I dont like this type of training..... - German Shepherd Dog Forums
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 25 (permalink) Old 03-25-2011, 12:01 AM Thread Starter
New Member
 
GuardianShep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 22
I dont like this type of training.....

I downloaded a training session video, and saw that the two germans they were showing are very obedient and focussed, but, i felt that there were not dogs..they have become semi-robots.they obey every command to the word, they are always looking the trainer,eagerly waiting for him to utter the next command.. as soon as he commands,at that instant, they both hurry to obey that whther it be 'sit','stay',crawl,run,fetch,jump hurdles,do hurdle track..anything they have been trained in..
this video was not a k9 or a police training session.

i appreciate such methods of training for working dogs-search and rescue,to help people with disability,army/police dogs.. where they will be mentally and physically working to the 99% efficiency. other that these working dog scenarios, i dont think a dog must be trained to be like a robot. the dog must be left to be himself, be a dog, use his brain instead of obeying the word his trainer says.

i dont know how it is with others. but, with me, i have had two GSD,and i have a 2.5month old male GSD puppy now. (ill not talk bout the puppy now as he s still in his learning phase. lets talk bout the older ones) my older GSDs came to my house as puppys, done a lot of destruction(landshark), been socialised extremely well, and they both (even my current puppy) is taught only two commands - sit, no.

sit is the first command which i teach.its not like a command, we do that word casually, and let him understand that we(i and my mom) are the controllers of anything - playtime,water fun,..anything at all..later on, i never have to use sit command, he knows.ive always wondered how they know..

no is the only command i use to control my dog. 'no' means = stop doing what he s doing. whther it be barking,diggin,biting,fighting,tugging,chewing...
both my elder dogs were socialised well, and are great with kids(i have lot of kids staying nearby who come to our house to play - we are the one with a german ) the dogs, both were protective of our territory and more protective when the kids are here. they both played continuously with the kids but ALWAYS had an eye on the kids, and the world outside. i felt very safe bout leaving the kids with my dogs outside playing while i am inside. our property is fenced - so no one will go out. anything other than that, my dogs knew how to take care. they can be submissive, and commandeering at the same time.

they both were all that a german shepherd needs to be(these are the certain subtle things which awed me.. the more i think bout them, the more i love geman shepherds). and i hope my current puppy will grow up to be like them.

i dont know how they understood all those small things..i never taught them much..they were left to learn on their own. and thats why i never like those dogs who are eagerly looking at the lips of their master waiting to obey anything his master says..

i have read that 'positive reinforcement'(i dont remember whether this is the right name) is a good method - appreciate and encourage good behaviour. i came to know that this is what i actually unknowingly did with my dogs. its not actually a command-obey thing.. its somthing what we unknowingly do with our children. never command, but, whenever the dog does an act that is expected of him, praise him. then the dog will try to do the same if the same situation arises anytime later.


im sorry to have made this long..
i certainly would love to know what others think on this matter and how you have trained your german. please comment and educate me..i might be able to train my current puppy better
thanks for reading

-Bruno-Aug 2, 2007 - July 24, 2009
-Ricky-Aug 16, 2009 - February 28, 2010
-Rocky-Dec 30, 2011
I don't have a heart. Its with my dog..
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

Last edited by GuardianShep; 03-25-2011 at 12:09 AM.
GuardianShep is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 25 (permalink) Old 03-25-2011, 12:09 AM
Crowned Member
 
KZoppa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Colorado
Posts: 19,159
i personally prefer my dogs be as trained as i can possibly get them. I shouldnt have to repeat a command which our male has always had issue with. I dont want robot dogs but i want the dogs who listen and are behaved and obey the first time. I want the dog i can totally trust 150% to obey no matter what. Its for their safety and those around them. I dont need them by my side waiting for my next command but they are expected to listen and obey when they are told to do something. Beyond that, they're dogs. They can be dogs.

Shasta GSD 5/5/10 CGC, ITD, TC
"Dax" Thor z vom Weberhaus BCAT CAX2 CGCA ETD HCT NCO-1 PKD-T RATI RATN RA TC TKA 3/18/2013
"Hades" Guilty vom Blutfeuer 10/26/2018
Zena GSD 6/1/03-2/16/2016
Riley GSD/BC 1/10/05-2/1/2013
KZoppa is offline  
post #3 of 25 (permalink) Old 03-25-2011, 12:29 AM
Master Member
 
DunRingill's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Somerset, NJ
Posts: 675
Quote:
Originally Posted by jebinelias View Post
i certainly would love to know what others think on this matter and how you have trained your german. please comment and educate me..i might be able to train my current puppy better
thanks for reading
Nope, you really don't want to know what I think......see I have a bunch of those obedience-trained dogs who like to watch me so they can stay actively involved in whatever game we're playing. No robots here, just a bunch of well-trained dogs.

Believe it or not, good training at a high level is GOOD for dogs, and improves your relationship with your dog.


--Regina and the GSDs:
UCDX von Sontausen Holy Grail (The BUNNY!) HGH, UD,RA,BN,GN, ASCA UD RAX High in Trial
PAM Monster Mike SchH2,UDX,OM1,TD,RE,VER
PAM FGDCh Ianna von Sontausen UDX,BH,TD,RE,PT (4.26.1998 - 2.11.2013)
DunRingill is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4 of 25 (permalink) Old 03-25-2011, 12:31 AM
Crowned Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 4,832
Quote:
Originally Posted by jebinelias View Post
I downloaded a training session video, and saw that the two germans they were showing are very obedient and focussed, but, i felt that there were not dogs..they have become semi-robots.they obey every command to the word, they are always looking the trainer,eagerly waiting for him to utter the next command.. as soon as he commands,at that instant, they both hurry to obey that whther it be 'sit','stay',crawl,run,fetch,jump hurdles,do hurdle track..anything they have been trained in..
this video was not a k9 or a police training session.
They sound like happy, well trained dogs. This is how I want my dogs to be. Just because they are drivey and focused while being worked, does not mean they don't get to hang out and be just goofy dogs when not being worked.

Elaine and the herd
Elaine is offline  
post #5 of 25 (permalink) Old 03-25-2011, 12:45 AM
Crowned Member
 
Samba's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: USA
Posts: 6,601
It is called engagement and focus and can be very useful when a complex routine is coordinated between dog and handler. This really can't be compared to interacting in household living with the dogs.

Yes, you are right. One way of helping to reinforce desirable household behavior is to catch the dog doing something right and praise it. Positive reinforcement can train a good number of things.
Samba is offline  
post #6 of 25 (permalink) Old 03-25-2011, 12:48 AM
Crowned Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Oregon
Posts: 15,785
"They sound like happy, well trained dogs. This is how I want my dogs to be. Just because they are drivey and focused while being worked, does not mean they don't get to hang out and be just goofy dogs when not being worked."

Yes, when I am working my dog, when I toss in some obedience in our walks, I want a whole lotta focus and a whole lotta response. Snappy responses are great!

The dog's attitude is best when it is "I know this! This gets her what she wants and me what I want!" To me it's striving toward mutual rewards.
middleofnowhere is offline  
post #7 of 25 (permalink) Old 03-26-2011, 01:36 AM Thread Starter
New Member
 
GuardianShep's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Posts: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by DunRingill View Post
...... who like to watch me so they can stay actively involved in whatever game we're playing. No robots here, just a bunch of well-trained dogs.

.......

Believe it or not, good training at a high level is GOOD for dogs, and improves your relationship with your dog.
i get your point.
in the end,no one is right and no one is wrong completely.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Samba View Post
It is called engagement and focus and can be very useful when a complex routine is coordinated between dog and handler. This really can't be compared to interacting in household living with the dogs.
hmm.yeah.hav seen such action in first hand as i have a police canine training academy near my home.their job demands such attention.yes,it cant be compared to house training or agility.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samba View Post
Yes, you are right. One way of helping to reinforce desirable household behavior is to catch the dog doing something right and praise it. Positive reinforcement can train a good number of things.
i didnt know this was what i was doing untill i read it somewhere.works great with the dogs ive interacted with.




Quote:
Originally Posted by middleofnowhere View Post
Yes, when I am working my dog, when I toss in some obedience in our walks, I want a whole lotta focus and a whole lotta response. Snappy responses are great!

The dog's attitude is best when it is "I know this! This gets her what she wants and me what I want!" To me it's striving toward mutual rewards.
'I' think that getting a dog to think like that "ill get what i want when i do what he wants" will make him reward oriented. so, i guess, we can agree to disagree..

-Bruno-Aug 2, 2007 - July 24, 2009
-Ricky-Aug 16, 2009 - February 28, 2010
-Rocky-Dec 30, 2011
I don't have a heart. Its with my dog..
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
GuardianShep is offline  
post #8 of 25 (permalink) Old 03-26-2011, 09:00 AM
Crowned Member
 
Dainerra's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: N. Central Arkansas
Posts: 6,694
Quote:
Originally Posted by jebinelias View Post
'I' think that getting a dog to think like that "ill get what i want when i do what he wants" will make him reward oriented. so, i guess, we can agree to disagree..
for most of our dogs, the "reward" they want is praise from their owners! A pat on the head or a "good dog" is also something I'm happy to give. My dog will even work for a smile - he loves to make me happy. Some people hear "reward" and automatically assume that the dog is working for treats.
Dainerra is offline  
post #9 of 25 (permalink) Old 03-26-2011, 09:27 AM
The Administrator from the Great White North, eh?
 
Castlemaid's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Northern British Columbia
Posts: 16,991
Another reward that dogs will work for is interaction and attention from you.

When I started classes, I thought teaching my dog to pay attention to me was the most brilliant thing I have ever heard!!
Genius!! Just love it!

Lucia


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
2009-2018

Keeta BH, OB1, TR1, AD
Rottweiler/Hairy Dog mix?? 2004-2015
Castlemaid is offline  
post #10 of 25 (permalink) Old 03-26-2011, 09:45 AM
Knighted Member
 
WildWolf's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Canada
Posts: 3,171
A well-trained dog with a job is a happy, healthy canine!

Training has numerous benefits. You should always strive to challenge and stimulate your dog's mind, body and spirit. Just like people, dogs need to work to feel good about themselves and drain energy. Certain commands people train their dogs helps keep them safe, as well. Take the 'recall' for example - if you are out and about and your dog runs in the direction of traffic, a recall keeps him safe and alive.

Dogs are domesticated animals, which means that they were bred by humans to be a certain way. This breeding makes dogs want to be with us, to please us, and to work for us. It makes them happy. As for the highly trained/highly focused working dogs - as long as they come home every night and curl up with their family I think they are okay. Usually, those highly trained animals have a lot of 'off' time to just be a dog.

SG S-Hunter vom Geistwasser CA CGN TT ATD (Service Dog, Retired Airport Wildlife Control K9)
Zenna vom Geistwasser NTD


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
WildWolf is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the German Shepherd Dog Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome