Stay as a Unique Command? - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #1 of 13 (permalink) Old 09-02-2013, 08:44 PM Thread Starter
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Stay as a Unique Command?

What are your views about the 'stay' command? I am increasingly seeing advice to get rid of it and instead make sit/down/stand mean to stay put until released. I think the logic makes sense and have seen wonderful demonstrations of it but I know the other one does also work.

My older dog has been taught the stay command and now that I have a puppy I am wondering if I should try the other method with her.

Thoughts? Opinions? Stay philosophies you want to share?

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post #2 of 13 (permalink) Old 09-02-2013, 08:59 PM
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Sit/Down mean do this until I give another command. I might call for a Front or I might go back and heal her off.

Stay means do not move until I come back to you. Stay means stop right where you are and do not go anywhere else.




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post #3 of 13 (permalink) Old 09-02-2013, 09:07 PM Thread Starter
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Yes, that reminds me of another method I know of where;
stay = wait for me to come back to you, and
wait = wait until I tell you to do something else

And if it matters, I am training for competitive obedience but I'd love to hear what people are doing regardless and what works for them (or doesn't).

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post #4 of 13 (permalink) Old 09-02-2013, 09:42 PM
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i think no matter what command you're teaching once your dog is performing the command he or she waits for the next command
without moving.
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post #5 of 13 (permalink) Old 09-02-2013, 10:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaun View Post
Yes, that reminds me of another method I know of where;
stay = wait for me to come back to you, and
wait = wait until I tell you to do something else
This is how I was "trained to train", and I find it useful. When I put a dog in a stay I have no problem with him not keeping his full attention on me. So long as he doesn't move he's welcome to watch the clouds if he wants. I consider it a relaxed state. When I put a dog in a wait I expect him to watch me carefully for the next command and be in an active, alert state.

What bugs me the most is when people tell their dogs to 'stay' with no intention of requiring them to actually stay. Like when they head out the door for work and say "Fido, STAY" when they actually mean "Fido, don't follow me out the door". There's no way they can expect that dog to hold a position on the other side of the door for an 8 hour workday. Then they're confused when the dog only holds a 'stay' command for 30 seconds and hops up during training!


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post #6 of 13 (permalink) Old 09-03-2013, 09:06 AM
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I have never used either stay or wait. Sit, down or stand means until I give you another command or until I release you. I may give command from far away or walk back and ditto for release.

Don't see the reason for adding in 2 extra commands that each mean something a little different. Seems confusing for me and the dog
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post #7 of 13 (permalink) Old 09-03-2013, 11:59 AM
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My position on this one has changed over time (fortunately slowly enough that it hasn't confused my poor dogs too much).

I used to add "Stay" as a double command after every position change, so it would be "Sit-Stay" or "Down-Stay" or whatever. I didn't have a particular reason for doing it this way, it was just a habit I developed.

In some competition venues, you get dinged for that because it's considered a double command, so I stopped doing it that way and cleaned up my cues to a single command. Now the "Stay" is implied, so I usually just give the position cue (sometimes I have to add a "Stay" for clarity depending on the exercise, as it's not 100% faded yet and can be helpful depending on the total context of what we're working on).

I still teach and use "Stay" separately to mean "freeze right now in whatever position you're in, and don't move" because I find that helpful for getting the Stand out of Motion (it can be tricky to differentiate from a default Sit otherwise) and also when the dogs happen to be in an arrangement and position that I want to photograph while out hiking. I haven't yet gotten to the point where they will freeze perfectly -- they tend to settle into the nearest taught position equivalent -- but it's a goal that I work toward sporadically. We may or may not ever get there, I dunno.

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post #8 of 13 (permalink) Old 09-03-2013, 01:23 PM
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My training is only for a well behaved dog, so using "stay" as a double command works very well for me. I can mix it up with other words or phrases that my dog knows, such as "in your bed," "in the house," "quiet," "down," "here," etc...almost as though I'm actually teaching my dog English, lol. I would rather use it this way, because otherwise I'd have to constantly be using a release word. I think if this were the case, the dog would always be anticipating the release, rather than just following direction.
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post #9 of 13 (permalink) Old 09-03-2013, 04:16 PM
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I started with "stay" and "wait" commands but am trying to phase "stay" out. I still like to use "wait" for times when I am going to have her do something else in a few seconds...like when we are playing fetch and she is jumping around trying to get the ball or I have her sit, and she is all pumped up wanting to get the ball, but I want her to wait for the "go get it" command. I guess I could probably do without "wait" but it seems to be a kind of "settle down for a second" command.

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post #10 of 13 (permalink) Old 09-03-2013, 05:09 PM
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I use Stay when I want him to remain in his last position. No excuses, he is NOT allowed to change position.
Wait for him means either I have some new instruction coming or I want him to wait until I can catch up. He may do anything while he waits as long as he doesn't bugger off and ignore me.
Im all about having a formal cue that's impressive and solid (Stay) and a more relaxed cue that's comfortable and relaxed (Wait).
I always follow up sit/down with another cue... sometimes its a stay command, sometimes its a ready command... but I have tendency to give my dog a TON of information even if its not always necessary.
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