Becoming a breeder the right way....I hope - Page 4 - German Shepherd Dog Forums
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post #31 of 42 (permalink) Old 06-27-2016, 06:21 PM
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I apologize for the tone of my earlier post. I was having a bad morning, and took it out on an internet post where it appeared to me that someone who is legitimately trying to learn was being ridiculed. Again, I'm sorry for my earlier attitude. I am not a breeder, but have recently been through the arduous process of weeding out bad breeders to choose my current puppy, and would really like to see more people who care about the breed learn about breeding the right way.

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post #32 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-20-2016, 03:11 PM
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Being student of the breed is very important.

"...Kennel blindness is a hard disease to cure..." quote by Ingrid strom in a interview to Indian kennel Gazette, is true for any breed and any prospective breeder.

Our breed is now split into two types, viz. Working and Show-line (within show line the the WGSL and American show lines are entirely different).

So one needs to be very clear in the head with his/her breeding goal.
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post #33 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-20-2016, 10:54 PM
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The best way to learn about this breed is to train SEVERAL dogs of different lines to titles....to study pedigrees of every dog you see that you can get your hands on.....to go to trials - local, regional, national - and study the dogs, the pedigrees and to talk to many breeders, and try to put together the info you gather to the dogs you see and pedigrees you study......

I don't think you can do this in a year.

It is great that you have the resources to put together an impressive facility. I wish I had that facility and the financial resources behind it Unfortunately, too many people mistake a fancy physical plant for quality and knowledge......see Carmen's post.....I seriously think it takes years to even start to recognize and understand what makes a good dog, and what risks are inherent in a breeding....two or three litters a year is NOT a "small" or a hobby breeder....that is 10 to 20 puppies to place responsibly in homes that are appropriate for each individual puppy.....another task that is NOT easy.....it also takes years and litters that produce dogs who get titled to start to attract customers who are educated in the breed and who want a puppy from YOU specifically.....


This will take alot more than a year if you want to "do it right" - breeding is much much more than building a facility....


Lee

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post #34 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-21-2016, 03:28 PM
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Of course if you wait until you have all the experience, set up, time, and have studied the breed and pedigrees until you are ready, then you will be too old to physically keep up with all the training and work involved. And, you will still be a novice because, you really can't read a book about some of this stuff and be an expert. It takes hands-on experience. You have to get your feet wet, prove to some people that you are serious, before you can even get the information that you will find you need.

I agree with training dogs and working with dogs of different lines. And certainly, as a breeder you have to become somewhat an expert on training and behavior. And, yes it doesn't happen overnight. But when you are done learning, you might as well throw in the towel on breeding as well.

Breeding is constant improvement. Breeders have to suck up knowledge about their dogs, the breed, other dogs, like sponges. They have to try new things, and learn from them. Yes it is good to begin with a solid foundation. But with anything, the more you learn, the more you learn you need to know.

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post #35 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-21-2016, 03:44 PM
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And sometimes you have to admit you aren't going anywhere with what you have in your dogs and start all over.
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post #36 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-21-2016, 10:01 PM
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If you want to learn and put in the effort, it won't take a lifetime. Problem is most people are lazy and want to just start making puppies. Spend the time. The breed will be better off in the long run.

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post #37 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-22-2016, 12:40 AM
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My advise is to find a great breeder to take you under their wing.

When I started bird breeding I found it very hard to find anyone to really teach me or even talk to me about it. Everyone wanted to keep things a secrete. I was lucky enough to find someone who shared everything with me nutrition, what really to look out for. There where hours upon hours of teaching. Honestly more like years of learning. She actually became my very best friend. She died today. We where very good friends of over 10 years.

She used to be a pet store owner in a small town and she learned quite a bit from the vet that was nearby. People that are in it for the money you do not even want to speak to them. They will more likely take shortcuts trying to make a buck instead of trying to do what is best for the breed and overall health of not only your breeders but your babies as well.

I know nothing of breeding dogs. I do know the extreme about of hours I spent doing things the right way. Not the cost efficient way. I have even spent quite a bit of money on books that Avian vets use. Good books are rarely cheap and hard to get especially with birds.

Not to mention the equipment that was needed and the willingness to get up and feed a baby bird every hour on the hour when first born when a new set of bird parents didn't seem to be feeding their babies. Staying up till 2 or 3 in the morning dealing with an egg bound breeder searching all over the internet for a good video to show how to do it right because my dear friend was in another state.
It takes 3 generations to breed out nutritionally caused diseases so you have to start with the healthiest and keep them that way.

No matter how long or how much you think you have learned there are so many variables that go on when things can, will, and do go wrong. It is not an idea to take on lightly it will consume your life more than a full time job sometimes for months. Which means you can't be free to go off to see someone or take a vacation if things are needed during that time. You have to have someone besides just you that you can count on if you get sick or just need to go out once and a while. That person for me was my daughter. I would trust her with any bird I had hand-feeding and that is saying something because you can easily kill them if you send their food down the wrong pipe. One of them is for air and one to the crop. And guess what talk to enough breeders and you will find that sometimes their pipes are opposite and if you do not go slow at the beginning so you can see which way it is going down you could end up killing the baby.

YEA YEA birds not dogs. My belief was if I was going to breed them I was going to do it right. Fresh veggies, apple-cider vinegar in their water everyday just to name a few. The passion and energy you will spend if you love them and want to do right by them take what you think it will take and multiply it a few times. There is a lot to things and some you have to learn as you go. Trust your gut when you are not sure. Because no one seems to have an emergency during the day always in the middle of the night when you are all alone trying to save a life.

The more people that will open up and show you what and how's they do will help you learn what to try and what to stay away from.

Just really think about it in ten years how old and what part of life will you be in? Because it takes time getting a great reputation just to find yourself in a different phase of life where you might need to quit when you are just getting going.

Now if after thinking about this you are still considering it I would really check into learning about feeding them the raw diet. That I know nothing of.
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post #38 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-22-2016, 09:50 AM
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OP: If you are thinking of becoming a show line breeder. Read the
The German Shepherd Dog - Welcome to my Website - The German Shepherd Dog articles from
Louis is an SV judge and a great ambassador of the breed. He has explained the engineering of the anatomy of a gsd.

Read and read his articles again and again and train your eyes on the all the show dogs you can come across.

For a show line breeder anatomy is the most important objective.

However, if you want to go for working line breeding there is no way other than enrolling for a dog trainer's program. Then you need an experienced mentor.
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post #39 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-22-2016, 12:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CarrieJo View Post
My advise is to find a great breeder to take you under their wing.

When I started bird breeding I found it very hard to find anyone to really teach me or even talk to me about it. Everyone wanted to keep things a secrete. I was lucky enough to find someone who shared everything with me nutrition, what really to look out for. There where hours upon hours of teaching. Honestly more like years of learning. She actually became my very best friend. She died today. We where very good friends of over 10 years.

She used to be a pet store owner in a small town and she learned quite a bit from the vet that was nearby. People that are in it for the money you do not even want to speak to them. They will more likely take shortcuts trying to make a buck instead of trying to do what is best for the breed and overall health of not only your breeders but your babies as well.

I know nothing of breeding dogs. I do know the extreme about of hours I spent doing things the right way. Not the cost efficient way. I have even spent quite a bit of money on books that Avian vets use. Good books are rarely cheap and hard to get especially with birds.

Not to mention the equipment that was needed and the willingness to get up and feed a baby bird every hour on the hour when first born when a new set of bird parents didn't seem to be feeding their babies. Staying up till 2 or 3 in the morning dealing with an egg bound breeder searching all over the internet for a good video to show how to do it right because my dear friend was in another state.
It takes 3 generations to breed out nutritionally caused diseases so you have to start with the healthiest and keep them that way.

No matter how long or how much you think you have learned there are so many variables that go on when things can, will, and do go wrong. It is not an idea to take on lightly it will consume your life more than a full time job sometimes for months. Which means you can't be free to go off to see someone or take a vacation if things are needed during that time. You have to have someone besides just you that you can count on if you get sick or just need to go out once and a while. That person for me was my daughter. I would trust her with any bird I had hand-feeding and that is saying something because you can easily kill them if you send their food down the wrong pipe. One of them is for air and one to the crop. And guess what talk to enough breeders and you will find that sometimes their pipes are opposite and if you do not go slow at the beginning so you can see which way it is going down you could end up killing the baby.

YEA YEA birds not dogs. My belief was if I was going to breed them I was going to do it right. Fresh veggies, apple-cider vinegar in their water everyday just to name a few. The passion and energy you will spend if you love them and want to do right by them take what you think it will take and multiply it a few times. There is a lot to things and some you have to learn as you go. Trust your gut when you are not sure. Because no one seems to have an emergency during the day always in the middle of the night when you are all alone trying to save a life.

The more people that will open up and show you what and how's they do will help you learn what to try and what to stay away from.

Just really think about it in ten years how old and what part of life will you be in? Because it takes time getting a great reputation just to find yourself in a different phase of life where you might need to quit when you are just getting going.

Now if after thinking about this you are still considering it I would really check into learning about feeding them the raw diet. That I know nothing of.
What type of birds were you breeding?

Moriah
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post #40 of 42 (permalink) Old 10-22-2016, 01:00 PM
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When I wanted to be an obedience instructor and to teach herding, because I had done it with my dogs and loved, I became an apprentice. Old fashioned word, but it is what it is. When I got into the dog show scene, I found several people to help me. First and foremost, you have to be open about wanting to do it the right way and open to listening and following what they tell you. My openness to doing it the right way had people putting their dogs up on tables and going over them, showing me what was correct and what needed to be improved, etc.. Having a great facility is nice, but you'll find most keep their dogs in their house, their pets, not just something for breeding. Some get the point where they need the facility, it's then gone beyond the hobby sport and into a business. But the good ones are still out there training and competing. They don't get to this point in time until they have proven themselves and have a track record of doing a very good job in what they do. Basically, you're putting the cart before the horse. I'd suggest to slow down, live with your dogs, train your dogs, don't worry about breeding and a facility yet. If you work and train and gain the respect of the others working in the field with you when it's time to breed they'll help you. Eventually, if you do it right, you'll need that facility, but now is not the time. JMHO
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