05:15 PM
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My initial thought was to say yes, because I don't "play" games with food. But the after thinking about it a bit more, if this is a routine you establish I think your dog just adapts to it.

That being said, it's not something I'd ever do. What is it that you're trying to teach the dog by doing this?
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post #4 of 10 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 05:23 PM
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It's not cruel, but what is the point? When I work with my dogs I try to balance fair and necessary. If I needed my dog to hold a long down stay for some reason then it would be necessary to teach that. If my dog is simply a companion and needs to understand what stay means then I can accomplish that in a minute or two.
Also I don't like making my dogs work excessively for a basic need. I used to work with a lady who only fed her dog what he "earned" through the day, so his entire existence was working for 1 piece of kibble at a time. I may use a small portion of my dogs daily ration as training treats but her meals are a basic need and withholding them is in my mind unfair. If your dog isn't attempting to snatch it's food then there is nothing to be gained by making them wait.
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post #5 of 10 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 05:38 PM Thread Starter
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Well I want my dog to stay for long periods of time. I hear other owners can get their dog to stay 30 min, but to establish that I need to get him to stay for 1 min first, then 2, then 3, then 4, then 5, then 6 etc.
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post #6 of 10 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 06:43 PM
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You can easily build up duration without waiting for his food. i think it is not fair and I will never push them like that. Just for the heck of it, let someone have you wait for 5 minutes before you can touch your food when you are hungry and bored (given that it is in front of you).
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post #7 of 10 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 06:46 PM
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I wouldn't do this when serving them their food.

I DO expect my dog to sit calmly and wait when their food is being served, so I don't get run over as they dash to the bowl. but they are released as soon as they are calm, and focus on my face instead of the food bowl.

I am training for IPO, and my dog has to remain in a down while another dog is on the field, but this is for about 10 minutes, and no food is involved.
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post #8 of 10 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 07:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jon Yau View Post
Well I want my dog to stay for long periods of time. I hear other owners can get their dog to stay 30 min, but to establish that I need to get him to stay for 1 min first, then 2, then 3, then 4, then 5, then 6 etc.
Yeah, essentially you have the right idea, but I would be concerned with creating a resource gaurder by combining this training with mealtimes! Better to teach stay away from mealtimes using high value treats or a toy and praise as a reward!

Also, stay has 2 dimensions, distance and duration. I like to start with distance, as it keeps the dog more focused, and increasing distance also gradually increases duration. With my pup we practiced this in her nightly training sessions, sort of combining it with practice heeling. As we walked around the house, I'd stop at different locations and have her down, then continue to walk away, gradually increasing the distance I'd go before returning to treat and praise her. After awhile practicing that way, she would stay dependably even if I briefly left the room. Then, with me still in sight I'd started upping the duration. At first, I'd return multiple times to reward and praise her before releasing her from the stay. The main thing is training has to be incremental, and set up in such a way as to make the dog successful MOST of the time! And remember, it takes lots of practice and repetitions for a dog to be able to go 30 minutes...

Good Luck!
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post #9 of 10 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 07:43 PM
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Agreed. For meal times, I just get my dog to sit, maybe spin. But that's it. I get the idea, but it wouldn't have involved a meal. When I train my dog to stay for long periods of time it's probably for treats. I have him stay too when I'm doing my laundry etc.
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post #10 of 10 (permalink) Old 08-21-2018, 11:13 AM
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My dog does an informal down-stay in kitchen for 20-30 minutes every night when I am making dinner. He would always come over and hover when he smelled food, so if he laid down instead of standing near me, I would give him a little tidbit and say "Good!" (at random intervals, like whenever I would glance over). I did not really care, but I didn't want him to get in the habit of standing behind me all the time. Now it seems that he has a habit of the long downstay, and it is "finished" when I put down his bowl. We humans eat dinner too, then.

Could he do this on an obedience field? No!
But I don't care, I just like that he stays out of the way while I"m cooking and I don't have to worry about tripping over him while carrying a hot pan.

Rumo ~ rescue shepherd/husky mix
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