House training a pup that is too smart - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #1 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-08-2018, 12:13 PM Thread Starter
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House training a pup that is too smart

I have trained dogs for years. BIg dogs, little dogs. Smart dogs, dumb dogs. But NEVER have I encountered a Genali. For the first time in my life I am having house breaking woes. Now, let's get this clear right off the bat......you may not laugh at me. I have been outsmarted by an 8 week old pup.

Routine: SHe is taken out about every hour during the day when I am off. On the days that I work, she is taken out every 3 hours. If she pottys outside, we have lots of joy, praise and a kibble. If she does not potty, she goes into the crate until she is able to potty outside. We do not play outside until she has done her business.

Before our vet visit, she was "getting it" and was starting to ask to go out. But, she was a little lethargic after her vaccination, AND it was cold and rainy. So, she didn't have a lot of motivation to go out. When I did force her to go outside, she would pull back to the house, and it took FOREVER to potty because all she wanted was to go back in.

Easy fix. I used a high value treat when she succeeded, and for the rest of the day, she went right out and did her business quickly so that she could have that treat. I was working so well, that I just continued the small bite of cheese every time she went potty outside.

Sounds great, right? Yeah. You haven't met my pup.

So we went out this morning, and she peed right off, and got her cheese and praise. Then, she pooped, and got more cheese and praise.

THEN, she squatted and pretended to pee, and asked for her treat. She didn't get one. (She is truly faking, no troubles with urination). Now, everytime we go out, she will potty get her treat and try to trick me into giving her another one. The little snot.

I have never had a dog do this. I am a little freaked out at her intelligence, she does some other things that just amaze me. Anyway, long story short, my little angel is a lying snot! Have any of you encountered this type of behavior before? Good grief, I have resorted to checking to make sure that the grass is wet before she gets her treat, which of course delays the giving of the treat, which in turn minimizes its effect. Suggestions?
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post #2 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-08-2018, 12:24 PM
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Sounds normal to me. Stand your ground or find really low cal treats. I use baby carrots.
Shadow was taught to go to the mat by the door on command. I accomplished this with treats. Now she thinks if she wants a treat she can just go sit on her mat.
All of my dogs have tried the fake pee thing.
Sabi was trained for drug detection. I had neighbors who smoked pot. Sabi would amuse herself endlessly by going and indicating on their patio table, since we rewarded her with treats. She was also fond of city buses, bus stops and the local 7-11. Lol.
They are smart and very manipulative.
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Last edited by Sabis mom; 04-08-2018 at 12:25 PM. Reason: sp.
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post #3 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-08-2018, 01:50 PM
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so funny, because many of us truly understand.
My little gal-dog used to pee in her crate because it meant I would take her out. It took me a couple of days to learn to clean her crate and put her right back into it. That stopped that nonsense and in turn she spent less in the crate over all.

I've not had fake pee. I have had my boy grab my shoe or tug on my pants to tell me he needed to go out. And we just thought he was being a lunk head until he wet the floor.
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post #4 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-08-2018, 03:21 PM
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Yes,I can relate!Both of mine will fake pee sometimes.I had a sheltie years ago who would ask to go out whenever he wanted anything at all.He knew if I heard him scratch the door it would get my attention immediately.Little devils,lol!
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post #5 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-08-2018, 05:54 PM
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yeah well I would say that YOU have to be responsive TO the dog ,
not hard-condition a dog to an hourly outing which is not something that you can sustain for the next
how many years , 10 or with hope more?

the dog has to have the feeling of some bladder sensation , the bladder should be full -- be taught to hold it and feel the need and communicate it to you

if you take her out on a by the clock routine and she has no need to go she is crated until such time?
as she matures she may only need to eliminate once or twice for the entire day -

the dry squatting ? Make sure there isn't a mild bladder infection .
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post #6 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-08-2018, 06:39 PM
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The treats cause this problem, completely normal pup. I once was asked to help a lady with a Westie with the same problem. Dozens of times needed to go out, only to squat in order to earn a treat.
I mark the pee and pooping as soon as urine or stool appears with "Go Potty" a few times before the sphincter closes in order for the correct timing. Within two weeks they get it. No treat, no celebration; just associating the command with the action. And yes, Like Carmen said, increase bladder control.
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Last edited by wolfy dog; 04-08-2018 at 06:41 PM.
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post #7 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-08-2018, 08:14 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by carmspack View Post
yeah well I would say that YOU have to be responsive TO the dog ,
not hard-condition a dog to an hourly outing which is not something that you can sustain for the next
how many years , 10 or with hope more?

the dog has to have the feeling of some bladder sensation , the bladder should be full -- be taught to hold it and feel the need and communicate it to you

if you take her out on a by the clock routine and she has no need to go she is crated until such time?
as she matures she may only need to eliminate once or twice for the entire day -

the dry squatting ? Make sure there isn't a mild bladder infection .
No, it won't be a long term thing. She has some frequency right now due to a mild case of vaginitis. We were at the vet on Friday, no infection, just irritation that we think stems from her desire to "belly rub" on the grass (I have cleaned grass out of it twice now). She is only 8 weeks, so I can't really expect her to hold it too long, even without an irritated vagina.

She is communicating her needs pretty good, by going to the door. I use "potty bells" on my door, and she nosed her bell for the first time tonight!
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post #8 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-08-2018, 08:17 PM Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Sabis mom View Post
Sounds normal to me. Stand your ground or find really low cal treats. I use baby carrots.
Shadow was taught to go to the mat by the door on command. I accomplished this with treats. Now she thinks if she wants a treat she can just go sit on her mat.
All of my dogs have tried the fake pee thing.
Sabi was trained for drug detection. I had neighbors who smoked pot. Sabi would amuse herself endlessly by going and indicating on their patio table, since we rewarded her with treats. She was also fond of city buses, bus stops and the local 7-11. Lol.
They are smart and very manipulative.
I have a friend who has a male that has been trained for drug detection. Last time I was over there, the dog indicated on ME! Talk about your awkward moment. Fortunately, her owners knows what I do for a living, and understood that I handle pot, meth, cocaine etc at work on a regular basis. lol
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post #9 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-08-2018, 08:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Genalis_mom View Post
No, it won't be a long term thing. She has some frequency right now due to a mild case of vaginitis. We were at the vet on Friday, no infection, just irritation that we think stems from her desire to "belly rub" on the grass (I have cleaned grass out of it twice now). She is only 8 weeks, so I can't really expect her to hold it too long, even without an irritated vagina.

She is communicating her needs pretty good, by going to the door. I use "potty bells" on my door, and she nosed her bell for the first time tonight!
With being sick (I think you said she had giardia) I would expect potty training to take just a little longer.. my boy had giardia too and was drinking a ridiculous amount of water to try to compensate. We could tell he "got it" because he started nosing the potty bells too but sometimes his little bladder just couldn't make it down three flights of stairs. We had to take him out every 15 minutes for a few weeks (I kept a timer on my phone and reset it after every trip.) since he was drinking so much extra water. This didn't hinder the potty training process at all, he was successfully house broken after a couple weeks. Took much longer than my past 8 week old puppies though who understood it from day one and never had an accident again until they died. Does your pup seem really thirsty ?
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post #10 of 14 (permalink) Old 04-08-2018, 09:16 PM
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I am having the same problem. My new female puppy is coming up on 9 weeks and is being an absolute terror with peeing .... every 15 minutes. She seems to be doing it out of spite. There is no safe place on the floor unless it's covered with a training pad. She done an excellent job avoiding those. My previous shepherds were very responsive to potty training. This will is actively engaged in a battle of wills. She's learned to not give any signals now. She just does kamikaze attacks now. I'm not sure what to do about this. I'm catching a lot of heat from the family over this.

BTW, she is not displaying any signs of a UTI. She has two modes: sleep and psycho. She is very active in psycho mode node and this causes her to drink a lot which seems to be producing the frequent peeing. She understands "Outside" and "Potty" commands. But that's the extent of the potty training she's accepted.
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